1999 Mounty 5.0 aka My Great Bad Idea

[97Sandbox]

Yeah, I'm planning to run marvel and/or seafoam in the next few rounds with the oil.

 

[allmyEXes]

I was wondering if your oil filter could be clogged..

 

[97Sandbox]

I've been wondering that too. Like if the marvel did its job and the oil filter did too and the net result is a filter full of junk. I'd hope a Motorcraft filter would at least have the right bypass valving to supply enough oil in the event of a clog, but who knows.

 

[410Fortune]

You can remove synchronizer and turn oil pump
But you don’t want to turn the oil pump with solvents in there because (it is my understanding) you would be forcing them through the crank bearings by building pressure with solvents instead of oil

 

[97Sandbox]

But what if I turned the pump backwards?

Hahaha this is all theoretical I'm not about to try that. But someday, with an engine out of the vehicle and ready for a rebuild, it would be interesting to know. I frankly don't know if gerotor pumps even work in reverse.

 

[Josh P]

But what if I turned the pump backwards?

Hahaha this is all theoretical I'm not about to try that. But someday, with an engine out of the vehicle and ready for a rebuild, it would be interesting to know. I frankly don't know if gerotor pumps even work in reverse.

I'd hate to find out with an engine I care about.

 

[97Sandbox]

Yeah, exactly.

 

[97Sandbox]

The second diesel flush came out looking like, well, diesel. Wasn't really dirty at all.

I took off the filter and may dissect it later.

When I sprayed seafoam in the pressure sender port, it dripped out of the threaded portion of the filter mount. I went ahead and sprayed more into the other hole in the filter mount, which I'm guessing goes to the pump. It dripped back out of the filter mount, not the pan, so I don't think it went through the pump, but hopefully some got into it at least.

I've got four qt of 5W-30 and one qt of marvel in there now with a supertech filter. I'll run it up to temp tonight, then drain.

Next round will be 10W-40 and I'll add 1 oz of seafoam per quart of oil. That'll keep the oil thick, but still help clean things. And another cheap filter of course. It'll be very interesting to see what the pressure looks like with some rpm.

 

[Josh P]

I'd run the marvel for a bit, anytime I treated an engine with it for the first time it took a few hours to soften things up. A C15 cat with the engine brake on at night looked like tracer rounds coming out of the stacks. That took 120 miles of driving.

 

[97Sandbox]

It actually had marvel in it the last 500+ miles, so I'd like to think the crud in there is relatively softened already. Maybe I'll do a few rounds run up to temp, let it sit, run it again, then drain after 3-5 cycles. Think that'll give marvel the best chance to work it's magic?

 

[Josh P]

It actually had marvel in it the last 500+ miles, so I'd like to think the crud in there is relatively softened already. Maybe I'll do a few rounds run up to temp, let it sit, run it again, then drain after 3-5 cycles. Think that'll give marvel the best chance to work it's magic?

That's a better game plan.

 

[97Sandbox]

Round one complete. Left it to idle for 15-20 min.

I don't want to speak too soon, but the numbers are different and better. Cold startup had the gauge at nearly 50 psi. At the end of the warm idling, it was at 14 psi, that's a pretty solid improvement over 9 psi.

I had forgotten I packed fiberglass matting against my collectors back when I was trying to figure out my lean codes. Let me tell you, diesel-soaked fiberglass against a collector gets really smokey lol. I was glad to know I had an extinguisher nearby (in my Sport) and was even more glad I didn't need it.

 

[allmyEXes]

In the past in the small block fords 302s, engines with 150K miles on them, engines with several thousandths wear on the bearings, I've used
Castrol 20W50 or other name brand 20W50 with good results and good oil pressure.
Tomorow, I can get you a cold oil pressure reading off of my '97MM 5.0 that has 250K and 10W40 oil in it if that would help as a comparison. I can't get you a warmed up reading until I fix my very low fuel pressure issue.
I'll check back here in the morning.

 

[97Sandbox]

Made it through a couple more cycles with the 5W-30 and MMO today. Cold starts still at 40-50 psi, hot idle at 14 psi. Once hot, I gave it some gentle revs this last round. It seems now the pressure plateaus around 40 psi -- it hits that by 4000 rpm, then doesn't really increase approaching 4500 (as high as I revved it).

Now 40 psi is a lot better than before when I couldn't break 30 psi even at 5000 rpm. I'm wondering how much of the pressure plateau is Due to the oil being 20% MMO (thinner viscosity). I suppose I'll get the answer once the 10W-40 goes in.

 

[97Sandbox]

Cold idle with 10W-40 was about the same as with 5W-30: 45 psi or so.

Once up to temp, I have about 20 psi at idle. It climbs steadily through the 2000, 3000, 4000, rpm range, but plateaus at about 44 psi by 4500 and holds there (or maybe even drops slightly) towards 5000.

My understanding is that a 302 should have at least 10 psi per 1000 rpm. If that rule of thumb is true, I'm still not getting enough oil pressure in the higher rpms.

The second diesel treatment came out clean and the 5W-30/marvel was pretty clean too: just slightly brown. At this point, I'm suspecting my pump and/or bearings are simply worn like one would expect from an engine with nearly 200k miles on it that probably wasn't meticulously maintained.

What do you guys think? All this flushing absolutely made an improvement, but it's still not where it should be. Time to commit to 10W-40 and run it as long as it holds together?

 

[Josh P]

General census on the internet is the pressure is in spec, 35-60 psi at operating temperature. There's probably quite a bit of life left in that motor.

 

[410Fortune]

My Bronco too with a mechanical oil pressure gauge runs between 20 psi and 50 and has since 2005 It seems like you may have removed the blockage

 

[97Sandbox]

I was reading more last night and it sounds like what I'm seeing for pressure is typical of a moderately high mileage engine with the original oil pump. It's definitely flowing better now than it was before.

I'm wondering if I'm better off with 10W-40 or 5W-30. It doesn't seem like I gained a lot of pressure switching to the thicker oil and I was also reading how oil flow is really more important than oil pressure, it's just that pressure is easier to measure. That being the case, I'm kind of thinking the thinner oil may offer better overall lubrication -- particularly heading into the colder months.

At the same time, it is a higher mileage engine and these SBFs don't seem to have any issues running thicker oil. Maybe I should stick with 10W-40.

Easiest thing to do is just run the 10W-40 till the cold really sets in, then switch to 5W-30 next oil change. Hopefully the supertech filter is good enough for a few hundred miles -- I'm still in shock that they're less than $4.

 

[Josh P]

I wonder who makes that filter for Walmart?

 

[97Sandbox]

Me too. It looks pretty legit inside and the seal seems high quality, not like some of the cheapo parts store house brand filters I've dealt with in the past.