Moab! May 31-June 2, 2002

[GJarrett]

Jim, sorry to hear that, but I understand. It's hard to move sometime besides the end/beginning of a month since that's when leases expire and etc.

Matt, as Matt said - oops, I just got confused - Double Whammy and Golden Crack are both on the Golden Spike run, and I am hoping/planning to do that Saturday. The other two obstacles are both in the same area (the town landfill, near Lion's Back and Hell's Revenge) and sooner or later we always end up going out there sometime during the weekend. I can't remember - you bobbed your Ranger bed, didn't you? I don't think Dump Bump will be possible without a bobbed bed - it's extremely vertical and abrupt - and requires very good approach and departure angles to mount it.

Matt Adams - I just got resv at Silver Sage and will need a roomie again this year. Cheapest motel in town and half price if we split it. You won't get cheaper unless you camp out in a sandstorm again. What do you say?

 

[mattadams]

Gerald, is the youngin comin this year? I don't want to have to hurt him like I did last year, ROFL j/k

 

[GJarrett]

Nope, he won't be there and embarrass you by kicking your shins and whippin' your butt, lol. And I'm fairly certain there won't be any latenight collegiate keg parties at the motel to keep you up like out at the campsite either

 

[tdavis]

Originally posted by GJarrett
Nope, he won't be there and embarrass you by kicking your shins and whippin' your butt, lol.

Please, no jokes about Matt's butt..

It was bad enough at CCR2001 he was mooning everyone at every stop.

 

[mattadams]

LOL I promise a moon-free moab 2002! .
Gerald, I will tentatively be your roommate so you can put me down for that.

 

[RockRanger]

Originally posted by GJarrett

Matt, as Matt said - oops, I just got confused - Double Whammy and Golden Crack are both on the Golden Spike run, and I am hoping/planning to do that Saturday. The other two obstacles are both in the same area (the town landfill, near Lion's Back and Hell's Revenge) and sooner or later we always end up going out there sometime during the weekend. I can't remember - you bobbed your Ranger bed, didn't you? I don't think Dump Bump will be possible withoug a bobbed bed - it's extremely vertical and abrupt - and requires very good approach and departure angles to mount it.

The bed hasn't been bobed yet. It should be by then though That all sounds good. Cant wait to get out there and have some fun. Trying to figure out right now how i can trailer my truck out so if I break i can get home. We will see if that happens.

Matt

 

[Ray Lobato]

Hey Gerald,
I would be more than happy to Tailgun for you on the runs you are leading.

 

[GJarrett]

Kris, I had planned on Flat Iron Mesa for Friday but how about going up Rose Garden Hill (4) to Top of the World? I've been to TOTW 3 times already but if we went via Rose Garden Hill I'd try that. I'm sure there will also be a huge stocker group going via the main "3 rated" trail anyway so the choice is yours.

Ray, thanks. I am going to lead Metal Masher on Sunday morning and probably Seven Mile Rim that afternoon. I'd like to do Golden Spike on Saturday but have never done the Golden Spike section, though I've run both ends (Poison Spider Mesa and Gold Bar Rim). I'm hoping for someone to go that can lead Golden Spike instead of me.

 

[Rick]

New Policy for "Serious Explorations" runs

After a disappointing turnout at the Truck Haven run (25 showed out of 43 sign ups). I
decided to implement a new policy for all runs which are set up as "Serious Explorations"
runs. Including the upcoming Arizona run and the Moab run.

Here it is... There will be a $20 registration fee for the run which will be refundable in full
when you show up. If you don't show up you forfeit the fee and it will go to the site and or
the organizer of the event.

If you show up to the event without registering don't expect a place at the table when we
go out for a group dinner or have any other "special" events such as the pot luck.

We have the registration forms there for a reason. We need to know how many vehicles of
what caliber will be there so we know what trails we can run, how many seperate runs per
day and how many leaders are needed.

If this doesn't work out I'm perfectly willing to drop the whole organized event thing.

Sorry to be so harsh, but last year we had about 50 sign up and 25 arrived. We attributed
it to the rain which was forcast last year, but this year that wasn't an excuse. The weather
was as good as it gets for desert wheelin'.


To ensure your spot at the Moab run please send $20 to my paypal accout ab7fh@inficad.com or by check to:

Rick Horwitz
4515 West Dailey St.
Glendale, AZ 85306

Funds will be returned when you arrive.

 

[Rick]

Due to a discussion in the moderator forum it was decided in order to protect from liability all of those who help organize the runs we need to prohibit anyone under the age of 18 from attending the runs unless accompanied by a parent or legal guardian.

The reason for this is twofold. 1. To keep the organizers from being held liable for damage to vehicles and personal injury. 2. If injurys are sustained to a minor hospitals cannot administer services without parental consent unless the injuries are life threatening. That means you could be sitting in a Moab hospital with broken leg until they could get consent from your parents to set it!

The good samaritan laws were mentioned, but that would only apply to first responders and not to medical personel at a hospital.

Sorry for the hassle, but it goes along with the crazy times we're living in.

 

[RockRanger]

I have a friend in a heep that wants to join us. what does everyone think of that? he is not real sure he would be able to make it but just wandering what everyone thinks. he would be running the big dawg trails as he is on 35"s with lockers front and rear. Is thsi cool with everyone or should i say no to him.

Matt

 

[Jefe]

Originally posted by RockRanger
I have a friend in a heep that wants to join us. . .

My brother and his Jeep is also interested in going. any complaints?

 

[Ray Lobato]

Rick the check is in the Mail.

 

[Kris Guilbeaux]

I dont have a Problem with Heeps Going. But just remember to tell them not to complain when the Explorer Show them up on the Trails


What does every one else think.

 

[Heath]

I'm personally not for it... We didn't allow it at CCR because its an Explorer run...

I just feel that the Serious Explorations sponsored runs should be Explorers, Navajos, Bronco II and Rangers...

Just my opinion...

 

[mattadams]

we have let jeeps go along on our runs before and I personally have no problem with it. I've also taken my explorer up with jeep clubs and they seem to have no problem with it.

 

[GJarrett]

Other Makes

I've struggled with this one and have hesitated to reply, but here goes.

I don't know what I think.

I have no problems with Jeeps and others on our "minor" runs, and I enjoy joining them when invited on theirs. But what about events like the Explorer runs at THaven, Moab, and CCR? These are our major "theme" identity runs and something special for me to go to. Why? In order to meet and run with other Explorers (or Navajo/Ranger/etc). There is TDS at THaven and EJS at Moab for mixed runs for everybody.

I had a blast last November running Hells Revenge and Moab Rim with Gene Day in his built TJ. Make no mistake: you won't meet a nicer guy or more knowledgeable fourwheeler. I'd love to run with him again. But this is an Explorer site trying to organize a run for Explorer owners to join and meet each other. Mixed runs are everywhere and all the time. We've all been on those also.

Should we forget about having major Explorer runs and just have generic runs instead? Is there any personal sense of belonging when we see the group photos of a couple of dozen Explorers together? Would that change if there were a few Explorers and all kinds of other makes and models in the photo with us? Is that selfish and shortsighted? Jeeps do not seem to be the main focus of EJS anymore even though it is still named for Jeeps, but we are a LONG way from that, I think.

I have all the opportunity in the world to run with Jeeps everywhere I go fourwheeling. I can go to Moab during EJS and see all I want. I'd like to go there during our Explorer event because I can meet Explorer owners.

On the other hand, many of us have family and friends with Jeeps, Scouts, Toys, etc; and Moab is a major trip of a lifetime, and it is understandable to want to share that with them.

It seems that we always top out at 25 or so Explorers at our major runs. Another couple of years inviting everyone and we will be the minority on our own runs. Does everyone here feel comfortable meeting a couple dozen Explorer owners along with that many or more others and not having it as an Explorer run anymore? Yeah, it will only be two or five others this year, but once we drop the "Explorer" Run, in a couple more years it will be a lot more.

How many of us will be needed to coordinate different runs/trails/events, lead and tailgun trails, set up group dinners, correspond with the BLM for fees since we will then be at the level requiring previous approval and fee payment with local authorities, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc in preparation to prepare for serving who-knows-who will show up that aren't even members of our site? I haven't even mentioned the not-so-small legal liability issues we are already struggling with and will surely reach a whole new level once we decide to put on "public" (for lack of a better term) events. Whomever here is going to step up and invest the significant legal expense required to mitigate the liability required to protect all of us from financial ruin from the public hasn't posted on this thread yet. Heck, guys, all I wanted to do was go play on some trails with a few friends that also own an Explorer.

I do find it interesting that this is coming up. I've seen 4wd articles where XJs have a group doing a Moab run, or Isuzu has a big event, or like last year the Land Rovers were there when we were. I don't know of the XJs having TJs in their group, much less Toyotas or Explorers: and I saw Land Rovers in the Land Rover group (not Jeeps), and I saw Isuzus in the Isuzu group.

Are we going to keep our identity, or go generic aka EJS when EJS is already available? If you're in a mixed group interested in THaven, why not go to TDS instead of the Explorer run?

From my own personal perspective I would never have thought of inviting myself into the Land Rover group, or joining the Moab XJ or Isuzu group, so I am a little at a loss to understand why another make's owner wants to even go on our run in the first place. It has never occurred to me to join a group of built Suzuki Samarais during their major nationwide run and pose in some of their pictures. Why do we as Explorer owners even have to deal with this question???

Once again, I am referring to our major "Explorer" events and not all of the local stuff we all do with all of our friends. donkey boy brought his WJ on our GWNF run a couple of weeks ago, I was happy to finally meet him and get to know him, and in my opinion the weekend would have been less for all of us if he had not shown up to join along.

I repeat that I do NOT have an opinion and don't know what to say; only that I am struggling with this. I do know that I will miss the "bonding" of a defined Explorer event should we expand to everyone, but I've also got friends with other makes too and don't know why I should have a leg to stand on to tell them they are not welcome.

 

[offroadkc]

Is it just me or does it seem like this "FUN" is becoming WAY too difficult?

 

[GJarrett]

Amen.

I'm currently working on a super-secret "Explorer Serious Explorer Explorations" forum. Send in your VIN with proof of purchase and you'll be supplied with the code ring and instructions for access

 

[RockRanger]

Gerald, I fully understand and support you with what you are saying. I never really thought of all the "behind the scenes" stuff that is required. sound good then keep it based on ford platform then.

The simple reason I asked in that for some (including me) this is more then likely the only time i will ever be able to get there and wheel so was seeing if another friend in the same situation would be able to do it as well.

Ok now that we booted out all the jeeps etc what about my other friend with an escape Just joking

As offroadkc said if it becomes to the point where it is no longer fun then stop doing it. I have been to events where those putting them on weren't haveing fun and it made it a bad time for everyone.

Matt