MAF tuning

[Doug904]

So aftermarket MAFs in general shouldn't be used? Pro-M is the same thing as Granatelli.

I know the views here and I've tried to kinda lean away from this info but in my own experiences along with my tuning knowledge I wouldn't recommend a Pro-M or any aftermarket mass air to my worst enemy.

One is because on a n/a engine, 4.0-5.0 in an Explorer, your not going to outflow it. Spend your hard erned money where it's best, in a good air intake system and cat-back exhaust. From there get a SCT product, chip or tuner, and you've done just about everything you can for your daily driver. Now for a racer or someone looking to get every last bit you may wanna get the headers but those too aren't something I would recommend as a first mod.

Whipple superchargers uses a SOHC 4.0 65mm stock mass air with the supercharger kits for the 3.0. Explorer Express uses the stock 65mm mass air meter with the BASE kit, anything over base and you'd need to go to an 80mm GT or some other Ford meter.

Two is the way the tuning has to be done to compenstate for any aftermarket meter, not a larger Ford meter. You have to adjust engine displacement and on calibrated meters for larger injectors hi and low slopes on the injectors to get it close. Then you have to dyno tune them from there to get it right. At best you end up with a good WOT readings and a marginal idle.

Three is the way they treated us at last years V6 Ford Challenge Race in Milan Michigan, I won't go into it unless requested but to put it quick they lied for free advertising. I completely lost respect for them when they did that.

Like I said it's just my views and for a stock Explorer their meters may work fine but in MY opinion I would rather someone stick with a Ford factory meter.

Thanks, Doug.

 

[spindlecone]

I know the views here and I've tried to kinda lean away from this info but in my own experiences along with my tuning knowledge I wouldn't recommend a Pro-M or any aftermarket mass air to my worst enemy.

One is because on a n/a engine, 4.0-5.0 in an Explorer, your not going to outflow it. Spend your hard erned money where it's best, in a good air intake system and cat-back exhaust. From there get a SCT product, chip or tuner, and you've done just about everything you can for your daily driver. Now for a racer or someone looking to get every last bit you may wanna get the headers but those too aren't something I would recommend as a first mod.

Whipple superchargers uses a SOHC 4.0 65mm stock mass air with the supercharger kits for the 3.0. Explorer Express uses the stock 65mm mass air meter with the BASE kit, anything over base and you'd need to go to an 80mm GT or some other Ford meter.

Two is the way the tuning has to be done to compenstate for any aftermarket meter, not a larger Ford meter. You have to adjust engine displacement and on calibrated meters for larger injectors hi and low slopes on the injectors to get it close. Then you have to dyno tune them from there to get it right. At best you end up with a good WOT readings and a marginal idle.

Three is the way they treated us at last years V6 Ford Challenge Race in Milan Michigan, I won't go into it unless requested but to put it quick they lied for free advertising. I completely lost respect for them when they did that.

Like I said it's just my views and for a stock Explorer their meters may work fine but in MY opinion I would rather someone stick with a Ford factory meter.

Thanks, Doug.

Doug, you were treated badley at a Challange race for free advertizing, you lost respect, that makes the product bad?
Are plenty of accolades for the Pro-M on any ford site you choose to visit, including this site.

 

[Doug904]

Doug, you were treated badley at a Challange race for free advertizing, you lost respect, that makes the product bad?
Are plenty of accolades for the Pro-M on any ford site you choose to visit, including this site.

No, I've stated my reasons in the two above that one. Poor quality, poor tuning adjustability, poor customer service. The other reason was just an add on and that's why I didn't go into more detail.

Thanks, Doug.

 

[spindlecone]

No, I've stated my reasons in the two above that one. Poor quality, poor tuning adjustability, poor customer service. The other reason was just an add on and that's why I didn't go into more detail.

Thanks, Doug.

Poor quality? how so? adjustibility, customer service, the other reasons?
the devils in the details Doug,
Pls elude in detail all you hate about The Pro.M.
Might help the fools that may want to buy one down the road.

 

[Interstate]

How are MAFS's supposed to be adjustable?

 

[huskyfan23]

I'll tell you what I hate about Pro-M, the $220 pricetag with the gains of a TB spacer or Tornado.

 

[celly]

I'll tell you what I hate about Pro-M, the $220 pricetag with the gains of a TB spacer or Tornado.

LOL, I sensed a comment like that might be forthcoming.

 

[spindlecone]

How are MAFS's supposed to be adjustable?

At manufacture they are adjusted for:Injector curves, set points Kg/HR,actual flow,KG/HR,Read volts of 90 samples over 5 seconds, highest read volts, lowest read volts, sigma volts, chamber pressures and pressure drops.
Stuff you cannot do at home.

 

[Doug904]

Poor quality? how so? adjustibility, customer service, the other reasons?
the devils in the details Doug,
Pls elude in detail all you hate about The Pro.M.
Might help the fools that may want to buy one down the road.

Poor Quality and Adjustability = Have you ever had a car with a pro-m on a dyno since you go so many times? They can be a nightmare to tune with because the calibration sheet they send is nothing more then a blank peice of paper to an SCT dealer. Unless you have one calibrated for your stock size injectors then you have to adjust items in the tuning such as engine displacement in order to FOOL the computer into getting the correct load values for the spark and fuel tables. If you put a larger FORD mass air meter you don't have to do this. ALso while adjusting these values the resolution of the meter can really be bad at low ad counts, or volts for you guys not familiar with the software, and this can cause idle problems or even tip in throttle issues.


Customer Service = Now this was before I started my tuning services that I would have to send in a meter two or three times to get it even close. I finally broke down and purchased one of the adjustable MAF tuner's like in ALdive's post to be able to get my truck to run right at idle and WOT, and this was when it was n/a. I never could get any answers from Pro-M to if they had gotten it or sent it out. It was just like you sent it off and then waited till you got it back, no updates or if you called good luck even getting anyone who knew about it.

Like I've said the gains are minimul like a TB spacer because it does nothing to your setup but fool the PCM into adjusting the a/f ratio and in turn can do more harm then help. The stock mass air is ten times better then theirs and the funny part is they even say it on their own website.


Now you wanna see a post about the last part check out this post.....

http://v6power.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30039&highlight=

Thanks, Doug.

 

[spindlecone]

Doug
The last 3 dynos, I had the Pro-M, I got no nightmares, just great numbers.
And Mine hase been adjusted to my injectors

 

[boominXplorer]

ok i have a pro-m and 19lb factory injectors on my 5.0. I have 24lb injectors and an availible cobra mas for the 4.6 and 24lb injectors. Would it work?

 

[Doug904]

Like I said most of these issues come from higher performance vehicles then a stock SOHC. Either way I say the stock SOHC doesn't really benefit from a pro-m but since you have dyno results I'd love to know what your gains were from one? All of my SOHC's dyno results I've posted have been with the stock mass air so I'd like to see one with a pro-m.

Thanks, Doug.

 

[Doug904]

ok i have a pro-m and 19lb factory injectors on my 5.0. I have 24lb injectors and an availible cobra mas for the 4.6 and 24lb injectors. Would it work?

When I goto my base files and look at a 00' Explorer file and a 96-98 Cobra file and a 99-00 Cobra file I see that the transfer functions are greatly different. It may but without having an a/f reading after you put it on it may not in stock form. Now if you have an SCT product the dealer can load the value files for injectors and you can use your stock mass air meter OR they can load the Cobra mass air meter transfer function and the 24lbs injector values into your PCM and make them work like that. Still I would highly recommend some form of a/f readings to ensure they are correct but it would get you close.

See by adjusting the values in the PCM there isn't a need for having a calibrated meter. So basically you could run any meter with any injector.

For example, I dyno tuned a 02 SHM Mustang GT this weekend and he had the Pro-charger kit. Well he started out with the stock 80mm meter, that pegged at 5200 rpm's. Then we swapped it out with a 90mm Lightning mass air and all I did was load the value file and that got it running and then I adjusted the transfer function to fine tune everything to 11.5:1. He also had 38lbs injectors which we're fine, we started his tuning out using his stock mass air and the 38's and then changed over to a lighting mass air and still kept the 38's. Lightning's come factory with 42's so in this example we see that factory meter's aren't really calibrated to injector sizes.

On a side note his fuel pump gave out at 393 rwhp at 5500 rpm's, his a/f went up on a perfect 45 degree angle. He's still got atleast another 500 rpm's but we let out when the a/f went north and I set his rev limiter to 5200 for the week. He'll have a focus pump installed this week and we'll be going back this weekend to finish him up. We're expecting somewhere in the 400's-420's rwhp.

Thanks, Doug.