Strange no start issue- Bat. cable?

[sparkyputerguy]

Sorry this is kinda long- I wanted to post as many details as possible.

Truck: '00 XLT, 4.0 OHV, 74K miles, been running/starting fine until tonight

Situation: Came out of the grocery store and tried starting. Engine would not turn over, no click-click-click, nada. I suspected a dead battery and called my wife to give me a jump (start, that is...) In the meantime, I tried turning the key to accessories and the radio would come on, then go off. Same with lights on the dash and door chimes. There was a clicking sound coming from under the dash and the accessories were turning on and off with the relay clicks.

My honey arrived and I connected the jumper cables and let her truck run for a minute or so. Tried starting the X and at first, nothing. A couple of tries later, it sounded like the starter was spinning but not engaging. Or maybe partially engaging... It was a nasty sound, but it didn't start.

Went home, dropped Mrs. Sparky off and grabbed my toolbox, a flashlight and voltmeter. Headed back to the X.

Voltage on the battery was 12.4. Voltage between the battery and the power distribution box on (engine compartment, driver's side) was 12ish. Reseated both battery cables at the battery and still no luck. No visible corrosion, but from what I've read here, a cable can be rotted out from the inside. Didn't check from the battery to the starter, though.

The relay that was clicking was a small rectangular one from a narrow box inside the truck, under the dash, driver's side. Tried replacing it with an identical one from the spot beside it (switched 'em) and the same place still clicked. Funny thing is that the relay would stop clicking if I turned the headlight switch to on. Truck still wouldn't start tho...

So before I have this monster towed to the dealer$hip, are there any ideas that could help me save a few bucks? New battery? New cables? I read a lot of posts where people were replacing a lot of unnecessary parts before finding a really simple solution.

Thanks and have a great weekend!
-Sparky

 

[Blee1099]

Check the starter solenoid on the firewall and check to see if you hear the fuel pump turning on when you first turn the key. If you didn't tow it to the dealer, I would join you in McLean since I'm work in Northern VA. Also you could have a bad crankshaft position sensor which could cause the same situation.

 

[AlaskanJack]

Hmm I had the same thing happen recently and I ended up tapping a nail between the post and cable end. Nothing and I was getting the same thing as you. I then figur4ed what the heck and put one more nail in between the post and cable end and VRROOOOM. So I guess when one nail wont work try another.


BTW I still haven't replaced my cable and those 2 nails are still there keeping it going.

 

[sparkyputerguy]

One more thing about the relay clicking

The relay inside the truck on the driver's side would click whether the key was in the ignition or not. I ended up unplugging the neg battery cable before I left it tonight in case something *really* wrong would cause it to catch fire or something...

 

[sparkyputerguy]

Thanks for the quick replies, guys. I'll check on those in the a.m.

 

[Anime]

Sometimes when batteries go, they just go. 12.4V isn't dead, but is low. I'd suggest either taking the battery out of the truck, drive home or to a shop and charge it fully, then re-install and see if that makes it start. If you have another battery or can use the one out of another vehicle that would work to at least check it and/or get it home. If this does the trick, just get another battery and trade in the old one, it's not worth getting stranded somewhere.

 

[sparkyputerguy]

Fixed!

It turns out the battery was dead... waaaaay dead. Not that I'm that old or wise, but I've never seen a battery go completely dead between starts. It wasn't slow in starting up leading up to this. Funny thing is that it showed a 12V charge at the parts store but it came up dead on their test equipment.

Could it be a problem with the alternator? I'll keep an eye on it and won't go out on any long trips over the weekend just in case.

Thanks for all your replies! Definitely making a donation to the site since it just saved my butt...

 

[Anime]

take charge

The 7-year old battery I've had that's been through everything and never failed me completely died during a fuel pump install. It happens, just count yourself fortunate to have it happen in the grocery store lot not far from home rather than during a trip in the middle of nowhere.

You can check the alternator by just putting the meter on the battery with the engine running, it should read over 14.0 volts. If it's less, theres something wrong and it might be what killed the battery. Depending on how old the battery is, it might have just gone flat like they tend to do.

Make the ultimate donation and become an Elite Explorer!

 

[drussian409]

The voltage from the alt is dependent on the amount needed to charge the battery. Don't get scared if it seems low at times. Also just because the alt is putting out 14.0 or higher dose not mean it is producing enough current to fill the needs of the truck.

 

[Stefan_J]

Same happened to my 96'

Hi all,

The exact same thing happened to me today. Had the truck outside for a small hand wash with radio turned on. A couple of hours later when I tried to start the engine it just clicked. No sound from the engine at all just a couple of click-click-click. Hooked up a couple of jumper-cables to have it started with a few good extra Amps from my Saab9000 but this didn't help either. Time for dinner and then 15 minutes of search on the Internet. Ended up reading this thread and went out to change the battery (had an old one still laying around that came with the car when I bought it). Once the battery was swapped my good old gal' started up like she used to.

Thank's to this forum I don't have to consult the Ford guys tomorrow Monday and my wife is once again on a good mood(!).

Cheers everyone!

Stefan from Sweden

 

[Papa]

I have had several batteries fail like that. Your first clue was the interior lights and radio dropping out. Second clue was nearly the same symptoms with a jump battery. You can always verify this with a DVM or a test light connected across the battery terminals and turn on the head lights for instance, what you will see is the voltage dropping below roughly 9.5 VDC. A good battery will allow you to crank the engine for fifteen seconds and the battery terminal voltage should never drop below 9.5 VDC, this is called a load test if a charged battery can’t pass the 9.5 VDC test it is considered no good and needs replacing. It really does not make any difference if it is a shorted or open cell in the battery when it does not work. Yes swapping out the battery with a known good battery will work too.

 

[foxy]

alternator

mates, i'm not sure if this is the right place for this but reading your postsyou guys may be able to answer my ? I put a 200 amper in my girl so i ran a seperate heavier cable ie 200amp fuse direct to the batt from the alt leaving the oe disconnected 50amp i took out the 50 amp fuse and found i could'nt start her so i put it back in and away she went my ? is would i be able to run both the oe equip as well as the up grade from the alt ?in other words have both systems running at once ? i put a 200 amp alt in her because i run 3 batt ie for fridge and lights etc i do a lot of off road here in australia yes with aproper batt management system

 

[Papa]

Yes you can run more than one battery off from one alternator. However and especially in the scenario you describe with the refrigerator a component called a battery splitter is the appropriate device. They may be of the mechanical switch kind or solid state. I prefer the solid-state diode type, no moving parts. You could build one but you should find them in the marine supply stores or maybe on the Internet. The diode allows the charging electricity to only flow in one direction so if your refrigerator battery dies you can still start you X and since only charging current flows through the diodes they so not have to be 200 amp. There is a .75 VDC drop across the diode but this does not cause a problem and is expected.

 

[foxy]

alternator

thanks mate, the batt management system i have is a solid state system the name is piranha it allows the main batt to charge first then the others. i have a master switch mounted that allows me to jump start my girl without leads by using the other batts if needed.your answer to my ? allows me to connect the oe system plus the after market to the alt and the main cranking batt ? ok ? the reason i ask is i tried to disconnect the oe but found i could'nt start the girl. i put the oe fuse back and away she went. now i'll reconnect the oe cable plus the larger cable to the alt. the new cable has a 200 amp fuse the oe has a 50 amp. so what your saying is there should'nt be any problems ?

 

[Papa]

Sounds like it should work but you can make sure with a test meter since you can folow the power around the system.

 

[Rawhide]

Hey, guys, similar problem here. The difference is that mine hasn't been fixed.

I heard that the 94 Explorers had faulty positive battery cables, so I changed that first. At the same time, I changed the solenoid. Well, actually, I broke the solenoid connecting the new positive battery cable to it, so I replaced the solenoid.

I tried charging up the battery enought o get it started, but either the battery was bad, or I didn't charge it enough. I bought a new battery. Started up just fine and ran just fine. But the charging system light was on and the battery charge kept slowly decreasing. Within two days, the new battery was almost completely dead.

This morning, I replaced the alternator. Started it up and let it run for a while to see if it would charge up the battery. No good!! What did happen was that after about half an hour, the truck died and the same old click click click. Battery is dead.

Now, I am hearing that there may be an inline fuse between the battery and the alternator that may be blown.

Does this sound likely?
Is the fuse easy to find?
Will I find it if I simply trace the wire from the alternator back to the battery?
What does it look like?
Can the fuse simply be replaced, or do I need to change the whole negative cable?
What else should I ask about?

Thanks!!!!

 

[dejello]

Check in the power distribution box (next to the air filter box) on the passenger side of engine bay. There is a 15amp fuse for the alternator in there.

 

[Rawhide]

Thanks!! I'll check it as soon as I get home tonight.

 

[Rawhide]

By the way, I found and fixed the problem. The fuse was good, so I started checking the wires running from the alternator to the power distribution box and sure enough, I found an odd looking point in one of the wires.

At one point in one of the wires, there was a big bubble. I pulled gently on the wire, and it snapped right in two at the bubble. In the bubble the wire had corroded completely through. I cut off the bad section of the wire and twisted the wires back together.

Very soon I plan to completely replace the wire.