1/4 Mile Run Times

[Red13Sport]

Ken, you expected the extra boost to push a hose off ?
Is the intercooler sandwiched between the radiator and the A/C evaporator or is it out front ?
In all not a complete loss, which track where you at ?

 

[SlwSVT]

Yes, last night was a complete bust. The weather was awful and there was huge oil down so only got 2 runs. After the 2nd run, I figured out I had a pretty big boost leak. The hose pushed off the front turbo some. So no good times.

I pretty much expected it, but wanted to see for myself. Anyone wanting to run a higher HP tune should definitely do a 170 thermostat. On the second run I was close to 220* coolant temp.

And it was also proof that if you want to run higher HP in all conditions, either a new intercooler or water meth injection is needed. At the end of the track air temps were 178*!!!

So although I'd like to keep mine 100% stock for testing, I'm going to make a few changes. We can show ETs on other bone stock Explorers in better weather. I just won't see that for another 4-5 months down here and don't want to wait.

So I will be doing a 170* thermostat and water meth in the next week or so.

Greg, who is in this thread can test the SS tune without these mods up north in a month or so once temps start to come down.

It still went 13.7@99 with a 2.0 60'

Based on the logs, I'd say it was down quite a bit of power with the leak. Frustrating night but still promising considering.

Hey Ken, sounds like these turbos might be out of their efficiency range and blowing huge amounts of hot air. 178 IAT will pull a huge amount of timing. A healthy dose of meth would help with the maxed out turbos. I have the original Livernois performance tune and ran a 14.2@96 at 5200' in cooler air. I was hoping the kill tune would work for me, as at this elevation we lose 3-4#s of boost. But looks like a bigger intercooler or meth would be a requirement.

 

[20lbbooster]

I'd be curious to see what the more aggressive tune does in better weather. As much as I want my explorer to be quick, I'm not interested in changing the intercooler or adding meth. This vehicle won't see enough track or street abuse to warrant the extra hardware. I'll be ordering my tune soon from Lund but will probably just stick to the 93 DD tune til the weather gets better here in Houston.

 

[Ken Bjonnes]

Ken, you expected the extra boost to push a hose off ?
Is the intercooler sandwiched between the radiator and the A/C evaporator or is it out front ?
In all not a complete loss, which track where you at ?

That hose has come off many people's stock Explorers. Ford just used a worm clamp. Not really great for a boost pipe.
The intercooler is out front.

Hey Ken, sounds like these turbos might be out of their efficiency range and blowing huge amounts of hot air. 178 IAT will pull a huge amount of timing. A healthy dose of meth would help with the maxed out turbos. I have the original Livernois performance tune and ran a 14.2@96 at 5200' in cooler air. I was hoping the kill tune would work for me, as at this elevation we lose 3-4#s of boost. But looks like a bigger intercooler or meth would be a requirement.

Another issues with these are heat soak with the intake. Just sitting there waiting to run the air temps are in the 130* range. So going to the 170* thermostat will lower coolant temps which also make keep everything a bit cooler. I was thinking of trying a phenolic spacer.

I'd be curious to see what the more aggressive tune does in better weather. As much as I want my explorer to be quick, I'm not interested in changing the intercooler or adding meth. This vehicle won't see enough track or street abuse to warrant the extra hardware. I'll be ordering my tune soon from Lund but will probably just stick to the 93 DD tune til the weather gets better here in Houston.

I think in better weather is will really change things. At this point we are pushing the turbos to their limit, so if you are starting off with cooler denser air, it will help out a bunch.


Also keep in mind that I have bone stock exhaust. Modifications there should help out quite a bit at this point.

 

[Ryan327]

I'm thinking that just opening up the grill a little bit to help the factory intake scoop get some fresh air would help a bit. I know with my grand prix i'd see temps soak up quite a bit, but as soon as i got moving my IAT's would be w/in 5 degrees of OAT

 

[Ken Bjonnes]

I'm thinking that just opening up the grill a little bit to help the factory intake scoop get some fresh air would help a bit. I know with my grand prix i'd see temps soak up quite a bit, but as soon as i got moving my IAT's would be w/in 5 degrees of OAT

It will help some, but the incoming air temp change won't change the outlet temps by the amount we would like to see. Here is a graph of Vehicle Speed, MCT (air temp in the manifold) and ECT (Engine Coolant Temp). To give you an idea of what we are facing.

As you can see, temps are starting in the 130's at the starting line, they take a small dip as some airflow goes over the cooler, then they take off.

 

[Ryan327]

While the IC isn't working as good as we'd all hope, at least it seems to flatten out once it's jumped the initial 25 degree. You've probably got better data on this from the streets then the track, but is that where the intercooler seems to balance out at ~170 or does it keep climbing under continuous boost loads?

Same thing with coolant temps, does it seem to top out around there? What is the stock thermostat, like 195?

Does this match what you were seeing on the dyno pretty close. Does the factory tune go more towards limiting boost or pulling timing to keep the temps under control?

 

[Ken Bjonnes]

While the IC isn't working as good as we'd all hope, at least it seems to flatten out once it's jumped the initial 25 degree. You've probably got better data on this from the streets then the track, but is that where the intercooler seems to balance out at ~170 or does it keep climbing under continuous boost loads?

It works much better on the street than the track. Plus I rarely do 100+ hits on the street. The big issue is sitting there waiting to run and the heat soak. If you are driving around, temps do start off quite a bit lower which obviously helps.

I think the thermostat and the meth kit are going to make a huge difference. The nice thing about the meth kit is I can turn it off to be able to test the regular tunes. So even after this, the only thing different on mine over stock will be the thermostat.

 

[Ryan327]

I added a couple of ?'s while you were typing

I worry about that same heat soak on the streets because i'm here in the DC area which has some of the worst traffic in the country! I just thought the constant boosting while puttering in low gears plus the rads/ic eating exhuast would really push the temps higher.

I'm hesitant to want to change the thermostat just yet, maybe my other cars fault. I'm running a drilled 180 on my GTP and the thing barely warms up in the winter and the heat barely gets warm. I really should switch it to a regular non drilled 180. This is a hold over from living in FL myself.

 

[Ken Bjonnes]

I added a couple of ?'s while you were typing

I worry about that same heat soak on the streets because i'm here in the DC area which has some of the worst traffic in the country! I just thought the constant boosting while puttering in low gears plus the rads/ic eating exhuast would really push the temps higher.

I'm hesitant to want to change the thermostat just yet, maybe my other cars fault. I'm running a drilled 180 on my GTP and the thing barely warms up in the winter and the heat barely gets warm. I really should switch it to a regular non drilled 180. This is a hold over from living in FL myself.

Yeah, drilling a thermostat is a bad idea. I see no issue with a 170*

As far as coolant temp, that's as hot as I've ever seen it. So not sure if it would continue to climb.


The factory tune uses throttle quite a bit to limit power. When bone stock, I bet you would barely get actual WOT for more than a couple seconds. You don't feel it, but it's definitely not open.

Also uses boost and spark to limit things as well.

 

[Ryan327]

yeah, the stock tune feels horrible after having driven it tuned for a few weeks now, feels like it's never letting you get on the gas. It's like pressing the gas pedal is a request, not a command.

 

[Ken Bjonnes]

yeah, the stock tune feels horrible after having driven it tuned for a few weeks now, feels like it's never letting you get on the gas. It's like pressing the gas pedal is a request, not a command.

I re did the graph above to move the temps to the right axis. Makes it easier to see the changes in temp.

 

[Ryan327]

Makes sense to me, how does OAT (outside air temp)/IAT (Inlet air temp) compare to MCT, is the relationship fairly linear or do they not correlate that way due to the heat soak we discussed with the IC

 

[Ken Bjonnes]

Makes sense to me, how does OAT (outside air temp)/IAT (Inlet air temp) compare to MCT, is the relationship fairly linear or do they not correlate that way due to the heat soak we discussed with the IC

In general, ambient temps will definitely be a factor, but not as much as you would hope.

Here is a good turbo calculator. You can play with the inlet air temp to see how it effects outlet temps. Obviously for this to correlate exactly to the Sport, you would have to enter in all the correct info, but this will still give you the idea.

http://www.not2fast.com/turbo/glossary/turbo_calc.shtml?

 

[thePUNISHER]

ken I have a question..... why is the sport's first gear acceleration so lack luster??? then 2nd takes off like a rocket.... this is especially peculiar considering the 6f50 has a first gear ratio in the 4s....does ford limit performance in 1st because of this aggressive 1st gear ratio???

 

[Ken Bjonnes]

ken I have a question..... why is the sport's first gear acceleration so lack luster??? then 2nd takes off like a rocket.... this is especially peculiar considering the 6f50 has a first gear ratio in the 4s....does ford limit performance in 1st because of this aggressive 1st gear ratio???

Ford is limiting performance in every gear in every situation. If you were to log throttle position, you could see that you rarely get full throttle with the stock tune. But it is particularly bad in 1st gear. This is on purpose.

 

[JohnBoyToo]

Limited by the bean counter warranty guys

and probably to limit the torque steer as well...

Ford must be using the same hose clamps as on the turbo diesels !

first thing we did when uping the boost was a new hose clamp


Having second thoughts about buying a tuner for the sport since it a lease....
can we rent one ?!?

 

[PlatinumSport]

Limited by the bean counter warranty guys

and probably to limit the torque steer as well...

Ford must be using the same hose clamps as on the turbo diesels !

first thing we did when uping the boost was a new hose clamp


Having second thoughts about buying a tuner for the sport since it a lease....
can we rent one ?!?

If this tuner has the ability to return to stock and unmarry like past tuners I have had you are essentially renting it because it will have some value when you get rid of your Sport once the lease is up.

 

[JohnBoyToo]

Agree - more of a joke
sold each of my previous ones as we changed vehicles along the way...

 

[hottina]

If this tuner has the ability to return to stock and unmarry like past tuners I have had you are essentially renting it because it will have some value when you get rid of your Sport once the lease is up.

I thought you couldn't "unmarry" this one.