2020 Explorer - Harsh Shifting

[peterk9]

^^Welcome to the Forum.
Did you ask for a refund on the ESP or transfer it?

Peter

 

[EXFAN]

I assume its a Ford ESP factory warranty they are offering? I have seen dealers in these situations provide an aftermarket 3rd party warranty. Not acceptable.

It sounds like the extended warranty (ESP) adds 75k miles to the mileage you already have accumulated which is 14k = 89k miles. This is how extended warrantys work. Features in the warranty cover "progressively" and "kick in" as factory warrantys expire. Sounds like you will also get 2 more years of coverage on the Powertrain and 4 more years on some of the B2B items. So, you are not actually getting an additonal 75k of warranty but only 61k on SOME B2B items (factory BTB expires 36k) and only 29k miles additional coverage beyond the factory powertrain warranty (your trans) that expires at 60k. Ford should offer more but they don't HAVE to give you or honor anything except the warranty that came with the car which you paid for. Factory warrantys are part of the purchase price and cost to produce a vehicle.

But, there is added value especially for the B2B items cause it covers things like A/C, cooling, fuel, electrical, entertainment, (not trim, interior pieces and lots of other stuff). Carefully read the warranty contract (not the brochure) and focus on "what is not covered". Your best warranty is called an "Exclusionary" warranty and typically is the highest level of whats offered E.g. "Platinum" level vs Silver or Gold. There is also added value if the warranty is transferrable to the next owner if you sell it. It should be but I'm not sure. If a $ amount will be assigned to the warranty I'm also not sure who is entitled to a refund for any unused portion of the warranty, Ford or you the owner? Maybe Ford because they are paying but you never know as the warranty will be in your name. Again, find out f there is a $ or value amount to the warranty. All questions to ask.

Rebuild of repair the trans? As a Master Tech, all I can say is I can't say for sure. Like any workplace, some employees are better than others so for a rebuild, if the technician at the dealership is good, you'll get a good working trans. Theoretically, the New Trans, should have all the updates and corrections done and built at the factory (not that they got it right the first time) but we hope the new factory replacements are better.

Sorry for the long rant, but I feel your pain. I'm not a knee-jerk "get 'em to buy it back" guy but if you feel enough is enough then I would explore a lemon law case with an attorney and not the internet or your state government only. Others have said they just traded theirs in and got a different vehicle. If you can afford the loss, then sometimes it can be cheaper to get rid of it, take the loss and go make money however you do because if you're don't, that cost you more money. Figuring sales tax, depreciation and fees, it would be about at least $10k hit to switch vehicles. Some manufacturers like Ford will do a cash settlement vs buy back and you keep the vehicle with a clean title and full warranty. I've done both in my years and each has its pros and cons.

 

[Jettech498]

After reading everything sir. I would drive it like you stole it for a few hours. Get on it. Make that thing do (its thing). Put it through it paces and don't give it any time off. Hit it hard. And I bet all will be resolved. Do that and tell me I'm wrong. Edit...I am a Master Tech, not at Ford but I own Fords as well. I'm also a Certified and Licensed Commercial Aircraft Mechanic. 34 plus years now at a large Airline. Hit that bad boy. Drive it like you stole it for a while. It will settle down.

 

[EXP Dave]

Update: The Ford representative called me back. They are speaking with the service director at my local dealership to determine the next part or group of parts above what is needed in the bulletin since they are unable to get all of the parts in because of a national back order. She communicated they are discussing whether or not to replace the entire transmission as the next logical step to take. I am not sure how I feel about this I believe I would rather replace parts than an entire transmission at this point but I am no mechanic.

We have a 2020 Limited Explorer. It is harsh shifting from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd. Not sure which and it generally seems to be when we leave the house initially for the day. Initially the TSB for transmission cooler replacement showed up on my wife's Ford Pass app so we took in to have replaced. Still experiencing issues. I dont know the exact mileage but it was at the last oil change so probably around 10K miles. Car currently has 14K miles on the odometer and is approx. 1 year old next month.

I took the car back into the dealership and I was informed there was a new bulletin dated November 19, 2020 - titled 10R60/10R80-Harsh Engagement/Harsh Shift/Delayed Shift with or without DTCs.

I was told the parts are on back order Nationwide but include Main Valve Body and approx 8 more parts if need replacement after inspection.

I was also told by the technician and the Service Desk staff that it was ok for me to drive the vehicle - more about this in a minute.

Somewhat frustrated I called Ford and initiated a customer service ticket with them. I explained I had 3 concerns:
1. Longevity of the car
2. Should I really be driving the car
3. Timely repair

1. The agent called me back that day and said that they could offer an extended warranty at no charge (5 additional years and 75K additional miles). So since the car is 1 year old and 14K miles, I would have Premium warranty (whatever it is called - highest version) with $100 deductible for 6 years or 89K miles, which ever comes first. This is not how warranties are normally done so I have questioned if this is correct multiple times and waiting on a supervisor to call back. We will likely keep the car for at least 5 years and will put at least 100K miles so was hoping they would take the warranty out to 100K but she said that is the very best offer they can provide.

2. In reagards to driving the car in the meantime - The agent told me that it was up to the dealership. No disrespect to my dealership but I would think Ford should provide some guidance from Corporate engineers if the vehicles should be parked under these circumstances and make the decision over the local tech at the dealership. The TSB does not mention that I have found yet. The agent told me that she has no way to get guidance from Corporate on this issues and I find that hard to believe. I am worried about long term damage if I continue to drive the vehicle. Pending further discussion with the supervisor but I doubt it will get me much further. Also see next topic about maybe why I was sent home with car and I want some advice or clarification...

3. In regards to timely repair - I question if they sent me home because parts were on back order and it would mean the car would sit at the dealership for 30+ days....does this not have some play in the buy back process? The agent did tell me that they have all the parts except one that is on National backorder and I am not sure which one.

If anyone has feedback on how the warranty offer works, please chime in. If you have experience with this Bulletin, please chime in. If you have experience regarding driving the vehicle with main valve body issues, please chime in. Lastly if you have experience regarding potential 30 plus days if the car was sitting at the dealership and if that plays into why they may have sent me home, please chime in.

Just wondering if you got a satisfactory solution to the transmission issue. If so, did they replace the whole transmission or just parts. Best wishes in the fix for your car.

 

[SteveAZ]

I'd appreciated knowing too. My Platinum is in the shop right now (third or fourth time) for the same complaint. Harsh shifting. I made an appointment two months ago to put the car in the shop so there'd be no excuse about parts, etc. I haven't heard anything since late Friday so I guess we'll see.

 

[dcarey96]

Update: The Ford representative called me back. They are speaking with the service director at my local dealership to determine the next part or group of parts above what is needed in the bulletin since they are unable to get all of the parts in because of a national back order. She communicated they are discussing whether or not to replace the entire transmission as the next logical step to take. I am not sure how I feel about this I believe I would rather replace parts than an entire transmission at this point but I am no mechanic.

We have a 2020 Limited Explorer. It is harsh shifting from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd. Not sure which and it generally seems to be when we leave the house initially for the day. Initially the TSB for transmission cooler replacement showed up on my wife's Ford Pass app so we took in to have replaced. Still experiencing issues. I dont know the exact mileage but it was at the last oil change so probably around 10K miles. Car currently has 14K miles on the odometer and is approx. 1 year old next month.

I took the car back into the dealership and I was informed there was a new bulletin dated November 19, 2020 - titled 10R60/10R80-Harsh Engagement/Harsh Shift/Delayed Shift with or without DTCs.

I was told the parts are on back order Nationwide but include Main Valve Body and approx 8 more parts if need replacement after inspection.

I was also told by the technician and the Service Desk staff that it was ok for me to drive the vehicle - more about this in a minute.

Somewhat frustrated I called Ford and initiated a customer service ticket with them. I explained I had 3 concerns:
1. Longevity of the car
2. Should I really be driving the car
3. Timely repair

1. The agent called me back that day and said that they could offer an extended warranty at no charge (5 additional years and 75K additional miles). So since the car is 1 year old and 14K miles, I would have Premium warranty (whatever it is called - highest version) with $100 deductible for 6 years or 89K miles, which ever comes first. This is not how warranties are normally done so I have questioned if this is correct multiple times and waiting on a supervisor to call back. We will likely keep the car for at least 5 years and will put at least 100K miles so was hoping they would take the warranty out to 100K but she said that is the very best offer they can provide.

2. In reagards to driving the car in the meantime - The agent told me that it was up to the dealership. No disrespect to my dealership but I would think Ford should provide some guidance from Corporate engineers if the vehicles should be parked under these circumstances and make the decision over the local tech at the dealership. The TSB does not mention that I have found yet. The agent told me that she has no way to get guidance from Corporate on this issues and I find that hard to believe. I am worried about long term damage if I continue to drive the vehicle. Pending further discussion with the supervisor but I doubt it will get me much further. Also see next topic about maybe why I was sent home with car and I want some advice or clarification...

3. In regards to timely repair - I question if they sent me home because parts were on back order and it would mean the car would sit at the dealership for 30+ days....does this not have some play in the buy back process? The agent did tell me that they have all the parts except one that is on National backorder and I am not sure which one.

If anyone has feedback on how the warranty offer works, please chime in. If you have experience with this Bulletin, please chime in. If you have experience regarding driving the vehicle with main valve body issues, please chime in. Lastly if you have experience regarding potential 30 plus days if the car was sitting at the dealership and if that plays into why they may have sent me home, please chime in.

I had the same issue with my 2020 for Explorer . Stayed in the shop for same issue as yours . We decided to trade it in and get. 2021 recently .

 

[EXP Dave]

I'd appreciated knowing too. My Platinum is in the shop right now (third or fourth time) for the same complaint. Harsh shifting. I made an appointment two months ago to put the car in the shop so there'd be no excuse about parts, etc. I haven't heard anything since late Friday so I guess we'll see.

What year is your Platinum. Just got a 2021 and hoping it was 2020 only issue.

 

[peterk9]

I'd appreciated knowing too. My Platinum is in the shop right now (third or fourth time) for the same complaint. Harsh shifting. I made an appointment two months ago to put the car in the shop so there'd be no excuse about parts, etc. I haven't heard anything since late Friday so I guess we'll see.

There is a TSB for something like this; List of Useful Threads - 6th Generation Ex and Aviator Recalls, TSB, FSA and SSM

Peter

 

[rislerjs]

Update: The Ford representative called me back. They are speaking with the service director at my local dealership to determine the next part or group of parts above what is needed in the bulletin since they are unable to get all of the parts in because of a national back order. She communicated they are discussing whether or not to replace the entire transmission as the next logical step to take. I am not sure how I feel about this I believe I would rather replace parts than an entire transmission at this point but I am no mechanic.

We have a 2020 Limited Explorer. It is harsh shifting from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd. Not sure which and it generally seems to be when we leave the house initially for the day. Initially the TSB for transmission cooler replacement showed up on my wife's Ford Pass app so we took in to have replaced. Still experiencing issues. I dont know the exact mileage but it was at the last oil change so probably around 10K miles. Car currently has 14K miles on the odometer and is approx. 1 year old next month.

I took the car back into the dealership and I was informed there was a new bulletin dated November 19, 2020 - titled 10R60/10R80-Harsh Engagement/Harsh Shift/Delayed Shift with or without DTCs.

I was told the parts are on back order Nationwide but include Main Valve Body and approx 8 more parts if need replacement after inspection.

I was also told by the technician and the Service Desk staff that it was ok for me to drive the vehicle - more about this in a minute.

Somewhat frustrated I called Ford and initiated a customer service ticket with them. I explained I had 3 concerns:
1. Longevity of the car
2. Should I really be driving the car
3. Timely repair

1. The agent called me back that day and said that they could offer an extended warranty at no charge (5 additional years and 75K additional miles). So since the car is 1 year old and 14K miles, I would have Premium warranty (whatever it is called - highest version) with $100 deductible for 6 years or 89K miles, which ever comes first. This is not how warranties are normally done so I have questioned if this is correct multiple times and waiting on a supervisor to call back. We will likely keep the car for at least 5 years and will put at least 100K miles so was hoping they would take the warranty out to 100K but she said that is the very best offer they can provide.

2. In reagards to driving the car in the meantime - The agent told me that it was up to the dealership. No disrespect to my dealership but I would think Ford should provide some guidance from Corporate engineers if the vehicles should be parked under these circumstances and make the decision over the local tech at the dealership. The TSB does not mention that I have found yet. The agent told me that she has no way to get guidance from Corporate on this issues and I find that hard to believe. I am worried about long term damage if I continue to drive the vehicle. Pending further discussion with the supervisor but I doubt it will get me much further. Also see next topic about maybe why I was sent home with car and I want some advice or clarification...

3. In regards to timely repair - I question if they sent me home because parts were on back order and it would mean the car would sit at the dealership for 30+ days....does this not have some play in the buy back process? The agent did tell me that they have all the parts except one that is on National backorder and I am not sure which one.

If anyone has feedback on how the warranty offer works, please chime in. If you have experience with this Bulletin, please chime in. If you have experience regarding driving the vehicle with main valve body issues, please chime in. Lastly if you have experience regarding potential 30 plus days if the car was sitting at the dealership and if that plays into why they may have sent me home, please chime in.

i just had this fixed with TSB 21-2316 which supersedes 21-2046. so far so good.

 

[JB Dial]

^^Welcome to the Forum.
Did you ask for a refund on the ESP or transfer it?

Peter

ESP was given to me so nothing to refund. They did not want to transfer to new vehicle but I got an agent that said it would transfer prior to me trading cars and was able to hold them to it.

 

[peterk9]

i just had this fixed with TSB 21-2316 which supersedes 21-2046. so far so good.

Welcome to the Forum.

Peter

 

[Reino]

My 2020 XLT has 39k and the transmission just went to hell! Many times when I rotate the dial out of park into either D or R it just rotates back to park! It says “shift syn” issue.

On the rare times it does get into gear, it shifts all over the place! Revving to redline, then bogging down, then jerking when shifting. It fees downright dangerous to drive!

I dropped it at the dealer Monday. Got one call from the service tech that morning saying she would be handling it. Haven’t heard from her all week. Just on suspicion I drove by and checked and the car is sitting exactly where I parked it, covered in snow!

I’m afraid that when they finally do get around to even diagnose, it’s gonna be another 6 months to get the part.

This is all just depressing because I love this car. It’s a good thing I have an old beater, but what do the dealers expect people to do who don’t have any other vehicle?

 

[dcarey96]

Update: The Ford representative called me back. They are speaking with the service director at my local dealership to determine the next part or group of parts above what is needed in the bulletin since they are unable to get all of the parts in because of a national back order. She communicated they are discussing whether or not to replace the entire transmission as the next logical step to take. I am not sure how I feel about this I believe I would rather replace parts than an entire transmission at this point but I am no mechanic.

We have a 2020 Limited Explorer. It is harsh shifting from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd. Not sure which and it generally seems to be when we leave the house initially for the day. Initially the TSB for transmission cooler replacement showed up on my wife's Ford Pass app so we took in to have replaced. Still experiencing issues. I dont know the exact mileage but it was at the last oil change so probably around 10K miles. Car currently has 14K miles on the odometer and is approx. 1 year old next month.

I took the car back into the dealership and I was informed there was a new bulletin dated November 19, 2020 - titled 10R60/10R80-Harsh Engagement/Harsh Shift/Delayed Shift with or without DTCs.

I was told the parts are on back order Nationwide but include Main Valve Body and approx 8 more parts if need replacement after inspection.

I was also told by the technician and the Service Desk staff that it was ok for me to drive the vehicle - more about this in a minute.

Somewhat frustrated I called Ford and initiated a customer service ticket with them. I explained I had 3 concerns:
1. Longevity of the car
2. Should I really be driving the car
3. Timely repair

1. The agent called me back that day and said that they could offer an extended warranty at no charge (5 additional years and 75K additional miles). So since the car is 1 year old and 14K miles, I would have Premium warranty (whatever it is called - highest version) with $100 deductible for 6 years or 89K miles, which ever comes first. This is not how warranties are normally done so I have questioned if this is correct multiple times and waiting on a supervisor to call back. We will likely keep the car for at least 5 years and will put at least 100K miles so was hoping they would take the warranty out to 100K but she said that is the very best offer they can provide.

2. In reagards to driving the car in the meantime - The agent told me that it was up to the dealership. No disrespect to my dealership but I would think Ford should provide some guidance from Corporate engineers if the vehicles should be parked under these circumstances and make the decision over the local tech at the dealership. The TSB does not mention that I have found yet. The agent told me that she has no way to get guidance from Corporate on this issues and I find that hard to believe. I am worried about long term damage if I continue to drive the vehicle. Pending further discussion with the supervisor but I doubt it will get me much further. Also see next topic about maybe why I was sent home with car and I want some advice or clarification...

3. In regards to timely repair - I question if they sent me home because parts were on back order and it would mean the car would sit at the dealership for 30+ days....does this not have some play in the buy back process? The agent did tell me that they have all the parts except one that is on National backorder and I am not sure which one.

If anyone has feedback on how the warranty offer works, please chime in. If you have experience with this Bulletin, please chime in. If you have experience regarding driving the vehicle with main valve body issues, please chime in. Lastly if you have experience regarding potential 30 plus days if the car was sitting at the dealership and if that plays into why they may have sent me home, please chime in.

Hi I had the same excavation issue with my 2020 Explorer as well . Mine set at the dealership for months waiting for those parts . I eventually traded it in once they replaced the whole transmission as well . I would not keep the auto at all . Trade it in . Your car is a lemon period.
They dhiujd give you just about everything you paid for it back . I traded up for a 2021 limited no issues at all now . They should rrojace the whole transmission as they did to my 2020.

 

[Reino]

UPDATE: My car has been sitting in the service lot at Autonation Ford Littleton for over 6 weeks now! The dealer tells me they don't even have any open lifts to even diagnose it, because all the lifts are occupied by other cars waiting on parts!

Dealer has no loaners available. I called Ford Customer Care and they said they will not reimburse a rental car until the vehicle is 'actively being diagnosed'.

This is pathetic customer treatment by both Ford and their dealer. I was so happy when I bought my car with my very first new car dealership purchase. All of that happiness is replaced with disappointment.

 

[peterk9]

I can sense your frustration, but what is the dealer supposed to do if they can't work on your vehicle because of the backlog of work? Also, Ford is under no obligation to authorize a loaner or rental. That is stated in the Warranty Guide.
Are there any other Ford/Lincoln dealers in the area that you can go to?

Peter

 

[rislerjs]

UPDATE: My car has been sitting in the service lot at Autonation Ford Littleton for over 6 weeks now! The dealer tells me they don't even have any open lifts to even diagnose it, because all the lifts are occupied by other cars waiting on parts!

Dealer has no loaners available. I called Ford Customer Care and they said they will not reimburse a rental car until the vehicle is 'actively being diagnosed'.

This is pathetic customer treatment by both Ford and their dealer. I was so happy when I bought my car with my very first new car dealership purchase. All of that happiness is replaced with disappointment.

I live in the St. Louis area. I called around to six different dealerships and took the earliest appointment I could. They got me in and it took a couple days to get repaired. That dealership themselves paid for my rental car. Part of the reason I think they did that is because I showed them the service bulletin that I have posted earlier. He said that they were sorry that it was going to take a few days and they were going to cover the rental and for me not to worry about it. My heart shifting has stopped when I accelerate. There is a little bit of a bump between second and third, but it’s 90% better than what it was. I’m going to be calling them to try and schedule to have them take a look at the 2nd to 3rd gear shifting, but I’m not too concerned. Make sure you bring up service bulletins there are several listed in this entire thread

 

[Reino]

I can sense your frustration, but what is the dealer supposed to do if they can't work on your vehicle because of the backlog of work? Also, Ford is under no obligation to authorize a loaner or rental. That is stated in the Warranty Guide.
Are there any other Ford/Lincoln dealers in the area that you can go to?

Peter

They can loan me any number of used vehicles on the lot. I don't even care what it is. A 2010 RAV4, whatever. The fact that they're so unwilling to take a slight hit to their margin to retain a customer is really sad.

There are other dealers but they all tell me the same story: "we only have one tech who can work on these transmissions", etc.

I'm in the construction industry and I completely understand the current supply chain and labor market, but if I treated MY client the way I'm being treated, I would be out of a client. Neither Ford or the dealership seems to care about that.

 

[Robbinbadams]

Has anyone experienced harsh shifting with the 10 speed transmission? My wife complains as a passenger.

 

[peterk9]

Has anyone experienced harsh shifting with the 10 speed transmission? My wife complains as a passenger.

Welcome to the Forum.
Your thread was merged with this one.
As you can see, the issue, unfortunately, is not that uncommon. There are several threads on issues with this transmission.

Peter

 

[hbalek]

The transmission issue desribed in this TSB happened to me last Saturday:

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2020/MC-10180336-0001.pdf

Luckily, I was near the dealership and the service department was still open. The transmission technician test drove with me and confirmed that it's the transmission. He told me to leave it and they arranged for a loaner car from a rental car agency which was also about to close. So I lucked out on both counts. We'll see how long the parts take to arrive to complete the repair. I have 25,289 miles on it. They have also ordered me a new rear camera because the recall reprogramming of the IPMB for the blue screen issue did not take care of it. I have another problem too with the rear defroster element starting to peel off the glass. They will probably have to replace the rear glass.