How do I get the midshaft out of the front diff?

[geosnooker2000]

I got the salvage pumpkin without a mid-shaft in it, so I thought I would just re-use the one out of my trashed front diff. But how do you grab it and pull it out? Is there some sort of snap ring I don't know about? Tried to lightly punch it out from the driver's side, but it wont budge.
Any help would be appreciated.
George

 

[CDW6212R]

Hi George, I'm not sure how it could hurt to tap it out the other side. It often comes out with the right axle, so it should not be that hard. It's surely the same kind of circlip/ring as the outer end has. It just snaps in or out, so no harm should occur from force on the end to push it out. Do have a long thin shaft that'll go through the diff, what did you use?

 

[geosnooker2000]

Hi George, I'm not sure how it could hurt to tap it out the other side. It often comes out with the right axle, so it should not be that hard. It's surely the same kind of circlip/ring as the outer end has. It just snaps in or out, so no harm should occur from force on the end to push it out. Do have a long thin shaft that'll go through the diff, what did you use?

I have a piece of steel about 1/4" in diameter that is about 8 or 10" long. There is some cylindrical piece dead in the middle of the shaft hole within the pumpkin oriented up and down that only exposes about 1/4" of the in-board end of the mid-shaft, so the piece of steel I was using is about as big as would make clean contact with the mid-shaft anyway. Here is a pic through the driver's side:

Here is the other side, and it does not stick out like it looks in the photo (optical illusion).

I bought 2 new seals to replace the ones on the donor pumpkin.

 

[boominXplorer]

Use 2 prybars in the circlip end groove and pry against the seal to pop it out. If you had someone tap though the other side at the same time it would help.

 

[geosnooker2000]

Use 2 prybars in the circlip end groove and pry against the seal to pop it out. If you had someone tap though the other side at the same time it would help.

I'm sorry, I really am, but you are going to have to be more descriptive for me to understand. What is meant by "the circlip end groove"? The only seals I see are one on the driver's side and one on the passenger side, and neither one is retaining this mid-shaft from coming out. Whatever is holding this mid-shaft in place is too deep inside the passenger side mid-shaft tube for me to reach with any prybars.

 

[geosnooker2000]

I think I figured out what you were saying... next question.... is there supposed to be a circlip in that circlip gap? Cuz there ain't one there.

ETA: There is also not one on the inside of the short axle for the passenger axle I pulled out, although I feel another circlip groove deep inside.

 

[CDW6212R]

I recall from seeing that picture, that I pulled the inner shaft out of the one I had rebuilt. I did pry it out like boominxplorer described. Pry against the edge where the seal is, grabbing/catching the groove where the cir-clip engages. There is enough to get ahold of, to pry it out. I did it carefully and pried against the upper edge of the hole. If you mark or gouge the edge where the seal goes, you'd rather do that at the top, not the bottom where grease inside sets all the time.

 

[imp]

I think I figured out what you were saying... next question.... is there supposed to be a circlip in that circlip gap? Cuz there ain't one there.

ETA: There is also not one on the inside of the short axle for the passenger axle I pulled out, although I feel another circlip groove deep inside.

The Circlips are intended to keep the axles from sliding as the CV Joint changes apparent length with suspension travel up and down. Leaving them out sets up the possibility of damage to the CV Joints. imp

 

[CDW6212R]

Good thought, they need to be strong enough to resist that length change force of the axles. It takes a good strong tug to pull them apart.

 

[boominXplorer]

Does this help? It's crude but I think you may get the point. And yes there should be a little clip in that groove but it's very small.

 

[geosnooker2000]

Well, like I said, there's not one on the interior shaft, there's not one IN the short (passenger side) axle, and there's not one on the ground. I put over 100,000k on this truck since I got it 5ish years ago. SO I don't know what to do.

 

[geosnooker2000]

So you're telling me that after I get this shaft out of my old one, and put it in my new one, I should get a circlip to put in that grove. Right? What do I ask for when I go to AutoZone to get one, because I can't even find information on this shaft when I google it. That just doesn't seem right, because if that is what the passenger axle shaft "bottoms out" on, then you've barely got any spline exposure turning the axle. Look how close that grove is to the actual end of the mid-shaft...

is it possible that that grove is merely there to put a circlip temporarily with the purpose of pulling on the shaft to remove it from the housing?

 

[imp]

Good thought, they need to be strong enough to resist that length change force of the axles. It takes a good strong tug to pull them apart.

Thanks! At least, I'm not 'called down" here for "overthinking issues". (Stang.net). There, they resent greatly any new member intruding upon their little "clique". They know it all.

Anyhow, the axial forces exerted by CV Joints must be pretty low, until the joints become seriously deteriorated. The C-Clip idea provided a simple means of keeping the axles fairly stable while still allowing easy disassembly when necessary. 40 years ago, I encountered them on my '78 Fiesta. Then, I thought they were Mickey Mouse. Had I been designing the car for maximum performance, I'd've sought a more positive way. But, they worked, so long as you didn't push the limits, replace them each time during disassembly (why?), I dunno. Precautionary, I guess.

Reality is, Front Wheel Drive is only as good as it's design. The outer CVs must remain aligned with the axis throught the steering knuckle as it rotates. Circlips provide that requirement. Meanwhile, as suspension travels up and down, it describes an arc causing the axle to get "longer and shorter", like the slip-joint on a rear wheel drive driveshaft. That apparent change in mounted length is accomplished by CVs having the ability to let the axle push "in and out". With Rzeppa joints, this required a very complicated machined pair of parts to allow the balls driving the joint to comply. Fiesta had this type. I think mainly gone now, today's use either a two-lobed or three-lobed gizmo having rollers mounted on a yoke similar to the old Cardan, which mesh within a stamped steel housing allowing them to swivel back and forth as the angle of operation changes, and slide in and out to accomodate axle length change.

So, I HATE FRONT WHEEL DRIVE!

 

[imp]

Good thought, they need to be strong enough to resist that length change force of the axles. It takes a good strong tug to pull them apart.

Thanks! At least, I'm not 'called down" here for "overthinking issues". (Stang.net). There, they resent greatly any new member intruding upon their little "clique". They know it all.

Anyhow, the axial forces exerted by CV Joints must be pretty low, until the joints become seriously deteriorated. The C-Clip idea provided a simple means of keeping the axles fairly stable while still allowing easy disassembly when necessary. 40 years ago, I encountered them on my '78 Fiesta. Then, I thought they were Mickey Mouse. Had I been designing the car for maximum performance, I'd've sought a more positive way. But, they worked, so long as you didn't push the limits, replace them each time during disassembly (why?), I dunno. Precautionary, I guess.

Reality is, Front Wheel Drive is only as good as it's design. The outer CVs must remain aligned with the axis throught the steering knuckle as it rotates to steer the vehicle. Circlips provide that requirement. Meanwhile, as suspension travels up and down, it describes an arc causing the axle to get "longer and shorter", like the slip-joint on a rear wheel drive driveshaft. That apparent change in mounted length is accomplished by CVs having the ability to let the axle push "in and out". With Rzeppa joints, this required a very complicated machined pair of parts to allow the balls driving the joint to comply. Fiesta had this type. I think mainly gone now, today's use either a two-lobed or three-lobed gizmo having rollers mounted on a yoke similar to the old Cardan, which mesh within a stamped steel housing allowing them to swivel back and forth as the angle of operation changes, and slide in and out to accomodate axle length change.

So, I HATE FRONT WHEEL DRIVE!

 

[imp]

Does this help? It's crude but I think you may get the point. And yes there should be a little clip in that groove but it's very small.

View attachment 152119

The Circlip must reside back beyond the chamfer on the end of the axle shaft. IOW, back beyond the shaft's end about 1/4 inch.

 

[boominXplorer]

Here's a pic of a stub shaft out of a 3rd gen housing. I'm not sure if it's the same as the D35 but they look identical at the end. You can see the clip goes about 80% around.

 

[geosnooker2000]

HAHAHA!!!!! Never mind, guys. That circlip is actually IN that groove, and I couldn't even see it until I pryed it out of the carrier. It was so greasy and black I couldn't see it.