Who is dissatisfied with the 2020 Ten-Speed Trans

[KKRISKAL]

If only there was a way for us to check the transmission fluid level.....

How is it serviced? I am guessing there is a fill plug somewhere and you hook it up to a machine that cycles out the old and injects new fluid until the old is gone?

At least you can drop the pan on this trans unlike the one on our old edge.... Sealed for life for your "convince"

Yeah, to change the trans fluid, they connect this machine which flushes out the old oil and fills the new fluid. My previous lincoln was the same.

 

[Zeeb]

Good hell, sell 'em ALL...

 

[LincolnAviFan]

I was not a big fan of our tranny on the 2020 Explorer ST. At certain points, it made the vehicle 'jump' and you could feel a certain shake while it was shifting. Even a new software reset for it did not help.

However, the 10 speed on the Aviator GT (which, to my understanding, is slightly different) feels very smooth. No jumps there so far.

 

[MrQ]

I have the 10 speed (6r80 not 6r60, slightly different) in my 2018 F150 shop truck bolted to the 3.5 eco.

First thing I noticed was it's shifting around town like it was hunting for gears. Downshifts were delayed and MASSIVE, highway driving is excellent, but I don't like driving that thing unless I need to use the toll tag. I think Ford tuned it to aggressively get to and hold higher gears as much as possible for fuel economy.

My 217k mile 6r80 shifts better than that thing. Although in Sport mode that 3.5 is NO JOKE, coupled with the super sensitive steering and a high center of gravity that thing scared the crap out of me. As most people around me can attest I am a very aggressive driver (I have had speeding tickets in nearly every vehicle I have owned) so not much scares me, but that engine... damn.

 

[FinPHEV]

I was not a big fan of our tranny on the 2020 Explorer ST. At certain points, it made the vehicle 'jump' and you could feel a certain shake while it was shifting. Even a new software reset for it did not help.

However, the 10 speed on the Aviator GT (which, to my understanding, is slightly different) feels very smooth. No jumps there so far.

In PHEV -model, the 10-speed is a bit hard to identify, as the model is so new that no information is available on the internet. Does someone have an idea where I could look for the transmission specification?

Euro-model does not have the sticker on the driver's side. I would guess that it is some variant of the 10R80-MHT. The version might be even heavier, though, as the electrical motor is driven through the transmission. The factory torque output is 825Nm which is already over the 800Nm design limit for the 10R80.

I'm also curious because if the transmission is already over the factory's design limit, people should be aware of it if remapping the petrol engine.

Regarding the shift quality: If compared to ZF transmissions found in Audi and BMW or Mercedes transmissions, this is simply from another planet. This transmission kind of feels like a truck transmission. It's clunky, especially when cold. Upshifts could be quicker and in lower RPM. It just feels like the tranny is not using torque but upshifting around 2500-3000 RPM even during light acceleration. It is a 10-speed transmission, and there is a lot of torque available, so the RPM range could be a lot lower. The difference might be in programming, as Germans usually start from a standstill with 2nd or even 3rd gear with torque converter open. Ford seems to prefer 1st gear in even light load/acceleration and locking the gears quickly. When there is more shifting action, there is more judder to be felt.

 

[1sttimeexplorerowner]

In PHEV -model, the 10-speed is a bit hard to identify, as the model is so new that no information is available on the internet. Does someone have an idea where I could look for the transmission specification?

Euro-model does not have the sticker on the driver's side. I would guess that it is some variant of the 10R80-MHT. The version might be even heavier, though, as the electrical motor is driven through the transmission. The factory torque output is 825Nm which is already over the 800Nm design limit for the 10R80.

I'm also curious because if the transmission is already over the factory's design limit, people should be aware of it if remapping the petrol engine.

Regarding the shift quality: If compared to ZF transmissions found in Audi and BMW or Mercedes transmissions, this is simply from another planet. This transmission kind of feels like a truck transmission. It's clunky, especially when cold. Upshifts could be quicker and in lower RPM. It just feels like the tranny is not using torque but upshifting around 2500-3000 RPM even during light acceleration. It is a 10-speed transmission, and there is a lot of torque available, so the RPM range could be a lot lower. The difference might be in programming, as Germans usually start from a standstill with 2nd or even 3rd gear with torque converter open. Ford seems to prefer 1st gear in even light load/acceleration and locking the gears quickly. When there is more shifting action, there is more judder to be felt.

Spot on.

The 10 speed is actually good but there are different "tunes" depending on the car and unfortunately we got the not so good tune on the explorers lol.

The 10 speed in my friends camaro SS is AMAZING. Shifts almost as good as the ZF 8 speed.

The ZF 8 speed is probably the best auto you can get today. Every manufacturer that has adopted this trans into their cars did it for a reason. BMW did it for a reason, bentley did it for a reason. All of the high performance FCA cars have them for a reason. It's the best transmission i ever experienced.

 

[peterk9]

The Detailed Vehicle Specifications for my Aviator shows TRANSMISSION TRET 10 SPD AUTO TRANSMISSION-10R60 (IND=A)
I'm not sure what the (IND=A) means but the transmission shifts very smoothly.

Peter

 

[mw40xlt]

I'd highly recommend if you think it feels like an issue take it into the dealer. I started saying about a week after I bought my XLT last year that something wasn't right. A month later I went to the dealer and did a ride-along with a tech who said the issue was "I'm an aggressive driver." I tried adjusting my "style of driving" but it actually got worse. I had a few friends and my neighbor drive my XLT and they all said something wasn't right. In December, I had a major shift issue in rush hour and a road trip that literally made me car sick as the driver. Took it into the shop and guess what... the transmission is bad. Now I've been fighting them for almost two months on this and a bunch of electrical issues. I took to Fords facebook page and the number of people who express transmission failures not "sensitivities" is disappointing. Get it checked, document, and stand your ground for a fix. Oh, the loaner 2021 XLT they have me in is starting to do the same thing at just 500 miles with the added obnoxious noise while running the defroster or heater on high.

 

[blwnsmoke]

In PHEV -model, the 10-speed is a bit hard to identify, as the model is so new that no information is available on the internet. Does someone have an idea where I could look for the transmission specification?

Euro-model does not have the sticker on the driver's side. I would guess that it is some variant of the 10R80-MHT. The version might be even heavier, though, as the electrical motor is driven through the transmission. The factory torque output is 825Nm which is already over the 800Nm design limit for the 10R80.

I'm also curious because if the transmission is already over the factory's design limit, people should be aware of it if remapping the petrol engine.

Regarding the shift quality: If compared to ZF transmissions found in Audi and BMW or Mercedes transmissions, this is simply from another planet. This transmission kind of feels like a truck transmission. It's clunky, especially when cold. Upshifts could be quicker and in lower RPM. It just feels like the tranny is not using torque but upshifting around 2500-3000 RPM even during light acceleration. It is a 10-speed transmission, and there is a lot of torque available, so the RPM range could be a lot lower. The difference might be in programming, as Germans usually start from a standstill with 2nd or even 3rd gear with torque converter open. Ford seems to prefer 1st gear in even light load/acceleration and locking the gears quickly. When there is more shifting action, there is more judder to be felt.

Ford rates transmissions at the input shaft, which is after the multiplication of the torque converter.



And Ford rates their transmissions in lb/ft of torque, not nm.

 

[FinPHEV]

Ford rates transmissions at the input shaft, which is after the multiplication of the torque converter.



And Ford rates their transmissions in lb/ft of torque, not nm.

The lb/ft vs. Nm issue was precisely what was in my mind. Still, there is no source available stating the torque specification would be 800lb/ft for the 10R80(-MHT) transmission. Instead, tens of sources point out that the capacity is 800Nm=590lb/ft. Maybe the uncommon Nm specification is due to the tranny being a GM-Ford joint venture.

The PHEV model combined factory output for the engine, and electric motor is 825Nm (~618lb/ft). This is why I thought the transmission might be some other model, which is heavier than 10R80-MHT, found in the US hybrid model. There is no information available on the PHEV transmission yet, as the model is so new. Maybe more information starts to leak when the Aviator PHEV with the same powertrain comes out in the states.

Regarding shift quality issue: The local dealership reset all adaptation for the PCM and AWD modules and drove the adaptation cycle, which helped a lot. This meant that all the self-learning processes for engine, transmission, and AWD system were carried out again. Something must have been wrong with the adaptations when the car was new.

A friend of mine has FORScan. Can we find out from the data which transmission variant there really is?

 

[blwnsmoke]

The lb/ft vs. Nm issue was precisely what was in my mind. Still, there is no source available stating the torque specification would be 800lb/ft for the 10R80(-MHT) transmission. Instead, tens of sources point out that the capacity is 800Nm=590lb/ft. Maybe the uncommon Nm specification is due to the tranny being a GM-Ford joint venture.

The PHEV model combined factory output for the engine, and electric motor is 825Nm (~618lb/ft). This is why I thought the transmission might be some other model, which is heavier than 10R80-MHT, found in the US hybrid model. There is no information available on the PHEV transmission yet, as the model is so new. Maybe more information starts to leak when the Aviator PHEV with the same powertrain comes out in the states.

Regarding shift quality issue: The local dealership reset all adaptation for the PCM and AWD modules and drove the adaptation cycle, which helped a lot. This meant that all the self-learning processes for engine, transmission, and AWD system were carried out again. Something must have been wrong with the adaptations when the car was new.

A friend of mine has FORScan. Can we find out from the data which transmission variant there really is?

Take this for what it's worth, I have discussed transmissions with a Ford transmission engineer who developed the transmissions in the super duties and he has said the following. He also helped develop the software that Ford uses to tell if you tune a vehicle. He has been a forum members for 15+ years so I would tend to believe him but YMMV.

Ford has always rated transmissions based on ft-lbs and not newton meters. So the 6r100 is rated for 1,000 ft-lbs and the 6r140 is rated for 1,400 ft-lbs. What you're not taking into account is the torque multiplication ratio of the torque converter.

 

[FinPHEV]

Take this for what it's worth, I have discussed transmissions with a Ford transmission engineer who developed the transmissions in the super duties and he has said the following. He also helped develop the software that Ford uses to tell if you tune a vehicle. He has been a forum members for 15+ years so I would tend to believe him but YMMV.

Ford has always rated transmissions based on ft-lbs and not newton meters. So the 6r100 is rated for 1,000 ft-lbs and the 6r140 is rated for 1,400 ft-lbs. What you're not taking into account is the torque multiplication ratio of the torque converter.

I will be more than happy if 800 lb/ft is the correct value, as it would leave a nice headroom for tuning after my warranty has expired.

And whatever the design limit is, this tranny seems to have a robust reputation, taking more than enough in many tuned cars.

 

[themishmosh]

Regarding shift quality issue: The local dealership reset all adaptation for the PCM and AWD modules and drove the adaptation cycle, which helped a lot. This meant that all the self-learning processes for engine, transmission, and AWD system were carried out again. Something must have been wrong with the adaptations when the car was new.

That can certainly help. My car was pretty rough shifting in low gears when new. After I pulled the battery cable reset the transmission adaptive learning, it drove much better. However, early builds can also benefit from new calibrations to the PCM and AWD modules. Tell your dealer your shifting is rough, even after doing the adaptive learning, and push for them to update the modules.

 

[RedDen]

It seems to me that all the issues with transmission come from firmware. I wonder if Aviator's one's can be downloaded into Explorer since they have the same tranny?

 

[Broke(n)]

I've had my 2020 for about 8 months now and Ive had dealer look at it twice for transmission issues. Issues they say are not there.
Ive got the 'Limited' and a lot of times its as if the transmission is in the wrong gear at low speeds.
If I'm driving in the city and speed limit lowers, I let off the gas and let car slow down then apply gas to that speed. But the entire car will shake and as its as if I'm in a really high gear. Imagine starting off in 5th gear on a manual from a stop. Is this really normal? Ive even had it happen on freeway if I slow down then apply gas a little.
Dealer had my car for a week (I know they only got to it the day I got it back) and tell me nothing is showing up. Unfortunatly I wasnt able to produce issue with mechanic as dealer is in busy area and I cant really joy ride because of all the traffic in the area. So hard to reproduce for them unless I kidnap them on a 10 mile drive somewhere.

 

[1sttimeexplorerowner]

I've had my 2020 for about 8 months now and Ive had dealer look at it twice for transmission issues. Issues they say are not there.
Ive got the 'Limited' and a lot of times its as if the transmission is in the wrong gear at low speeds.
If I'm driving in the city and speed limit lowers, I let off the gas and let car slow down then apply gas to that speed. But the entire car will shake and as its as if I'm in a really high gear. Imagine starting off in 5th gear on a manual from a stop. Is this really normal? Ive even had it happen on freeway if I slow down then apply gas a little.
Dealer had my car for a week (I know they only got to it the day I got it back) and tell me nothing is showing up. Unfortunatly I wasnt able to produce issue with mechanic as dealer is in busy area and I cant really joy ride because of all the traffic in the area. So hard to reproduce for them unless I kidnap them on a 10 mile drive somewhere.

I'm gonna contact my dealer this summer to have them do a fluid change. Even though i'll have to pay out of pocket. I'll do some research on "better" fluid for these 10 speeds.

It's either the fluid or the stock tune. Because the same 10 speeds in other cars work better. The 10 speed in my friends camaro SS is BUTTER. And he's on the stock trans tune. No jerking, no delayed shifts, no lurching on the downshifts, it's perfect.

 

[peterk9]

I'm gonna contact my dealer this summer to have them do a fluid change. Even though i'll have to pay out of pocket. I'll do some research on "better" fluid for these 10 speeds.

It's either the fluid or the stock tune. Because the same 10 speeds in other cars work better. The 10 speed in my friends camaro SS is BUTTER. And he's on the stock trans tune. No jerking, no delayed shifts, no lurching on the downshifts, it's perfect.

As long as your vehicle is under warranty, the dealer may not want to put in any fluid other than what Ford recommends, even if you're paying for it. Let us know please.

Peter

 

[Broke(n)]

I'm gonna contact my dealer this summer to have them do a fluid change. Even though i'll have to pay out of pocket. I'll do some research on "better" fluid for these 10 speeds.

It's either the fluid or the stock tune. Because the same 10 speeds in other cars work better. The 10 speed in my friends camaro SS is BUTTER. And he's on the stock trans tune. No jerking, no delayed shifts, no lurching on the downshifts, it's perfect.

I do get the occasional jerky shift. Sometime hard. I mean that thing drops!

 

[peterk9]

I do get the occasional jerky shift. Sometime hard. I mean that thing drops!

Have a look at this.

List of Useful Threads - 6th Generation Ex and Aviator Recalls, TSB, FSA and SSM

TSB - SSM 49107 2020 Explorer/Aviator Easy Exit / Entry Seats Some 2020 Explorer/Aviator vehicles built on or before 04-Sep-2019 equipped with memory seats may exhibit the driver front seat moving forward during easy entry/exit operation when the vehicle is turned off. This may be due to the...

www.explorerforum.com

Peter

 

[1sttimeexplorerowner]

As long as your vehicle is under warranty, the dealer may not want to put in any fluid other than what Ford recommends, even if you're paying for it. Let us know please.

Peter

I'm actually pretty close with my ford dealer even though it's my first car i got from them (my brother got 2 of his cars there and my co-worker has gotten like 20 lol). So they should, keyword should, give me an honest answer if i ask them about the fluid change.

If not i'll go to my performance shop and have them do it. I will definitely update this thread on whatever happens if i do this.