Delay Shifting into Drive

[jmacclure]

Hi all. Great Forum.

I have a '97 Explorer with the 4.0L SOHC and, from the best I can tell, the 5R55E Transmission with Auto 4x4.

I bought it about 2 months ago and shortly thereafter noticed that there was occasionally a delay of 2-5 seconds before it would engage into drive after backing out of my driveway (20 deg slope). I have had no problems with it engaging in reverse. I figured that since it had about 100k on it and no record of the maintenance I'd change the transmission fluid and filter to see if that did it (this is when I found you guys). Did that over Labor Day, the fluid was somewhat discolored, no metal in the pan, very little of anything on the magnet, making sure to get the orings back on the filter put it all back together. Also changed the fluid in the transfer case since I had it up on stands.

Everything seemed to be fine. We've had a bit of a cold spell here and in the mornings when I leave it has done it a few more times. Once it engages, I don't notice any other issues and it doesn't do it again the rest of the day. Oil level is full and looks good on the stick (as far as I can tell). I don't think that it's having any shifting issues, though a couple of times I thought it might be going into 3rd a little late, but no jumping.

I'm going to try and check to see if the modulator is leaking back into the vacuum line this weekend, but I'm not sure that's the issue.

Anyone have any ideas or suggestions for me. I pretty mechanically enclined, just don't have any experience with transmissions.

Thanks,
Jeremy

 

[jmacclure]

Sorry

Forgot to mention that it does it no matter what forward selection I put it in.

Jeremy

 

[410Fortune]

I would tripple check your fluid level first and foremost, this means at operating temp, in park after it has been driven, on level ground.

The dipsticks on these trucks can be hard to read, because it can pick up ATF from the dipstick tube on its way in and out, so there will typically be one side that says full to top and the other is likely your accurate reading.
Also put the dipstick in one directionand dont let it spin, check it several times slowly

 

[jmacclure]

Checked it

I checked it after driving 20 miles to work. Checking both side, the lowest one I saw was within 1/8th of an inch from full, well within the hatch. I'll check it again when I get home.

I doubt I'm low as I checked it probably 20 times as part of refilling it (7 qts or so) and checking it afterward to make sure.

 

[BrooklynBay]

The 5R55E doesn't use a modulator. The A4LD has one. Check your pressure with a 0-300 PSI gauge. It could be the first sign of a failing EPC solenoid, loose valve body bolts, or bad gaskets. Sometimes a clogged filter could be the culprit, but you already replaced it.

 

[410Fortune]

what fluid did you fill it with?

 

[jmacclure]

Mercon V

Mercon V

Got it from Napa.

 

[Glacier991]

Good advice all.

 

[jmacclure]

Checked the level

When I got home from work I check the fluid level a few times and it was always full +1/4" / -1/8". If anything it's probably a little over full.

Check your pressure with a 0-300 PSI gauge. It could be the first sign of a failing EPC solenoid, loose valve body bolts, or bad gaskets. Sometimes a clogged filter could be the culprit, but you already replaced it.

I don't have access to a guage to check it. Does anyone know of places that would loan something like this out? AutoZone?

If it is the EPC solenoid, would I be able to check the ohms on it from the outside with a multimeter to see if it is going bad?

I'm hoping it doesn't come back as I don't exactly have the funds right now to do any repairs.

 

[PRSpilot]

my explorer was doing exactly what you said. It was delayed going into drive. It got progressively worse. finally it wouldnt go into drive at all. Took it to a transmission shop and they said my foward clutch failed and took out several hard parts along with it. Long story short i paid 2500 to rebuild the tranny.

You should take it to a professional before the tranny destroys itself.. imo.

 

[BrooklynBay]

The EPC is a modulated part as well as the TCC, so a basic ohm test isn't going to test it properly. It has to be stepped up, and down into several ranges with a special test tool. Check this thread for more information on using a pressure gauge: http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=117998. You could buy a gauge from WWW.Eppys.Com, or on EBay. Ask AutoZone if they loan them out.

 

[jmacclure]

Brooklyn, Thanks for the link. I'll get one and check it out, probably leaving it hooked up to monitor for a few days, and post the results.

 

[jmacclure]

First Pressure Check

Ok, I finally got my gauge kit and got it hooked up. After driving into work this morning I checked the pressures while everything was hot. These are approximate.

Park - 88psi
Reverse - 105psi
Neutral - 90psi
OD - 95-100psi
2nd - 90-95psi
1st - 85-95psi

There was a second or so delay before the presure rose on most after changing the gears. However, when shifting it into second, it would have a 2 or 3 second delay.

I also noticed that when it was cold as I was leaving this morning, in reverse, after 2-3 seconds in the 105psi range, the pressure would boost up near 200psi (sorry, didn't look close enough to get an actual reading)

I had noticed that there was a PCM update on a sticker under the hood. I think it read F7PFAU9, but I might have written it down wrong.

Any suggestions???

 

[jmacclure]

Checked it again

This time with the A/C off, after driving 20 minutes

Park: 90
R: 105
N: 90
D-O/D: 95
2: 85
1: 85

Since I've hooked up the gauge, it hasn't given me the large delay engaging into the forward gears.

 

[Glacier991]

Assuming these are line pressures..... for the 97, book is for the 5R55E:

P and N 75-120psi
R 175-215 psi
OD,2,1 80-110 psi

In other words your pressures seem on the low side. Me, I think I'd look for a blown VB gasket, and if I pulled the VB, I'd rebuild it in any event and add the upgrades a shift kit can offer.

ps. I'd do the Sonnax Boost valve kit at a minimum, and THANK YOU for pressures. A great assist in diagnosing.

 

[BrooklynBay]

Glacier, he has 100k on it. Could the EPC be the culprit?

 

[Glacier991]

I am sure the EPC is probably weak....could it be the SOLE problem? I am not sure. If he had a blown reverse gasket, putting it into drive could take a ramp up time for pressures to engage the forward clutch due to the leak....

In a perfect world we would fix ONE thing at a time and see what worked... in the real world, once you take the bath of ATF, you want to attack it all at once, ONE time... so we rarely know exactly what fixed what .....exactly....

My best guess here is a blown gasket, loose bolts, tired VB spools and likely a tired EPC which, in concert, produce these symptoms. I think a run through the VB Rebuild Diary with the FORD mods and a shift kit will solve his problems.

Remember this tranny has an EPC pressure port..... so he COULD test the EPC. But at 100K I'd replace it.

 

[jmacclure]

It finally acted up

With it being in the 20s the last few mornings it finally acted up 3 times in a row. Here is what was going on.

I would start the car and the pressure would come up to a normal level, a little over 100psi.

After I put it into reverse and moved a few feet (10-15 or so) the line pressure dropped out and stayed at 0 for a few second (5-15). It didn't matter what gear I tried to put it in, it wouldn't come right back up.

After that it would come back up to normal and not act up again.

All three times it has happened, the car had been parked for at least 8 hours, twice uphill on a slope and once on level ground. It seems to be affected by the temperature outside as it does it when it is colder.

Any ideas, does this change any suggestions?

Thank you all for your help so far.

 

[BrooklynBay]

The solenoid is getting affected from the cold weather. Sometimes gaskets could get affected from temperature changes too. I would suggest that you replace them before you get stuck.

 

[jmacclure]

Pardon my Monday Brainlessness...

but which soloniod are you referring to?

I've also noticed that the reverse line pressure (when cold) boosts to around 200psi, but after I'm moving a little bit, it gets to fluttering and drops back to around 100. I couldn't tell if it was doing this when it would drop all the way out (too dark).

From what I've gathered so far, I should run through the VB Rebuild Diary with the FORD mods and a shift kit and replace the EPC. Anything else anyone would recommend?