Superchips custom programming

[AaronE19]

hello all-
for a while now I've been thinking of adding a Superchip to the old beast (can't resist the lure of extra ponies). I talked to a rep at the company, described my mods to him, and asked if I'd need a custom program job for such piddly little add-ons. to my surprise, he said yes. he seemed to think that with the intake & exhaust mods I've made I'd end up running lean a lot of the time. ok, so I take it a chip that's programmed to correct for run-lean would be dumping significantly more juice into the fuel/air mix and my gas mileage will take a big crap. anyone second that emotion? is it worth the $$ to get a custom program (I actually forgot to ask exactly how much $$ we're talking about, so an idea about that would be nice too)? I realize that detonation is, to say the least, something one would want to shy away from, but is it really a concern in my case? I know lots of people have made similar mods and was looking for the voices of experience here.

thanks

Aaron

 

[bluescat]

Chris@smartyparts

Aaron;
Make sure you check out the home page here, Chris at Smartyparts is offering Superchips @ $175 for explorer4x4 users. Why don't you email him and ask if there's any extra charge. With the money you save by going through him you can afford the custom program if there's an extra charge. BTW, you are not using the KKM?

 

[AaronE19]

bluescat-
thanks. I've actually already talked to chris, who didn't seem to think that the mods I've made warranted a custom chip. then I talked to the Superchips rep and got a different story... sooo, I thought I'd post my question to the fellas (and ladies) here and see what the consensus was. when I do finally order it, I'll go thru chris, being that he supports members of the site and all.

as for the KKM, no I'm not using one right now and I don't plan to until I can figure out a way to get more clean air under the hood. I've got the K&N/drilled box setup now, which is fine when it's pretty cool outside, but she really bogs when the temperature outside starts climbing. there's nothing like an intake that just sucks hot air from next to the motor to really kill throttle response.

Aaron

 

[Scott B.]

Aaron,

When I got my chip, they didn't seem to think I needed any custom programming with my mods (K&N intake, Platinum plugs @ 0.060"/Jacobs wires, 2 1/2" exhaust) Every once in a while (on hot days) I ping when climbing a hill.

What I need to do is wrap the intake ducting with insulated tape, to keep the air charge as cool as possible - I'm sure that will help with the rare ping.

 

[AaronE19]

Scott-
see, that makes me a little nervous because I'm probably moving a lot more air than you. I forgot to mention that I'm adding a high-flow cat real soon and I think that between the catalytic and the headers she'll be leaned out quite a bit... were you running 92 or 93 octane when it was pinging, or were you using 89? also, is your K&N just a drop-in, or is it a FIPK?

I dunno about all this, guys. that's why I asked...

thanks

Aaron

 

[Scott B.]

Aaron,

My K&N is a FIPK, with intake ducting from a '95 (much straighter and less restrictive than the '93) I run 93 octane fuel. My exhaust is the stock catalytic, 2 1/2" pipe going into a Flowmaster, with dual 2 1/2" tailpipes. I've opened up my plug gap, which could lead to pinging.

If you are going to add headers and a hi-flow cat, I think you need special programming.

 

[bluescat]

Computer Chips adjust F/A mixture

My wife's Volvo has a neat little button in the center console, called Sport/Economy. It changes the shift points, kind of like what the chips do on a permanent basis. But, getting back to the fuel mixture, I thought the computer was supposed to adjust all of this based on the MAS, vacuum and o2 sensors to achieve the right mix. Won't any computer program make these adjustments real-time? Just think if Ford (who owns Volvo) would put a button like this in the Explorer, sounds too simple.

 

[AaronE19]

you're right, any vehicle's ECU adjusts the fuel-air curve to get the proper mixture based on the data it gets from the O2s, MAS, etc. the thing with the aftermarket chips is that they are designed to take advantage of using high-octane fuel (producing a longer-burning, hotter explosion in the combustion chamber and creating more ponies). the stock chips could care less what octane you're running, the only thing you get by running 92 or 93 through a stock computer is cleaner fuel system components because the higher octane stuff burns longer and hotter, ridding you of carbon build-up. aftermarket chips also adjust the shiftpoints to give your 4000-lb 'Sploder that sporty "Volvo feel" ...as if...

 

[SteveVB]

timing advance

I think one thing that needs to be mentioned is the advance curve of the timing that the new chip provides. The performance chips are designed with a curve for performance not general utility, and fuel milage. The higher octane fuel is required for the more aggressive spark advance in the reprogrammed chip to avoid detonation.

This discussion does raise a question, can the engine be made to use more air than the computer can handle? Earlier in the thread Aaron was concerned about running "lean", with a carb I can see it but with the adjustments the comp makes that shouldnt happen- correct? Is there a point where that is not true? The modified airflow is outside the parameters of the system and it can't compensate?

What is the custom super chip cost? Do they have specific engine profiles? I havent done the research on it yet so if you know- enlighten me please. I will be purchasing one in the near future, and my engine has a new comp cam and headers so it sounds like off the shelf may not do it.

Thanks

 

[AaronE19]

Steve-
from what I know about the run-lean condition I described earlier, it is, in fact, a system parameter problem like the ones you described. the only specific example that I've been made aware of is an amount of intake airflow that exceeds the capabilities of a stock MAS, causing the fuel/air mix to lean out too much. I assume similar problems could present themselves elsewhere, but I haven't heard more specifics. what I was wondering was whether I've had a lot of smoke blown up my a$$ over this issue or not... right now it's two votes for a custom program, one vote for off the shelf.

as for your question about specific engine profiles, the answer is yes. matter of fact, when I went to the Superchips site to ask them this question they were advertising a free chip giveaway for someone who could bring them a 90-something Ram with the 360 in it for them to dyno.

I've emailed Chris at Smartyparts regarding the cost of custom program work, and I'll let y'all know when I hear from him.

thanks for the input

Aaron

 

[bluescat]

That's the question- Too Much Air?

Reading SteveVB, I echo the same question, doesn't the engine computer adjust to the increased airflow? If, as Aaron pointed out, the airflow exceeds the capacity of the MAFS, then the answer is simple: a bigger/better MAFS. So, here is the question, if it's a run-lean condition is it the program unable to calculate the increased airflow or the inadequte MAFS. Only the Dyno can tell you. The manufacturers, it seems, are hard put just to get a generic vehicle up on their dyno, much less having the time (or inclination) to do the mods that are almost univeral to us and then clock it. The car of the future must surely allow the driver to adjust these parameters in a friendly way. Long post, sorry, but I'm getting ready to do this thing too after the Flowmaster Delta Flow 50 goes on and who wants to waste money?

 

[AaronE19]

here's the scoop:

I squeezed Chris at Smartyparts for some more info (who should be commended for his rapid-reply, by the way) and here's what I got:

1. custom programming is an extra $125 from Superchips and it just involves richening up the fuel mixture (not much of a "custom" job, if you ask me).

2. the "pinging" or "run-lean" problem is due to MAF calibration and if you've made mods similar to mine the chances are about 50/50 that your motor will suffer this condition. With Smartyparts, you can try a chip out for 30 days and if you experience a run-lean condition, you have the option of returning the chip and getting a custom job. or.....

3. again, in the event that your engine does ping with the chip in there, there are other alternatives to a custom program. one is an adjustable fuel pressure regulator ($70), another is a little gadget that's attached to the stock MAS (about the same $$ as a custom program) that allows you to adjust the mixture from there. Chris states a preference for these fixes over the custom program because you can make further fuel/air adjustments to account for other mods down the line.

phoo! that's a lotta stuff.
Bluescat-
I didn't think to ask about whether getting a different MAS would solve this problem, and after thinking about it for a while I still haven't figured anything out. it sounds as though the stock MAS loses its accuracy after you increase airflow enough, but the fact that one can just buy a "gadget" (I'll have to ask Chris about that one) to adjust the F/A mix from the stock MAS sort of confounds things.

with regard to your comment about settings like these being driver-controlled, that technology's already here. I think it's Hypertech who first came out with a programmer for GM vehicles (don't know about Fords yet). basically does the same thing as the old aftermarket chips, only you can turn it on and off whenever you want and can make your own program. we can't expect anything like that for our older (91-94) Explorers, the technology is just way less versatile and probably not re-writable (that's why a chip has to intercept the data from your various sensors and feed small computerized lies to the ECU so that it gives you more power).

we are the Kings of the Long Posts

Aaron

 

[flyguy]

Sounds like most things have been worked out.. but my understanding is that headers (as far as most bolt ons go) is where you end up getting custom programming. Im going to have to get a new chip soon. as you can see that im doing all these mods. sigh. So its 300 bucks for a custom chip then? Jeez!!! hehe

nick

 

[bluescat]

Custom programming

I started another post for the '01 Superchip. Chris at smartyparts gave me a number to call to find a dealer in my area. Luck of the draw, Amazon Racing ends up being the only one within 125 miles and it's 5 miles from my home. Chris was a real gentleman about the whole thing, knowing of course that Amazon will get the chip business instead of Smartyparts and even said Amazon has a great reputation and will treat me right. Once the codes/chip is ready. I hope other '01 owners will get their chips from Chris at Smartyparts, chris@smartyparts.com .
Anyhow, I will cover the increased airflow, MAFS, run-lean, custom programming and etc. with him and let you all know what he says. The new thread is under the same field.

 

[Ru Dawg]

updated superchip

this doesn't have much to do with custom settings, but i just ordered my Superchip this week, and the guy at performance ford told me there was an update which came out this past monday. i believe my computer code was FIG2. Just thought that someone might like to know this!

 

[Isles4evr]

I hate to interrupt all of this inteligent conversation witha stupid question, but I guess I will. I'm don't know all the terminology yet, so could someone tell me what pinging and running lean mean? I havn't done much to my enging yet, but I want a superchip and I'd like to know if it is running lean or pinging or not, ya know? So I'd appreciate it if someone could inform little old (young) me.

Thanks,
Chris

 

[flyguy]

Okay.. lets see... running lean is when you have to much air compared to your amount of fuel.. running rich is when you have to much fuel to how much air ya got coming in... runing lean is dangerous.. running rich is just a waste of gas. (When sensors go out on the explorer.. the computer automaticly goes to a rich fuel program... so thats why you may see a drop in milage...) Anyways... Ive never understood pinging.. it might have something to do with running lean..im not sure... but everybody says switch to a higher octane gas when you do... So.. whatever. you shouldnt have a problem that would require a superchip to fix if that was your list of mods... you can do quite a bit and keep your stock chip... however.. you do get the benifit of better shift points, more power, and the privelege of using more expensive gas with a superchip. I have a JET chip and love it...

 

[bluescat]

Pre-detonation,

Pinging is nothing more than combustion which occurs too soon as the piston travels towards Top Dead Center (TDC). Advancing the ignition means making the spark occur further Before Top Dead Center (BTDC). Retarding the spark means making the combustion of the Fuel/Air mixture move closer to TDC. Pinging can occur when the ignition is too far advanced, when the octane of the gas is too low, when additional heat from a hot day preheats the fuel/air mixture, etc, etc.
Pinging is actually a pre-explosion inside your cylinder head that can melt pistons, ruin compression and piston rings and destroy the valve train by exerting tremendous pressure on the system when it is not quite ready for it.
Sorry for the long post and hoipe this helps.

 

[2001ExpSport]

Which came first, the chip or the mod?

Ok, so I am going to call Chris for a chip. I just want the chip and I might put in some new sparks and maybe wires with mendrell headers/exhaust and I might mod the intake(ok, so I want more than just a chip). Should I do this first and then get the chip or get the chip and then mod? Is there an order to this crazy stuff or will the CPU compensate?

 

[flyguy]

Well..if your getting headers.. your chip SHOULD be programed for it... you can always do it later at no additional cost.. but its easier if you dont have to mail it back. So.... you could get the headers first... and then get the chip... however.. i heard you dont really benifit as much from all the intake/exhaust upgrades until you get a aftermarket chip... hmmm

nick