Winch issues

[Caleb33]

I bought a brand new 9500 pound winch 3 days ago and after getting it all set up I am having some issues. The main issue is simple-it doesn't get enough power to spool. Not to pull anything, I'm talking to wind the cord back on to itself while under no load. When I hit the in switch the lights inside the truck turn off the headlights dim the engine almost stalls and the battery terminals glow red. Now I know these things draw a lot of power but I have a brand new 950 Cca battery and thought while the truck was running this would be fine. After research it seems most people with this problem use 2 batteries instead of just the one. Anyone have any suggestions other than that?

 

[bronchole]

I suspect that you have poorly connected the winch to the battery. Please describe/post pictures of the way it is connected to the battery. Specifically the area that "glows red".

For my installation I will be using these:

Oreilly auto parts has them, PN: BH315N at about $7 each.

You re-terminate or replace the stock batery cable so it can bolt on to this in the same way that the cable for the winch would.

 

[bronchole]

Out of interest, what winch did you go with and how much did it cost? I am looking at some 9500 pound winches on EBAY that will run $270 delivered and have a 3 year warrenty. Here is a link to the one I am talking about:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-9500-PO...Parts_Accessories&hash=item23233b99fa&vxp=mtr

Although I am considering this 10K pound one for $20 more:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10000-Pound...r-/390401685244?forcev4exp=true&forceRpt=true

 

[Blee1099]

You probably need a higher amperage alternator if its dimming lights when just spooling in with no load on it. Yours is probably a factory 90 amp.. A higher one is definitely recommended.

 

[Caleb33]

My recommendation is to go name brand and spend the extra money on a name brand. I bought very similar to those and it is giving me these issues and came with no way to mount the celinoid to it. It is made by cummins power tools (separate from the diesel company). As far as the connections I alligator clamped them. Would a better connection really help that much? Know any good aftermarket alternator companies?

 

[bronchole]

It takes something like 90 amps constant to operate a winch at no load. I'll bet your aligator clamps are smokeing hot! there is a reason why the cables running to the winch are even larger than what you likely have running to your starter. It takes allot of current to run it.

Don't try to short cut here. Bolt them on correctly. If you have a fully lead battery cable clamp you can probably get away with just adding it to the bolt that tightens the clamp. If you have the sheet metal looking type battery post clamps on the end of the battery cable, DO NOT add the winch cable to this clamp. You need to replace the clamp with something meant to handle the several hundred amps that the winch CAN draw on a hard pull.

Your aligator clamps or sheet metal type battery clamps are going to be a nice fuse that will get very hot and blow when you least expect it. I honestly don't even understand how the sheet metal clamps manage to outlast the warrenty period on the factory application.

 

[Caleb33]

I bolted them on right to the sheet metal clamps(before I read your post) and although there was no more glowing hot the cables did get VERY hot. To the point that I was afraid of casings melting. If I go to switch out the leads do I bend the clamps off of the raw wire going into them or do I cut them off the wires and strip a bit and put that into the new leads? Also, can the stock alternator/battery with 850cca power something this big?

 

[bronchole]

Your stock battery should be fine for infrequent winching. If you get in to a situation where you are doing a long hard pull, make sure that you let the winch cool 3 times as long as you pull. That should help your battery recooperate some of its charge also.

You could get some of the replacement battery cable ends like this:

Then cut off the battery cable as close to the sheet metal clamp as you can. Strip off a little bit of the battery cable jacket and clamp the raw cable in to the replacment end. You can mount the ring lug of the winch cable with one of the bolts that clamp the original cables on to the body of the replacment end. That should do OK.

The best way is to get the battery post adapter thing I pictured in post #2 (you will likely have to order it), replace the battery cable or crimp one of these on to the end of the existing cable:

And assemble it that way.

 

[Caleb33]

Thanks a lot. The o'riely near me has those in stock do ill get them tomorrow and post the results here

 

[bronchole]

I just did a bit of searching and it seems that we are missing a good "how to install a winch" thread. I guess I will put one together when I get mine.

 

[Caleb33]

That's would be awesome for guys like me who have used them my entire life on my dad and grandfathers trucks but was never there to hook them up. I assumed it was plug and play. May have been a bit naive of me.

 

[bronchole]

If you have very little experience or understanding of electrical stuff then I can see why you (and others) may overlook the things you did when you installed your winch.

I am hoping that you have some mechnical know how......... You did bolt everything togethr using every bolt hole you could in to the body of the winch right? Under a hard pull you are putting an incredible load on just the couple bolts (probably 4 or 6) that hold the winch to its mount. It is important that they are all present and tight.

Your mount should have the same attention paid to it. Weather it is a receiver mount, bumper mount or just a tray bolted to the frame you should have at least the same number, size and grade bolts holding the other components together. Some variation can be allowed for depending on the design of the particular configurations. If you are using a bumper mounted winch and you only have 4 grade 5, 3/8" bolts holding the bumper to the frame then under load thoes bolts are likely going to be the point of failure. Your winch and bumper flying thru the air is not a pretty picture.

I am soo going to do a how to on this when I install my winch.

 

[Caleb33]

So I put the new leads on shown here:

And tightened all connections. The engine sounded less strained when I hit the switch however the winch's celinoid whined pretty loud and the wires melted their casings down by where they connect to the winch shown here:

At this point I have no idea what else to do.....thoughts?

 

[Caleb33]

And yeah I bolted everything together with my torque wrench at about 108 psi. I have decent mechanical knowledge (been building dirt bikes and motorcycles since I was about 10) and I've done household electricity before but never automotive so this is new to me.

 

[bronchole]

Well, I guess it is safe to say that you are now getting enough current to the winch motor. Now you just need to warrenty the winch because there is definatly something wrong with the motor on that unit. Is it possible that the cable is shorting to the motor housing? It may be one of the other cables shorting to the housing and this is just the point of highest resistance.

 

[Caleb33]

Well. After some serious googling (and 3 parent companies) I found them. Ill call tomorrow and see if they will get behind their product or not.

 

[bronchole]

came with no way to mount the celinoid to it.

Did you have to install the wires to the motor? I am seriously thinking that the wires that are connected to the motor are shorting out to the case of the motor. Do you have a multimeter? Disconnect the cables from the motor and inspect to make sure that there is no metal to metal path that would have connected any of the cables to the motor.

It is also possible that the solonoid pack is not wired correctly causing a short when one of the soloniods is activated.

I think this is the way the solinoid pack normally works:
There are 2 contactors in the solinoid box. If I remember correctly both contactors should be open (no +12V or 0V) when you are not winching. When you run the winch one direction one of the solonoids switches supplying +12V to one of the cables. When you go the other way the other solonoid switches on supplying +12V to the other cable. If something is really funky you may get both having +12V which would cause the motor to fight itself. It may be possible that one of the solonoid outputs is being ran to the ground post on the motor and the ground wire is being ran to a post that is supposed to be connected to the solonoid.

Hope things work out for you. Don't get too pissed if they don't warranty it. We should be able to figure it out with you and get it working.

 

[Caleb33]

That did the trick! It was shorting on the casing. Thank you so much for the help.

 

[bronchole]

Not a problem, that's what the forums are for! I am just supprised that some other people hadn't chimed in.

Although it probably would still work, you should replace that melted cable. At the very least wrap the crap out of it with electrical tape.

Happy Trails,

Dan

 

[Caleb33]

It's already wrapped and I ordered 2 30 feet lengths of 6 gage wire because it mounds to a hitch at the back and the battery is at the front. Long term I will get a front mount hitch but that kills ground clearance so I won't do that until I get the btf lift. I am considering the larger one (2.25,1.75) and then putting the winch up front however that is a different threads worth or questions haha. Thanks so much for your help again. I had given up.