New GT-40 'P' Headers in Summit

[jjue]

My installation sheet says to torque the header bolts to 10-15 ft-lbs the first time and 18-24 ft-lbs the 2nd time.

 

[MikeTEC]

Thanks so much! Sure looks like the design of the 97s is better thought out than the 96s. Hope they knew what they were doing when they built mine. I am going ahead with the composition gasket FMS furnished as I given up finding a copper one that matches. Perhaps the Stage 8 bolts I bought will help. Thanks again for the info. Mike

 

[SVO LOU]

I recommend tightening the bolts then tightening them again after a few days so the headers/gaskets have a few heat/cool cycles in 'em. I used the Stage 8's before on my Mustang and put the clips on after a week to make sure everything was staying tight.
If I'm correct, is this the part #(FMS-M-9430-P51) for the ceramic shorties for the later-run 97 5.0?

Thanks.
Lou.

 

[jjue]

Yes, you have the correct part number.

 

[PUR PONY]

ok guys....

these headers in the summit catalog P50 and P51 are NOT explorer headers..... the explorer specific headers are E50 and E51.....


these P50 and P51 and headers for mustangs using the "P" heads. this is the reason that there are no fitting on them.

I am not sure and always wondered if a standard mustang shortie header would fit..... i myself have the E51's on my truck at this time.

I would like to find out more about the FlowTech explorer headers but i too think there is something fishy about them..... no pic, no info.... i think its a messed up add.

 

[james t]

ahhh....... it all makes sense now..... thats why they dont have the EGR bung on them. no one with a modded 'stang with swapped on P heads uses EGR.

"I see", said the blind man.

tried putting them on yet, jjue?

 

[PUR PONY]

yes- i would like to know if they fit.... if so i would get a pair.

 

[jjue]

No, I haven't put them on yet since I'm here in Michigan training for work, and the Mounty is back home in Mississippi. As far as I know, the Explorer-specific headers are the '96 with GT-40 heads, not the GT-40P's. Since I have a '97 with GT-40P's and nothing else fits the P heads but the P headers, I ordered the P headers. From what i can tell, the stock exhaust tubing and the new headers should bolt right on up, but I guess that I may have to wait until I am actually home for at least 2 weeks at a time and the weather is at least in the 50's (fairly common in MS) and I find a MIG or TIG welder to use so tha I can put the EGR fitting on.

 

[tmsoko]

The mustang shorty headers will NOT fit on a 5.0L Explorer. I had an Explorer frame with a 5.0L on it in my Garage right now and have trial fit the mustang headers the collector is too far outboard and hits the frame.

I plan to build a custom set of headers from an old set of Mustang long tubes. All I need is time, as I have the from half of an Explorer frame with the Explorer engine mounts, a 302 block & heads, Explorer oil pan, steering box, and front diff.

I am planning to make mid length 1 3/4" headers. Once I have complete, I will post some pics. I don't see being done with this for some time though.

Anyway, long story short - Mustang headers WILL NOT FIT. I have tried.

 

[jjue]

Originally posted by jjue
No, I didn't get the wrong headers. I have talked to several techs, and the P51's are the correct header, and they are actually normal looking instead of the screwed-up look that the '96 Explorer has.

OK, I'm willing to stand corrected. Since the steering shaft is in the way on the driver's side, the "P" headers will not work. Oh wait, I said that in another post, too. Anyway, it looks like the 1 1/2" primary Explorer headers are all that we can use, and if you want ceramic coating, then you will have to send them off to be coated. I'm sorry for misleading everyone with bad info.

 

[PUR PONY]

what about a set of headers designed for use in a V-8 ranger??? I was thinking of trying a set of kaufmann shortie headers....

the thing is... most people say to use the v-8 ranger headers with the same comapny v-8 ranger motormounts because certain motormounts are in certain locations and some of the custom headers do not work with other companies motor mounts... what i need to fins out is... which companys custom v-8 ranger motor mounts are in the same location as the v-8 explorer.

 

[97BlackX5.0]

okay i must admit i dont know what my truck has on it to begin with.... i thought that the gt-40p heads came on the 5.0 stock..... can someone straighten me out?

 

[jjue]

Starting in '97, the Explorer and Mountaineer V8 came with GT-40P heads. The '96 had GT-40 heads.

 

[LowdPypes]

SOMEONE, on here has put some type of mustang headers on a 98 5.0... I swear I have seen it, I just don't remember who it was. Also, I remember doing a random search in google or something and some guy came up who had some JBA headers on his late model X. Not much to go on but I know it's possible...

 

[james t]

before i ever found this forum, i talked to a JBA rep. on the phone at my local speed shop. he told me that although they dont make headers specificaly for the explorer, they had some that would fit with "very minor modifications". i have no idea what these mods would be, as i didnt ask. i did ask him why they didnt produce them, and he stated that during the testing fase thier's only made like 6hp peak on a stock explorer. he said that the gains were too little to bother producing an explorer specific header.

 

[Nitrous SSC]

I'm in desperate need of headers as well for my 98 Explorer 5.0....the damn flange broke off my passanger side one totaly and its temperarly fixed with cold weld.....I don't know which ones to order!!!....do I order the E50's????

 

[tmsoko]

Hopefully I can shed some light on this.

First, there is only one header that will work on the Explorer V8. It is the E50/E51. These "headers" have the same basic tube design as the factory, only bigger tubes and cleaner bends. Quite an improvement over factory - but far from ideal

Second the P-50/P51 headers WILL NOT WORK. I have trial fitted the mustang style headers on the frame in my garage and they hit the rear a-arm mount and frame.

Third, I have never heard or a JBA header fitting an Explorer V8. I will call them tomorrow, as if it will with simple mods, it will save me one hell of a head ache.

Fourth, the Ranger V8 swap headers will not work either. Those headers are made for the 1997 and older Ranger with the Twin Traction Beam front suspension. Neither the mounts nor the headers will work. The frames are totally different. Different mount location and angle.

OK, now that we have that cleared up, I wanted to let you know why I say these things. I am currently modifying a Kenne Bell 1.5L blower package to fit on the Explorer V8 I have in my 1999 Ranger 4x4. For this engine, I will also have TFS Twisted Wedge heads, 75mm TB, 90mm Lightning MAF, and F150 truck (~TFS) lower manifold.

So, I will need a really good flowing exhaust to get the HP numbers I expect. I have looked at all factotry headers and found none that will fit due to either the frame layout, front driveshaft location, or the huge engine mount plates the Explorer uses.

The next step, which I have taken is to build my own long tube headers. I have managed to put together a complete "buck" in my garage, which consists of the front half of a 1997 Explorer V8, including front axle, steering rack, engine, trans, etc.. I will use this to build the 1 3/4" long tube headers following roughly the same routing as factory, picking up one set of 2.5" cats at the stock second cat location and then finally connecting back up with my current single 3.5" exhaust system.

To anyone who is interested, I have found a place which will custom mandrel bend stainless pipe to my mocked up headers. I plan to build my mock up from a couple sets of mustang headers by cutting and welding the bends. Once complete, I will have them made in one piece stainless tubes and then I will tig weld them together. They will have the CAD/CAM program to bend more sets, so contact me if you are interested. These will not be cheap though, probably in the $1000/set range.

Todd
tmsoko@comcast.net

 

[jjue]

Well, I guess that I'll say it here, too!

While I can swear having a GT-40P heads on my '97 Mounty at one time (If I can only dig up that picture to prove it), it seems as if I have the GT-40's on here now. Either way, the E50/51 headers is what you want, and I can't find the E51 headers, so it looks like I'm sending my E50 headers to JET Hot when I get a chance.

For some of you with leaking problems, you may want to just change the gasket and get good header bolts torqued properly. That's what I did for now, and while it didn't fix all of the ticking, it isn't constant as it was for the last couple of months.

 

[tmsoko]

Just curious, why are you getting them coated? I have the E50s on my truck now, which ave no coating. The headers are 400 series stainless, so they will not rust out and I have put 13K miles on the truck with no engine bay heat issues. It is just an awefully big expense for coating which probably isn't needed.

 

[jjue]

Ceramic coating keeps the engine cooler and helps with exhaust velocity, in effect helping with HP and Torque a little. While it may be a waste for most, I plan to keep the Mounty longer than this current engine will last, and possibly turning it into a fast and/or off-roading project. I figure that it will help me in the mean time since I pull trailers with this vehicle. Larger header primaries typically cause more upper RPM HP but will soften lower RPM torque, but ceramic coating typically remedies the torque problem a little bit.