Car Wont Start/Ignition Switch Issue?

[mranderson214]

Hey Everyone,

This forum has always lead me to the right place in the past, I'm confident that it can again. I have an '02 Explorer XLT, with about 182K miles on it, V6, 4x4 etc. Recently, I encountered some starting trouble.

Back in November, I came out to the parking lot and the car refused to start. I know starting is one of those complex areas so I'll elaborate on what I mean.

I got in, turned the key past the "run" position but nothing happened. No cranks from the engine at all. The headlights, wipers, high beans, radio, interior lights etc all worked fine. No dimness at all. All lights worked on the dashboard etc. When I turned the key all the way back to start the engine, I'd just head one click (which sounded like the starter). Each time I tried to start, it just did one click. This is the same click that you hear if you turn the key to start the engine while the engine is already running. After about 10 minutes, occasionally trying to start every minute or so, the car started up as normal and I was ready to go. This happened again a few days later on when I came out of Wal-mart after doing shopping.

I took it in to my mechanic and he had recommended changing the starter. A brand new starter was installed on November 23rd and it worked fine; or so I thought. So just yesterday, December 18th, I was on my way home from school on the long trip from Buffalo, NY to Brooklyn, NY. The car was running fine the whole time. Then, I pulled into a gas station in Pennsylvania and the came out from the restroom, filled the tank and went to start it; same problem again. Same symptoms.. I had just driven for about 300 miles with no problems. I asked someone for a jump as a precaution but that didnt work. So I ended up calling my mechanic, he told me something to try. He said try turning the key on and off fast. After about 3 key cycles from off to start the engine, it started again and continued to run without any problems.

My alternator was replaced in April 2011, new battery as of January 2013, new starter as of November 2013, all good fuses; I was convinced I'd be free from starting troubles for a while. Doing some research, it seems that its likely to be the ignition switch. Now about 50% of the time when I try to start the engine, it works; the other 50%, I have to turn the key fast about 3-5 times before it starts up.

Does this sound like the ignition switch? If so, is this easy to replace yourself. I was quoted about $120 for the switch and installation. It seems I can get the Motorcraft switch for $45. I read somewhere in the forum that the switch is easy to replace. If I replace it, will I need to reprogram the keys? Or is that just if I change the ignition cylinder? Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated as always.

Thanks!

P.S. My apologies for the length of this post, but I tried to be as descriptive as possible.

 

[FordFool2]

Ignition switch is good since you are hearing a click. I would check all connections on starter, battery and starter solenoid/relay.

 

[mranderson214]

[MENTION=162080]FordFool2[/MENTION]: Thanks for your reply.

Yes, when I get this no-start condition, I hear a single click every time I turn the key to start. The same click that you hear if you turn the key while the engine is already running.

All the immediate fuses are good (tested each one using a fuse tester). I'm not sure how I'd check the relay's but maybe I'll have my mechanic do that. The battery and its connections seem to be good. Maybe Ill bring it to my mechanic and have him check connections to the starter that he installed. It worked fine with the new starter for about 3 weeks. I'm really confused about this.

But basically, you're saying that it doesn't sound like the ignition switch?

Thanks!

 

[FordFool2]

Is your starter relay located as shown in this link? Item 6.

And does it look like this?

If you answered yes to both questions, then one way to check this solenoid relay is to jumper across the large terminals with your jumper cables. If it fails to turn over again and you only hear the click, then with the ignition in "on", try and jumper the large posts. If it cranks then, it proves that this solenoid switch is bad.

 

[mranderson214]

Thanks [MENTION=162080]FordFool2[/MENTION],

I will look into this tomorrow and post back here with my findings. Interestingly enough, I was going to bring it to my mechanic on Monday morning to see what the deal is. He said it might've been the starter he installed, which was brand new. He was going to look at the connections etc.

The only issue is that it seems to have been starting flawlessly these past few days. I recall when it wouldn't start on me, the temperatures were under 30 degrees F. The past few days, it has been suspiciously warm for December in the Northeast at around 50-60 degrees. So I'm not sure if temperature is playing a factor as well but there's definitely something going on. I'll check out the start relay solenoid tomorrow and see what it looks like. And Monday, my mechanic will be checking the starter.

As always, thanks for the reply!

 

[mranderson214]

So I checked the spot where item 6 is in the above image. It seems that my starter relay solenoid isnt there. The only thing I have between my battery and the fuse box under the hood, is a few black wires which are grounded to the metal chassis of the car.

I did however, spot something that resembles the shape of the image above, but it was located about halfway down on the right-side. It was basically in a plastic casing which was bolted to something else. The bolt seemed rusty and I didn't think to unbolt it especially if it didnt end up being the starter relay.

It still starts fine now for some reason but I just dont like the uncertainty of not knowing whether or not the car will start next time. I'll be bringing it to the mech tomorrow and he'd going to check all the starter components that he installed, and even though in which he might not have installed. I'll post back with the findings.

 

[FordFool2]

My bad. The photo of the engine compartment is pre-2002. In 2002 the starter motor relay is located within the Battery Junction Box. It is one of the those modular looking square shape relays. The owners manual should point you to which one. It could be the problem but it only makes a quieter click when it energizes. The starter has more of an internal relay that makes the louder click when energized.

 

[mranderson214]

Oh, that makes sense. I thought I had read something about a starter relay in the junction box in the past. I checked all the fuses in there and they check out fine. I havent checked the relay (square boxes) because I wasn't sure how to check them. I'll mention to my mech to check this tomorrow as well.

Thanks for the tip.

 

[mranderson214]

So my mech checked out the starter he installed and all seemed fine. He also checked the relay and that seemed fine as well. I read somewhere that the relay is a switch and can shake out of place sometimes.

It might be the case that it wasnt making contact completely in the high current fuse box. It's still starting without a problem but I must say that it gets a little uneasy hopping in your car and not being sure if itll start normally haha. I'll keep everyone updated with any other findings.

 

[ICEMAN37738]

HI there GUYS! i have experience 4 weeks ago with my 03 ST failed to restart after driving 30 miles and tried several times to switch ignition on again but failed. It looks like my battery is draining low coz the panel indicator lights grow dimmed everytime i switches it on though my battery is new. However after an hour waiting for rescue i tried to start ignition on again and i was surprise it started the engine running again and these happened a couple of times within that week, til now i am worried that this might happened again hopefully not in the middle of nowhere. I loved this car can you help me how to maintain my ST. thanks and regards......

 

[429CJ-3X2]

My '02 Sport Trac has replacement ends on the battery cables at the battery. Twice when I've gone to start it, I encountered similar no start situations as above. My problem was the small positive cable was loose in that replacement end. I tightened up the connection and went on my way.

 

[mranderson214]

[MENTION=125746]429CJ-3X2[/MENTION] so in other words, are you saying that your positive battery cable was loose at the positive terminal

 

[429CJ-3X2]

Yes. The clamp was tight on the battery terminal, but the cables were loose in the clamp. There are 2 positive cables, 1 large and 1 smaller one, going into 1 clamp at the battery. Both have to be tight or it won't start.

 

[mranderson214]

Just another update.

[MENTION=125746]429CJ-3X2[/MENTION]: Thanks for your input. I checked the positive terminal on the battery and its tight. I followed it down and didnt see another junction where 2 sets of wires become one big wire that leads to the battery. Maybe the XLT model doesnt have this junction on the positive terminal wires?

-------------------------
Once again, I found myself in a No-Start situation. The temperature outside now is about 20 degrees Fahrenheit with a windchill making it feel like 10 degrees. I left the house and went to the mall. I was in the mall for about an hour and 10 minutes and came back to a no start situation.

I've ruled out the alternator because it was replaced on 4/23/11 and when I have it tested, it checks out fine, as in the battery is being charged perfectly. Also, when the alternator died on me in the past (April 2011), I recall the symptoms and I'm not having the same symptoms.

I've ruled out the battery because it was replaced back in January of this year. So its not even a full year old. Its also been tested when under load and with the car off and both tests show the proper voltages. Also, when the battery wasnt being charged enough to start the engine before, the battery gauge would show less than half way, lights would be dim etc. I am not experiencing those symptoms when this happens. The lights are bright, radio works, horn works etc.

I've ruled out the fuel pump because I hear it engaging when I turn the key to the ON position where the lights come on without the engine starting. I hear the buzzing sound for about 2 seconds and then it cuts off. I'm also not experiencing any other fuel pump symptoms.

Based off of some of the other answers here and the symptoms I read about; I don't think its the ignition switch. That being said, we're back to it being something with the starter or some wiring for the ignition. Maybe this new information would help..

So on the two most recent occasions, the car wouldnt start when it was pretty cold out. In addition, on these same two occasions, once I was able to get the car started, the 4x4 High light flashed 6 times and stopped. It did this every minute or two. While the light flashed, I feel no change in the cars driving and hear no sounds like 4x4 High was engaged. I read up on this and found out that the flashing was caused by some transfer case sensors or something. I'm not sure that the sensors are what's causing my light to flash.

I find it a little strange that the flashing occurred after a force start situation (where I had to flip the key back and forth quickly to start the car). Once I shut off the engine and restarted it successfully on the first try, the 4x4 lights worked as normal.

Maybe it's just a coincidence but when I found myself trying to start it, I'd feel around under the dashboard wiring to see if anything was unplugged. When doing this, the car would start sometime. So, my final question is as follows: Are there any wires under the drivers side dash that may have become unplugged or maybe loose (or shorted somehow)? Like are there ignition wires under there that might be somehow tied into the instrument panel that would cause the flashing lights and such? ...when I got the car in August 2009, under the dash was a mess of electrical tape and a few broken wires that Ive since repaired. It's still a bit of a jumbled mess under there. Does my idea make sense?

Thanks for reading.

 

[stahrman]

You solved your problem!!! Sounds like you have a short somewhere under your dash. I would have an auto electrical shop/or yourself......clean up that jumbled mess of wires and start from there.

 

[olddaddy75]

Replace the starter solenoid. It may look good, but worn inside where you can not see it. Also, loose wires and connections can easily cause the problems you have, If you ALWAYS hear the click, then in has to be the solenoid not making a complete connection inside. Replace it, that is not very expensive. Also, make certain it has a good ground connection.

 

[410Fortune]

This thread is 12 years old!
Smart to check all fuses and relays associated with the starter as well as close inspection of the battery cables and terminals


02-05 Explorer uses a starter relay! The only solenoid is actually part of the starter

Always first verify the theft light goes off when trying to crank the starter
If it is rapid flashing then it could be a pats or security key / chip key issue

I also like to try and start the vehicle in neutral
If the starter turns with the transmission shifter in neutral then the issue is likely a loose shifter or out of adjustment neutral safety switch

Hope this helps anyone with an intermittent no start