In need of locker advice

[410Fortune]

check your door tag it will have an axle code, 4.10 limited slip should be D2

41 - 3.27 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
45 - 3.55 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
46 - 3.73 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
42 - 4.10 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
D1 - 3.27 limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
D4 - 3.73 limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
D2 - 4.10 limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)

 

[No Pavement Please]

I’m also reading your other thread about tires, and I’m now thinking the best thing for you would be to get the couple inches of lift and the more aggressive tires and drive that for a while, without getting a locker, and see how it does and how you like it. You have a lsd, and you’re not talking about doing knarly trails, so the LS may be just right for you. If you’re doing a lot of trails over your level, and/or you’re getting stuck all the time, then you know you need a locker.

Yes I agree. Thank you again for the great advice. I was getting ahead of myself. I do need more "seat time," get to know my rig, and assess my needs from there.

 

[No Pavement Please]

check your door tag it will have an axle code, 4.10 limited slip should be D2

41 - 3.27 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
45 - 3.55 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
46 - 3.73 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
42 - 4.10 non-limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
D1 - 3.27 limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
D4 - 3.73 limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)
D2 - 4.10 limited slip (Explorer/Mountaineer)

Great info!!! Thank you for this. Yes it's D2. LSD may be all I need until I get more skilled and ready to get into more technical offroading. This is good stuff. Thank you.

 

[410Fortune]

yes one of these trucks with a limited slip rear axle and some good tires will go places you never thought possible = addicting!

 

[No Pavement Please]

yes one of these trucks with a limited slip rear axle and some good tires will go places you never thought possible = addicting!

Addicting is definitely the word. It just keeps amazing me, that I literally have done nothing to my rig yet, but I'm so addicted. Lol! Thank you for the great advice.

So if I do discover that an LSD is adequate for my adventures. Would you recommend and aftermarket LSD install? I would imagine that there are better ones than a stock LSD in the market.

 

[Happy Jack]

A couple of things. One a long aal is a bit different from a short one. The long is a bit better for ride and I like mine. Second the LS has clutches and clutches wear. I didn't see how many miles you have on your suv but the more miles you have on a ls the more wear you have and you loose it's holding power. I am not current on ls but here used to be 2. Trac lock was used in most stock vehicles and Power Lock. Trac Lock has a one peice case and the clutches have to be compressed to install the spider gears. Power Lock is a 2 piece case and clutches can be compressed bolting it together. This means the Power Lock can have greater holding power. Point is that if your suv has some miles on it you could need new clutches in it. The park brake or light braking while applying power will work on open diffs as well. But most vehicles have more braking for the front than the rear. So you can do both park and brake pedal to help both front and rear. You just need to find out how much parking brake you need to make up for the brake biasing between the front and rear. And this will change over time as the rear clutches wear or are replaced. May not need any with fresh clutches. Also LS requires friction modifier in the gear oil. So you need to be sure this is added or use gear oil with it all ready added. But do not use it for an open or locker.

 

[No Pavement Please]

A couple of things. One a long aal is a bit different from a short one. The long is a bit better for ride and I like mine. Second the LS has clutches and clutches wear. I didn't see how many miles you have on your suv but the more miles you have on a ls the more wear you have and you loose it's holding power. I am not current on ls but here used to be 2. Trac lock was used in most stock vehicles and Power Lock. Trac Lock has a one peice case and the clutches have to be compressed to install the spider gears. Power Lock is a 2 piece case and clutches can be compressed bolting it together. This means the Power Lock can have greater holding power. Point is that if your suv has some miles on it you could need new clutches in it. The park brake or light braking while applying power will work on open diffs as well. But most vehicles have more braking for the front than the rear. So you can do both park and brake pedal to help both front and rear. You just need to find out how much parking brake you need to make up for the brake biasing between the front and rear. And this will change over time as the rear clutches wear or are replaced. May not need any with fresh clutches. Also LS requires friction modifier in the gear oil. So you need to be sure this is added or use gear oil with it all ready added. But do not use it for an open or locker.

Thank you for info on LSD's. I may need need to have mine checked out. My ST has 93k miles.

 

[palavine1951]

No Pavement, I have read the replies from other members and they all have some merit. 410 is very experienced with our 2nd generation Expo's. I'll just throw in my 2 cents worth. I purchased but haven't installed an Ox locker. Pricey with the electronic shift control but I think any way you want to shift it is fine (manual cable is fine). No one mentioned a Torsen front diff for a D35 SLA. I have been hounding Torsen to build a batch and if more members would contact them maybe they will build some. Having said that ground clearance along big tires for less roll resistance is desirable for most off-road excursions. If you stay on the easier trails you should be fine but there almost always is a spot that will be challenging and the better the setup the easier it will be to negotiate. I have been to Baja with race teams and have prerun some of the courses. The norm is 35 inch tires with as much travel in the suspension as is feasible for your vehicle. 410 will tell you that a front coil over kit is the way to go with Deaver springs in the rear and that is where I'm going. 35's will require 4.56 gears. I have a 2002 Expo Sport that uses many of the same parts as your ST but I swapped a 302 with a 4R70W tranny and a 4406 transfer case. Runs great but sucks fuel. Axles with lockers next then suspension. Whatever you do good luck. 410 is your best source for knowledge on these Expos.

 

[MasterTech808]

Hello my Ford peeps,

I was wondering if I could get some advice about lockers.

Here's my scenario:

I have an '05 ST Adrenalin. It will be my non-daily driver offroad rig build. I will install a 3" torsion key lift for the front and a 2" add a leaf in the rear. I'm gonna run 265/75r16 AT's (most likely Falken Wildpeaks) on stock wheels. I live in Vegas and will camp/overland in this rig. I will also road trip to Utah and Arizona. I will occasionally tow a tear drop trailer. And my wife and child will be with me. It's sort of a budget build. I'd like it to be an efficient and safe rig at a lower cost.

I am undecided on an automatic locker vs a selectable locker.

My main concern with automatic lockers is the stories of locking/unlocking at unwanted times. I've also read that I must modify my driving style with an automatic locker, which I'm totally fine with. I've also read about the extra wear on tires that come with using automatic lockers. But the pros about automatic lockers are very enticing, such as the cost. I know selectable lockers are pricey (but also a great investment into a rig).

Whichever I choose, will be professionally installed, so installation error should be a non-factor.

I welcome any and all advice. Thank you all. Please help. Lol!

Detroit locker specially if you are offroad and a must in soft sand a lot.It locks to make true possi but does allow 3/4 give for turning so not hard on drivetrain and tires when on road

 

[No Pavement Please]

No Pavement, I have read the replies from other members and they all have some merit. 410 is very experienced with our 2nd generation Expo's. I'll just throw in my 2 cents worth. I purchased but haven't installed an Ox locker. Pricey with the electronic shift control but I think any way you want to shift it is fine (manual cable is fine). No one mentioned a Torsen front diff for a D35 SLA. I have been hounding Torsen to build a batch and if more members would contact them maybe they will build some. Having said that ground clearance along big tires for less roll resistance is desirable for most off-road excursions. If you stay on the easier trails you should be fine but there almost always is a spot that will be challenging and the better the setup the easier it will be to negotiate. I have been to Baja with race teams and have prerun some of the courses. The norm is 35 inch tires with as much travel in the suspension as is feasible for your vehicle. 410 will tell you that a front coil over kit is the way to go with Deaver springs in the rear and that is where I'm going. 35's will require 4.56 gears. I have a 2002 Expo Sport that uses many of the same parts as your ST but I swapped a 302 with a 4R70W tranny and a 4406 transfer case. Runs great but sucks fuel. Axles with lockers next then suspension. Whatever you do good luck. 410 is your best source for knowledge on these Expos.

Sweet! You have an Ox. I'm quite sure I'll get one in the future. But I do agree with 410's advice about "seat time" and getting to know my rig and developing the correct offroad driving skills. He has been vouched for by other members to me as well, regarding his knowledge. I will be picking his brain for sure about various offroad topics. Are you reading this, 410? Lol! In regard to your comments about ground clearance and tires. I will be installing a 2" suspension lift and run 32" AT's. With that I think I'll clear 10.5" or 11" of ground clearance. I think?

 

[AZtracMAN]

You can go the cheap easy way for now and replace the clutches in the lsd that’s what I did before stepping up to the ox a few months back. I chose the ox for the same reasons you mentioned, haven’t had it long but I do like it. If you do just go with replacing the lsd clutches might as well go with the ford racing. This is the kit I used M-4700-C

 

[Craigerz]

I have a Power Trax up front and tow with it. Unless you really need a front locker where you will be going I can tell you there are really more cons than pros. Yes it is the cheapest option, probably the easiest to install, and in the end you are locked up front. I would never have one on a DD. It doesnt take so much learning to drive on the highway. Just no sharp U turns. I like it being in the south because its mostly hills, sand, gravel and mud. It eats it up. Towing on the highway is not a problem either. I have heard they are bad for the snow, but I don't really have to worry about that much here. What it really doesn't like are sharp turns and huge rocks. So the occasional tight trail is ok, but really gets to be a pain after awhile because the only way to turn it "off" is to take it out of 4WD. SO remember any tight turns or backing up or turning around might have to be done in 2WD. If you tow your teardrop to the camp and drop it off its not really a big deal either but overlanding with it makes it almost more difficult than having a locker sometimes. So take the tight turns and turn arounds and add a trailer to that having to back up and turn around. You really have to keep your eyes way up the track for turns and rocks and the need to turn around if you find a spot you can't pass.

Lastly, it is still a locker even if its not the desirable one, and it does its job. It will snap a CV without even slipping a tire. I guess that goes for all of them though. So wife and kid and busted CV in the middle of the desert when overlanding alone when a front locker probably wasn't needed can ruin a trip fast. I've learned all of this the hard way too lol

I still have a LS in the rear and have never had any problems losing traction in the sand or mud either, but I don't do any crazy wheel lifts or rock crawling either.

I think a good set of Maxx Traxx ( I use the cheap version lol I can't see driving over 300 bucks) and a LS or locked rear would be the safest most reliable bet for towing in the south if not just going straight up off roading. Just from what I've been through. Until the make a selectable locker for us.

Not trying to steer you away, I have one and tow off road so its doable, and Ill keep it up there for what I do, but it's a different ride for sure. I guess what I'm trying to say is if even if you are going places most of the time you don't need it locked, you still have to drive like it is. If that makes sense.

 

[sandsprayer]

A good off road driver in a Subaru can go further then a novice in a Jeep Rubicon

Some of my fondest memories off pavement involve novices in high $ machines, easy to spot- grab a beer, sit back, and wait.
A man has got to realize his limitations

 

[No Pavement Please]

A good off road driver in a Subaru can go further then a novice in a Jeep Rubicon

My DD is a Forester. I'm also a novice. Damn!! That means currently, I can only make it as far as the parking lot. I'm not even a soft-roader. I'm a mall crawler. That'll change. Good thing I have all you guys to teach me the do's and don'ts. I appreciate all you guys for your help.

 

[No Pavement Please]

A couple of things. One a long aal is a bit different from a short one. The long is a bit better for ride and I like mine.

Thank you. I also have read that a long aal is better than a short. The kit I found offered a long aal as an option.

 

[410Fortune]

great thread!
Good info about the Powertrax in the front diff. With the CAD system in place a front locker could work out nicely.......otherwise, like he said more cons then pros

 

[No Pavement Please]

Detroit locker specially if you are offroad and a must in soft sand a lot.It locks to make true possi but does allow 3/4 give for turning so not hard on drivetrain and tires when on road

Thank you for the locker suggestion. Here in Vegas there definitely is sand. There are numerous dry river bed trails and washes that lead down to the Colorado River. From what I've been told, and read online. It seems the desert is well suited for automatic lockers. It doesn't snow or rain a ton here. Which it seems, is when automatic lockers can be finnicky.

 

[No Pavement Please]

You can go the cheap easy way for now and replace the clutches in the lsd that’s what I did before stepping up to the ox a few months back. I chose the ox for the same reasons you mentioned, haven’t had it long but I do like it. If you do just go with replacing the lsd clutches might as well go with the ford racing. This is the kit I used M-4700-C View attachment 320529

Great info!!! Thank you for the suggestion. I love this forum!! A buddy of mine also suggested this. I think it's a good idea to go with my LSD and see if it suits my needs. Then like you, I'll graduate to an Ox. Lol! Regarding the Ox, I love that "drive away key" that you can purchase for that system. It's genius. And so safe for the customer, it's awesome.

 

[BKennedy]

I was warned about auto lockers and wet and / or icy roads, but I haven't really noticed any real issues since I am not in the habit of stomping on the gas pedal in those conditions. I have driven mine for hundreds of miles down the freeway, highways, county roads, etc. during heavy rain storms and even in snow. The large grippy off-road tires more than make up for the lack of slip in the rear axle. Honestly, the only time I notice the locker is making sharp turns while accelerating from a stop, and sometimes driving on winding roads the locker tries to push the vehicle straight which requires a little more steering input. I try not to get the inside tire to chirp on pavement because its hard on the drivetrain, but that's a good way to make sure your locker is working.

 

[No Pavement Please]

I have a Power Trax up front and tow with it. Unless you really need a front locker where you will be going I can tell you there are really more cons than pros. Yes it is the cheapest option, probably the easiest to install, and in the end you are locked up front. I would never have one on a DD. It doesnt take so much learning to drive on the highway. Just no sharp U turns. I like it being in the south because its mostly hills, sand, gravel and mud. It eats it up. Towing on the highway is not a problem either. I have heard they are bad for the snow, but I don't really have to worry about that much here. What it really doesn't like are sharp turns and huge rocks. So the occasional tight trail is ok, but really gets to be a pain after awhile because the only way to turn it "off" is to take it out of 4WD. SO remember any tight turns or backing up or turning around might have to be done in 2WD. If you tow your teardrop to the camp and drop it off its not really a big deal either but overlanding with it makes it almost more difficult than having a locker sometimes. So take the tight turns and turn arounds and add a trailer to that having to back up and turn around. You really have to keep your eyes way up the track for turns and rocks and the need to turn around if you find a spot you can't pass.

Lastly, it is still a locker even if its not the desirable one, and it does its job. It will snap a CV without even slipping a tire. I guess that goes for all of them though. So wife and kid and busted CV in the middle of the desert when overlanding alone when a front locker probably wasn't needed can ruin a trip fast. I've learned all of this the hard way too lol

I still have a LS in the rear and have never had any problems losing traction in the sand or mud either, but I don't do any crazy wheel lifts or rock crawling either.

I think a good set of Maxx Traxx ( I use the cheap version lol I can't see driving over 300 bucks) and a LS or locked rear would be the safest most reliable bet for towing in the south if not just going straight up off roading. Just from what I've been through. Until the make a selectable locker for us.

Not trying to steer you away, I have one and tow off road so its doable, and Ill keep it up there for what I do, but it's a different ride for sure. I guess what I'm trying to say is if even if you are going places most of the time you don't need it locked, you still have to drive like it is. If that makes sense.

Thank you for the insight

I have a Power Trax up front and tow with it. Unless you really need a front locker where you will be going I can tell you there are really more cons than pros. Yes it is the cheapest option, probably the easiest to install, and in the end you are locked up front. I would never have one on a DD. It doesnt take so much learning to drive on the highway. Just no sharp U turns. I like it being in the south because its mostly hills, sand, gravel and mud. It eats it up. Towing on the highway is not a problem either. I have heard they are bad for the snow, but I don't really have to worry about that much here. What it really doesn't like are sharp turns and huge rocks. So the occasional tight trail is ok, but really gets to be a pain after awhile because the only way to turn it "off" is to take it out of 4WD. SO remember any tight turns or backing up or turning around might have to be done in 2WD. If you tow your teardrop to the camp and drop it off its not really a big deal either but overlanding with it makes it almost more difficult than having a locker sometimes. So take the tight turns and turn arounds and add a trailer to that having to back up and turn around. You really have to keep your eyes way up the track for turns and rocks and the need to turn around if you find a spot you can't pass.

Lastly, it is still a locker even if its not the desirable one, and it does its job. It will snap a CV without even slipping a tire. I guess that goes for all of them though. So wife and kid and busted CV in the middle of the desert when overlanding alone when a front locker probably wasn't needed can ruin a trip fast. I've learned all of this the hard way too lol

I still have a LS in the rear and have never had any problems losing traction in the sand or mud either, but I don't do any crazy wheel lifts or rock crawling either.

I think a good set of Maxx Traxx ( I use the cheap version lol I can't see driving over 300 bucks) and a LS or locked rear would be the safest most reliable bet for towing in the south if not just going straight up off roading. Just from what I've been through. Until the make a selectable locker for us.

Not trying to steer you away, I have one and tow off road so its doable, and Ill keep it up there for what I do, but it's a different ride for sure. I guess what I'm trying to say is if even if you are going places most of the time you don't need it locked, you still have to drive like it is. If that makes sense.

Thank you for the insight and advice. It's good to know that there is a front locker option. And thank you for sharing your towing experience and the pros and cons of a front locker. This is definitely something to consider in the future. I'm going to see where my LSD will take me. I'm 99.99999% sure that I will get a rear locker eventually. If and when I want to tackle more technical trails, then front locker it is. Maybe by then, there will be a selectable locker for our front.