Doubler only option?

[doonze]

I have a question, this is from someone who has never cracked the case on the tranfer cases...

I'm guessing the cases have gears in them right?

And I'm guessing that when you go into 4x4 low it just uses differnet gears...

So to get 4:1 ratio...why not just change gears instead of doing a doubler? Is is just that it can't be done? I would think if it was that easy if would be the way things are done, but why can't the gears be changed? I mean when I'm in 4x4 low I don't care if its 2:1 or 4:1, I don't need the choice.

I'm guessing I'm just in the dark about something about the transfer cases, I've always assumed they are much like a tranny. And the gears can be changed.

In other post it just seems no one makes the gears.... is that because it can't be done of just that no one makes them...

Just curious... I have a manual and am thinking of one day looking more into this....

 

[dangerrangerstx]

i dont think theres gears im going to put in a i6 out of an 81 ford. i know it not a 302 but [1] its built proof drive train and [2] its got a grany low then i can do a doubler easily and get close to 12:1

 

[dangerrangerstx]

not after market planetary gears like sammys and heeps

 

[doonze]

not after market planetary gears like sammys and heeps

So is that because they CAN'T make em, or just because no one bothers?

I've already said it once today, it's not like the Explorer isn't the most sold SUV in America or anything....

The after market for these 1st gens is wanting to say the least. I'm almost looking forward to them getting 20-30 years old, maybe then at least Year One might start carrying stuff for em!!! LOL

 

[dangerrangerstx]

not a big market i guess suply and demand unlike heep my truck im building is all ford
srry u can do a 302 swap and doubler for around the same price as a 4.0 doubler tcase

 

[dkchrist]

No body bothers to make them. Other than a doubler, there is the atlas and if you could convince STaK they might make you a replacement transfer case. But there is an issue with both $$$$$.

 

[IZwack]

So to get 4:1 ratio...why not just change gears instead of doing a doubler? Is is just that it can't be done? I would think if it was that easy if would be the way things are done, but why can't the gears be changed? I mean when I'm in 4x4 low I don't care if its 2:1 or 4:1, I don't need the choice.

If its doable, then it probably would have already been done.

Also, because our t-cases are a planetary configuration, the gear ratio is limited by the diameter of the transfer case's housing and to a degree, the torque coming from the engine:

Since you cant increase the ring gear's diameter w/o breaking out of the transfer case's housing, the only other way to achieve lower gear ratio is to make the "sun" gear smaller and make the "planet" gears larger. However, at some point the "sun" gear becomes so small and too weak to handle the torque from the engine (torsional strength of a gear/shaft is partially determined by its cross sectional area). So this is probably a no go.

The only other way to achieve low gear ratio is to extend the length of the transfer case and stack on another planetary gear set - which, in essence, is what a doubler is.

 

[Freshmeat]

i dont think theres gears im going to put in a i6 out of an 81 ford. i know it not a 302 but [1] its built proof drive train and [2] its got a grany low then i can do a doubler easily and get close to 12:1

I don't envision an I-6 fitting in the Explorer when a 302 requires adjustment of the radiator and condenser. Sure, you'll have the option of the granny low, but the 4.9 I-6 had a Windsor bell pattern, which means you could run a 302 with a granny low. From there, figure up your gearing.

NP435/203/205/Axles
6.7:1/2:1/2:1/4.88:1
130:1

M5OD/1350/1354/Axles
3.41:1/2.69:1/2.69:1/4.88:1
120:1

The difference is 10:1, which at that kind of crawl would be nearly unnoticeable, but for the cost difference, you'd be insane to make the switch for the purpose of running an "easy" doubler. My doubler is looking like it'll cost me $200 (I'll be getting the machining/welding done for free from a professional connection of mine) and my 4.0/M5OD/1350/1354 will be a WHOLE LOT lighter than a 300/NP435/203/205 drivetrain.

Not really trying to come down on you- just trying to help you look at it from another angle before you make the dive.

 

[dangerrangerstx]

if i was worried about weight i would be using 1 tons and 39s the i6 will last longer than a 302. also they make sawzalls grinders and welder i was planing on relocating my rad any ways
and i could make a 4.0 M5OD/1350/1354/ doubler but why on a trail rig that has 188k on it

I don't envision an I-6 fitting in the Explorer when a 302 requires adjustment of the radiator and condenser. Sure, you'll have the option of the granny low, but the 4.9 I-6 had a Windsor bell pattern, which means you could run a 302 with a granny low. From there, figure up your gearing.

NP435/203/205/Axles
6.7:1/2:1/2:1/4.88:1
130:1

M5OD/1350/1354/Axles
3.41:1/2.69:1/2.69:1/4.88:1
120:1

The difference is 10:1, which at that kind of crawl would be nearly unnoticeable, but for the cost difference, you'd be insane to make the switch for the purpose of running an "easy" doubler. My doubler is looking like it'll cost me $200 (I'll be getting the machining/welding done for free from a professional connection of mine) and my 4.0/M5OD/1350/1354 will be a WHOLE LOT lighter than a 300/NP435/203/205 drivetrain.

Not really trying to come down on you- just trying to help you look at it from another angle before you make the dive.

 

[Freshmeat]

also they make sawzalls grinders and welder

Spoken like a true off-roader.

If you're really planning to put a 300 into an Explorer, I'm counting on LOTS of pictures. I envision it sticking 7" past the front bumper.

 

[dangerrangerstx]

well first thing is find job wheel it till i get tired of the 4.0 or when i blow it. second is find a garge to build it 3rd i have no interior so firewall can be cut and buil. its one of those thing i have planed
and im still looking for a garage around here to borrow lol

Spoken like a true off-roader.

If you're really planning to put a 300 into an Explorer, I'm counting on LOTS of pictures. I envision it sticking 7" past the front bumper.

 

[dangerrangerstx]

btw thanxs for the true offroader comment. I believe lift and tires dont make u an offroader

 

[dkchrist]

btw thanxs for the true offroader comment. I believe lift and tires dont make u an offroader

well spoken

 

[FireZapper]

I've heard of a couple 300's in explorers and rangers. Check with Wanderer here. He put the 300 in his old ranger.

Yes to get a different set of gears in the tcase. Normally you get a completely new case or your heavily modifying your case.

 

[dangerrangerstx]

aha thanks

 

[doonze]

I liked the old I6 300's..... My ex-step-dad had a Bronco with the I6 in it. Full size. It didn't win any 1/4 races, but I swear that thing would have pulled the moon if you could gotten a tow hook on it!

As far as I'm concerned, you'd have had to have gone up to a 460 to do any better... and not a lick of trouble out of it, ever! We used it to pull stumps, it's limiting factor was traction, torque was never lacking. I mean when your all in by 2000 RPM's.... I mean wow.... pushing around 250 in torque under 1800 RPM's is the ultimate towing/pulling setup.

And at 300 CI, well, bigger then the 289 V8 and really right there with the V8 302. And the 5.0 as we all know was one of fords best V8's. One of the best V8's EVER... (first car was a 302 68 Mustang...)

Don't get me wrong, I like my 4.0 just fine. (Why doesn't anyone call it a 242?) But I'm not towing yet either. But if I swap, I'll swap a carbed 302, just for ease of install. But I'll bet ya when that day comes.... I'll just swap another 4.0l (er. 242!) right in there and call it good!

 

[Maniak]

I'll 2nd that 300 inline 6.. great motor..

Even better if your using a carbed version and put on an Offenhauser 4 barrel intake.

BTW, @ .030 bored over, its a 302 (5.0 ).. and it has gobs more torque than the 302, and there are parts to get even more power from it.

They are tanks, and will still run when hurt. I drove 100 miles or so with a blown head gasket. At idle, I had exhaust coming out the carb, it wasn't happy, but it maintained 70mph all the way home.

~Mark

 

[dangerrangerstx]

the i6 was at a stealer ship they drained the oil and put the liquid glass in it with NO oil and it ran for 30 min+. other engine last 10 min
i was thinking a makure 2 wd pre runner i found a 2 wd for 300 and its a 93