Synchros or clutch?

[scott.475]

Having shifting problems, specifically, wehn we come to a stop we often cannot get it to go into gear (manual) without really forcing the lever, most prominent with first gear. My wife is out of state with the Ex visiting my folks, so I sent instruction to my Dad asking him to bleed the clutch, but he feels pretty convinced it is a problem with the suynchros in the transmission, even though we don't have the shifting problem while the Ex is actually in motion. I tried the tests the manuals explained, the lever will NOT move freely between first and reverse, but if I pop the clutch with it running, it does lurch forward then die.

What do you all think? I really think, and hope, it is the clutch.

 

[VairKing]

The way to see if it is the clutch would be to put it in gear, on a very level surface, and push the clutch in and rev up the engine, and make sure the clutch doesnt engage at all. But it sounds to me like you shifter is binding up, could be the shift forks.

 

[scott.475]

Are there shift forks on a hydraulic clutch???

 

[dogfriend]

I don't think it is synchonizers, I think it is either binding of the shift linkage/mechanism or the clutch is not disengaging completely (there is still power applied to the gears while you are trying to shift.

Im leaning more to the first cause though, because if the clutch is not fully disengaging, you should have trouble shifting into gear as well.

 

[scott.475]

I was jsut coming back to defend my ignorance and there was already another post!

Okay, I have never had a transmission apart, so I am guessing the shift fork is actually in the transmission and moves things around. I am really tired and was thinking VairKing was talking about a clutch fork.

So now, I guess I need a consensus. Should I try fixing my tranny first with a rebuild kit, or do the clutch? Can a the shift fork be replaced alone, and do I have to open the tranny to do it, in which case I may as well rebuild it any way? Sorry for all the questions, but I only have a Chilton's manual, and it doesn't talk at all about taking the tranny itself apart.

 

[dogfriend]

Can you shift it easily if the engine is off and the clutch is all of the way in (disengaged)? If not, then it probably means something is wrong in the shift mechanism (inside the transmission).

If it is only a problem when the engine is running, then maybe your clutch isn't disengaging completely. This could be for a couple of reasons: problem with clutch master cylinder, clutch slave cylinder, damage to the clutch itself.

How many miles are we talking about? Clutches don't last forever (either do transmissions).

 

[scott.475]

118,000 miles.

 

[VairKing]

Yup, if it only shifts hard with the truck running, its probably your linkage or shift fork(s) binding up. If it is your linkage, a rebuild is probably necissary, you could probably do it yourself, these things arnt rocket science (like an automatic )

 

[scott.475]

Hate to bring this back up, but I am getting ready to spend the money on the repair now. The shifting problem only occurs when the Ex is standing still. If it is in motion there is no problem at all. Do you still think it is a linkage or shift fork problem?

 

[dogfriend]

Here is what the factory manual (97) says:

Transmission (7003) Difficult to Shift

Possible Source(s):
§ Clutch.

Action(s) to take:
§ CHECK clutch system; refer to «Section 308-01» or «Section 308-02».

Possible Source(s):
§ Lubricant.

Action(s) to take:
§ ADD or REPLACE with specified lubricant.

Possible Source(s):
§ Internal shift mechanism.

Action(s) to take:
§ CHECK internal shift mechanism for smooth operation. REPAIR or REPLACE as required.

Possible Source(s):
§ Sliding gears and/or synchronizers.

Action(s) to take:
§ CHECK for free movement of gears and synchronizers. REPAIR or REPLACE as required.

Possible Source(s):
§ Housings and/or shafts.

Action(s) to take:
§ CHECK for binding condition between input shaft (7017) and engine crankshaft pilot bearing or bushing. CHECK flywheel housing alignment. REPAIR or REPLACE as required.


Transmission Will Not Shift Into One Gear ? All Others OK

Possible Source(s):
§ Manual-shift linkage.

Action(s) to take:
§ REPAIR or REPLACE parts as required.

Possible Source(s):
§ Backup switch ball.

Action(s) to take:
§ If REVERSE is the problem, CHECK backup switch for ball frozen in extended position.

Possible Source(s):
§ Internal components.

Action(s) to take:
§ INSPECT shift rail and fork system, synchronizer system, and gear clutch teeth for restricted travel. REPAIR or REPLACE as required.


Transmission is Locked in One Gear and Cannot Be Shifted Out of That Gear

Possible Source(s):
§ Internal components.

Action(s) to take:
§ INSPECT problem gears, shift rails, and forks, and synchronizer for wear or damage. REPAIR as required.

Possible Source(s):
§ Fork on rail.

Action(s) to take:
§ CHECK shift rail interlock system.

 

[MrShorty]

I've noticed this with my own transmission. What I find helps it shift into first when stopped is to let the clutch out with the shifter in neutral (just to get things spinning) and then put it into gear. Will yours do the same thing? What problems would this indicate, or would this be a normal behavior for a manual transmission?

 

[Telford Weister]

Try this check. First, check to see that you have a normal amount of clutch pedal travel before the clutch engages. Too little, and the clutch or slave cylinder is suspect. With the engine running and the trans in neutral, try shifting into first. If it is hard to do, try shifting into reverse. If you get a ratcheting noise , it means the trans input shaft is spinning, which it should not do with the clutch pedal fully depressed. The problem will be in the pilot bearing area, since that is the only part besides the clutch that can turn the input shaft. Mine does that, and I will have to address it soon. Try using a full synthetic trans fluid to ease the shifting effort a little (I use Mobil One). Your trans will like it a lot, and at your mileage, you are due for a fluid change anyway. Hope this helps.

 

[niteshooter]

Hi it doesn't actually sound like your clutch.

On my X I notice several things just prior to it giving up. Pedal pressure becomes very hard and pedal has to be pushed completely to the floor in order to engage gears. Even while in motion shifting is difficult.

Also felt a slight 'pop' just as the pedal contacted the floorboard. At this point I had the truck into the dealer to have clutch replaced before I got stuck and my left leg gave out.

I got about 180,000 kms on my first clutch and at almost 400,000 I can feel the second one going.

Kevin

 

[hvac man]

I would have to say its the slave cylinder I've replaced two and had the same symtoms you have. Good luck

 

[scott.475]

I am convinced now more than ever that my problem is with the clutch, not the tranny. This morning when I went to drive it I could not get it to go into reverse, while it was running. I turned off the engine and put it in reverse then, with the clutch pedal depressed fully, I tried starting it up again. The Ex lurched backwards is the engine tried turning over. I can't imagine a transmission problem would have caused this. I am sure now that the clutch is just either very worn or the slave cylinder is shot, so I will be ordering up a Luk unit in the next few days and hopefully getting it installed next week.

 

[///Manuel]

I have the exact same symptoms. Hard to shift when idling, if it's hot out, it will hard from the get go. When driving around w/o much stopping everything is fine. I like the idea of the slave cylinder being the cause.
Both my tranny and clutch were replaced a few thousands miles ago.

 

[brandonros]

Hi. I'm dealing with everything exactly as you're describing it in my '93 sport. Just today the trans got worse and did the grinding in reverse thing. But the worst part is putting all your strength into getting it to go into first in stop-and-go traffic. Scott or anybody else, I was wondering if you'd pinpointed the problem and gotten it fixed. If so, what did it take and/or around how much did it cost? Should I get my trans rebuilt or just get the slave cylinder replaced?
Thanks,
Brandon

 

[///Manuel]

Well when my car started to do that, I had the tranny rebuilt and clutch master and slave replaced. Now, I'm only getting the problem when my car idles. As long as I keep moving shifting is not a problem.

 

[scott.475]

I did some updates in my "URGENT! Cluth help!" thread. I replaced the whole cluth (disc, plate, slave cylinder and had the flywheel faced). This seems to have fixed the problem, all though I have only been driving it again now for about three days. But it is shifting sooo much better. Bleeding the cylinder was a real pain, a REAL pain. I think my old slave cylinder was leaking pretty badly because there was no fluid in the reservoir when I took the clutch apart. Unfortunately, I did not check the reservoir before dismantling, or let it go empty during the process, which is why I think I got so much air in the system. Make sure your reservoir is full before you take your clutch apart to help avoid getting too much air in there. Read through my updates once my panic had subsided here...http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=74979

Also, I spent a wasted day monitoring the wrong reservoir! The master cylinder for the clutch is pretty small and actually mounted to the firewall, almost under the lip of the fender. My manual did not show that, but actually showed pictures of the brake reservoir, so I thought they both ran from the some one! Make sure you are monitoring the right reservoir.

 

[eclipse5302]

I've got kind of the same problem. If I push the clutch in, and shift into first at a stop, engine idleing, I have to wait about 3-4 seconds before I can shift into gear. Reverse grinds as well unless I wait for a couple of seconds...then there is no grinding. Shifting is OK while driving...but it could be a little easier. But it seems that if I just wait for a couple of seconds after pushing the clutch in, the truck will shift fine. Trans was rebuilt about 60k miles ago, and the clutch fluid is just fine. Any thoughts?

Also, when those slave cylinders go bad, do they just leak or do the fail internally? In other words, will I be able to see the fact that the slave has failed (leaking fluid)?

Is there any more info on this "shifting mechainism" problem? (If that is my problem...)

Jason