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front end swap

Hah ok.

Number one , is the transmission which was absolute junk. Two , the engine was awful. 4 liters and only 150 hp. That's sad. Jeremy Clarkson said it best when he said "How do they get such a small amount of power from such a huge engine?"

And before you say "it's not about power , it's about torque" , save it. This isn't a tractor. It's suppose to be a car.

Three , Unreliability. Your personal stories mean nothing. They don't refect what the majority of explorers are. Go on ebay , go on yahoo cars , go on criags list. Try to find a first gen with over 250k on it. You might find one or two?

Now try to find a toyota or honda from the same year with 250k. There's tons of them. Hundreds infact. That's because given the same age , and lack of matinence , they lasted longer then the explorer. Because they were designed and built better.

And by the way , I've owned 3 first gens. Count em, 1 , 2 , 3. I have an emotional attachment to the make and model. But all three were terrible and cost far more in repairs then any of the 14 cars I've owned.

If I'm going to buy a vehicle based on it's looks alone and ignoring it's awful track record , then I'm going to get the one that sucks the least and could potentially look the same. And thats a second generation explorer , not a first.

The 5r55e is just as bad as the a4ld, and other that the shape of the cumbustion chambers in the head nothing changed in the ohv until mid 97. in mid 97 they changed the crankshaft to be able to use the same flywheel as the SOHC. in 99 they changed the shape of the exhaust port. so as far as reliability nothing really got better in the 2nd gens except the v8. And i dare you to try to find a 5.0 explorer in good mechanical condition for $1500. In my area you are paying 2k with rusted out rocker panels and dog-legs. if you find one with a clean body and lower mileage they start at 4k and go up from there. As far as the HP numbers you posted, i would like to see some kind of proof, as the lowest spec ive seen was a little over 160, and that was a 1st gen manual with the lower performance cam. my 97 is rated to 172hp, and im fairly certain it is a bit under rated due to the fact that it can easily keep up with my GMC Envoy that is rated to 291hp. and before you call it a car, keep in mind that it is a sport utility vehicle, NOT a car. part of utility is torque. why would a 4000lb cinder block on wheels need to make gobs of HP when torque is needed to get it moving?
 



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You're dancing around the fact that the second gen was only an improvement over the first gen. And the fact that there are more second gens in better shape.

You also didn't bother reading my post fully otherwise you would have read

I'm going to get the one that sucks the least

I still think the second gen wasn't that great either , just not as crap as the first gen.
 






I gotta commend you though , you got through about 3 sentences before you hit "reply".
 






I still think the second gen wasn't that great either , just not as crap as the first gen.[/QUOTE]

then why are you even gonna bother doing any mods to either generation of a vehicle that you clearly dont like?
 






Yet another person who didnt actually read anything I posted.
 






I'll throw something in regarding the question at hand since no one else seems to be interested in helping you do what you want to do.

Guys... why argue about what he wants to do or what he believes. I personally don't think the first gens are crap (not that i have had personal experience with one) but i do believe the 2nd gens are more refined. The interior is nicer/more modern than a 1st gen and the SOHC and v8 both provide more power, although the SOHC and the tranny have their know faults. None of that matters anyway. He just wants help on a front end swap...Why would we argue about him having a possible V8 JP explorer :dunno:

Ok....

Rick swapped a 2nd gen front clip onto his first gen explorer... He might be able to have some input for going the other way around. Maybe send him a message?

And I think you can swap the hatch, tails and bumper and that match right up... I think...
 






the rear quarter panels will need body filler, the shape of the tail lights are different. other than that all of the 1st gen panels will bolt up
 






the rear quarter panels will need body filler, the shape of the tail lights are different. other than that all of the 1st gen panels will bolt up

See, i thought the tails bolted up, the hatch swap solves the taillight shape issue.

I think you can swap a 98-01 hatch/lights to a 95-97 without panel work needed so I think you could probably swap the first gen stuff on. I could be wrong though
 






where the tail lights meet the quarter panel is curved on the 2nd gen's, but it is straight on the 1st gen's
 












ok, so my question for the OP is why are you building another one? you built a 1st gen JPX like 2 years ago. instead of doing all this work, why didnt you keep the old one?
 






Get a V8 if you want something as reliable as the OHV, the SOHC is terrible when compared to the OHV aside from HP numbers. If you get 98+, swap on an earlier tailgate and 95-97 tails. They won't look exactly like the first gen ones, but who cares. Separate amber turn signals are more functional and safer according to studies.

Three , Unreliability. Your personal stories mean nothing. They don't refect what the majority of explorers are. Go on ebay , go on yahoo cars , go on criags list. Try to find a first gen with over 250k on it. You might find one or two?


4.0 OHV is one of the most reliable engines ford ever made. Sure, the tranny is junk on a first gen, but then again, the automatics are junk on second gens. There are just less broken down second gens because they aren't as old, don't have quite as many miles on them, and haven't been dirt cheap for as long. That means there have been fewer of them in the hands of children and other irresponsible people, or people who just don't have the money for maintenance. On top of that, there were just a TON more second gens produced than first gens. As to your challenge, I can find 5 first gens within a mile of me that all have over 250k on their engines... You show me an IFS Explorer that can take the beating a TTB can. How many second gens are you running across with 250k that actually run well?

As to your other points, you are comparing vehicles of different eras. All early 90s/late 80s cars have nothing for horsepower. Using OHC engines provided a huge boost in power, as did better engine management that is found on 95+ vehicles. If you want to talk about pathetic horsepower numbers, look at vehicles from the early 80s and late 70s that had engines displacing closer to 6 liters and couldn't hardly crack 200 horsepower. An explorer was designed to be a fairly rugged SUV, but was trying to cross over to integrate more creature comforts to attract a larger market. The second gen moved closer to that soccer mom market.


Either way, let me repeat myself.

There are just less broken down second gens because they aren't as old, don't have quite as many miles on them, and haven't been dirt cheap for as long. That means there have been fewer of them in the hands of children and other irresponsible people, or people who just don't have the money for maintenance. On top of that, there were just a TON more second gens produced than first gens.
 






I'll throw something in regarding the question at hand since no one else seems to be interested in helping you do what you want to do.

Guys... why argue about what he wants to do or what he believes. I personally don't think the first gens are crap (not that i have had personal experience with one) but i do believe the 2nd gens are more refined. The interior is nicer/more modern than a 1st gen and the SOHC and v8 both provide more power, although the SOHC and the tranny have their know faults. None of that matters anyway. He just wants help on a front end swap...Why would we argue about him having a possible V8 JP explorer :dunno:

Thank god at least one person has the right idea here.

ok, so my question for the OP is why are you building another one? you built a 1st gen JPX like 2 years ago. instead of doing all this work, why didnt you keep the old one?

I DID keep the old one. It's been sitting in a barn ever since with a laundry list of mechanical issues. This is what I plan to plunder for first gen parts.

There are just less broken down second gens because they aren't as old, don't have quite as many miles on them, and haven't been dirt cheap for as long. That means there have been fewer of them in the hands of children and other irresponsible people, or people who just don't have the money for maintenance. On top of that, there were just a TON more second gens produced than first gens.

So i guess that means it would be better idea to get a 2nd then a 1st.
 






would it maybe be more cost effective to buy a wrecked 2nd gen with the drivetrain of your chosing and swap the powertrains rather than spending as much as double the money on something road ready and then go through and do all of the body work again? With a complete donor vehicle the 5.0 swap is fairly straight forward, as would the SOHC. Just throwing that out there. I would hate to see you do all that body work over again, but then again maybe that is easier for you. plus truth be told i prefer the TTB suspension, especially in a rig that will see trails
 






would it maybe be more cost effective to buy a wrecked 2nd gen with the drivetrain of your chosing and swap the powertrains rather than spending as much as double the money on something road ready and then go through and do all of the body work again?

Comes down to cost and I can buy a second gen and do the bodywork myself. Rather then paying a shop to install a v8 into my current explorer.

I would hate to see you do all that body work over again, but then again maybe that is easier for you.

It is. When it comes to engines I'm useless. But that original explorer only cost 100 sum dollars to paint. And I already know how to do it now , no more learning as i go.
 






You don't need a shop to do the engine swap. Hand tools and a cherry picker are all you need.
 






You don't need a shop to do the engine swap. Hand tools and a cherry picker are all you need.

Correction , all THEY need to change my engine.

Once again why would I bother changing the engine when I could easily just change the exterior of a 2nd and leave the engine alone?
 






Hah ok.

Number one , is the transmission which was absolute junk. Two , the engine was awful. 4 liters and only 150 hp. That's sad. Jeremy Clarkson said it best when he said "How do they get such a small amount of power from such a huge engine?"

And before you say "it's not about power , it's about torque" , save it. This isn't a tractor. It's suppose to be a car.

Three , Unreliability. Your personal stories mean nothing. They don't refect what the majority of explorers are. Go on ebay , go on yahoo cars , go on criags list. Try to find a first gen with over 250k on it. You might find one or two?

Now try to find a toyota or honda from the same year with 250k. There's tons of them. Hundreds infact. That's because given the same age , and lack of matinence , they lasted longer then the explorer. Because they were designed and built better.

And by the way , I've owned 3 first gens. Count em, 1 , 2 , 3. I have an emotional attachment to the make and model. But all three were terrible and cost far more in repairs then any of the 14 cars I've owned.

If I'm going to buy a vehicle based on it's looks alone and ignoring it's awful track record , then I'm going to get the one that sucks the least and could potentially look the same. And thats a second generation explorer , not a first.


Depends on the transmission. The M5OD is solid. It's not perfect, and has a plastic slave cylinder, but so does the second gen. As mentioned, both slushboxes have problems.

The 91-92 Had "150" HP. Power got bumped to 160 HP for 93-94. And it IS all about torque. The 4.0L OHV makes that 160 HP @ 4500 RPM. The 220 lb-ft of torque is at 2200-2500 RPM, which is when you shift because there's nothing more after that except wasted gas and engine wear. Horsepower is a number that is used to sell vehicles. You will wear out an engine in short order if you are constantly holding gears and revving it to the RPM for max HP just because. For performance and racing motors, sure, but for street-driven vehicles, staying within the RPM they were designed to be used lets them work their best and last the longest.

I've only got ~230,000 on mine and it's been driven across the country several times. Not everyone drives that much, so plenty of first gens still have just 100,000+. That doesn't mean they can't go past 250,000, just means they haven't. This argument doesn't make much sense either, since when gas prices hit $4/gallon, people stopped driving their SUV and drove the 30-40MPG car instead. Miles driven doesn't always correlate into the amount of wear and tear on a vehicle, especially one designed to be used off-road, so a 4WD Explorer might only have 100,000 miles on it, but it has seen use and abuse a Honda at 200,000, 300,000, and beyond never will.

It's unfortunate you aren't pleased with the experiences you've had, but maybe your expectations were too high for such a vehicle. I've owned other vehicles, and they are less expensive to own and maintain, but they also just see on-road use. The Explorer costs more to maintain and has stuff you need to keep up with, unlike a car.

I wholeheartedly disagree on the whole lack of reliability claim, because the past few years I've neglected just about all maintenance on mine except for changing the oil, and it never gave any issue. The valves clattered, the rust progressed, the paint peeled, and the ball joints were loose, but it drove great and ran like a top. Now I'm finally getting around to fixing the stuff so it will last another 230,000.

Nothing wrong with preferring a second gen, but they aren't any more reliable or better than the first gen, unless you just prefer the more aerodynamic body style, or the IFS over the TTB.
 






The-Hulk-in-The-Avengers-010.jpg


This thread stupid.
 



Join the Elite Explorers for $20 each year or try it out for $5 a month.

Elite Explorer members see no advertisements, no banner ads, no double underlined links,.
Add an avatar, upload photo attachments, and more!
.





This thread started as a front end swap thread , but then every member who owns a first gen got butt hurt and wrote freaking novels about it.
 






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