MFT Battery Saver message on shutdown

[thefranchise713]

Huh. I must have missed this message some months ago. Just in case this poster is still lurking...

Ok

So are you saying that charging V's during use are high enough to be acceptable and to start the car?
I'm good with that.

But if that is true, why would the low battery message that comes on at shutoff is indicating the state of charge is too low? Or the batt V is too low? It's been charged sufficiently, no?

The contradiction of the above two statements is where I am hung up.

Why would a battery being charged at 13.5V throw a low battery V message? Is it the nature of HOW and WHAT information is being analyzed from the real time performance data to determine whether to throw the message at shutdown?

Voltage and State of Charge are being measured differently by the BCM. Just because you maintain a system voltage of 13.5+ while the vehicle is running does not mean that the state of charge is at a sufficient level to keep the BCM happy to prevent load shed.

An example of this is when the vehicle is jumped. The alternator will bring system state of charge to 13+ volts, but the state of charge will be far lower until the system actually fully recovers. When the car powers down and the MFT powerdown message comes on, it's more than likely triggering off the State of Charge number being too low in the BCM as opposed to a voltage read.

The triggers of a load shed are different for when the car is engine on vs. engine off. When the vehicle is engine on, it's more concerned about maintaining system voltage as trigger for a load shed. When it is engine off, it's more concerned about the State of Charge reading. Voltage is reveiwed and SOC is reviewed in both conditions if I recall correctly, but one is more important than the other depending on the engine run state.

 

[bigdude2468]

The low battery message on our 2014 with 35,000 miles starting showing up last fall, exactly three years old. I put a charger on the battery a couple of times overnight and that seemed to "fix" the problem for a few days. Then the message would appear again. With winter fast approaching I figured why take a chance. Bought a new battery that has significantly more cold cranking amps, physically larger but still fits just fine in the tray. Message has not appeared since.

 

[derfderf]

Hi....still lurking....

How many of us, over the years, old and new, have ever had this message pop up on the screen AND done nothing about it AND had their battery be dead/useless within a month (again having done NOTHING to the system) under continued normal usage? 2 months, 3?

I am not asking to be sarcastic.

I am trying to help us gather some data so that we might be able to "semi isolate" this to the battery age, etc, era (this gen vs that gen vs ???, different threshold values in the different versions of BCM software that uses the BSM data to determine if all is happy and well?

I'm sorry, but if I've been driving on the highway every day twice a day for 50 mi total, I find it absurd that my battery V may be definitely in a range that might allow starting of the car, but that the state of charge would not be high enough to ensure sufficient cranking amps are present as well.

As we all know, it's the CURRENT drawn from the battery that (indirectly) turns the starter motor which spins the flywheel which allows your engine to start, all other things working properly considered). IF the V is not high enough, you will have no chance of being able to generate enough current to crank the engine sufficiently.

If the State of Charge MIGHT NOT BE high enough (this is a loaded one, since a 100% charged battery that is undersized for the application (cannot physically output enough current) won't start the vehicle either.----so I get a warning that it MIGHT NOT BE at a high enough state of charge to start the car.

Ultimately It depends on the specs of the battery, the specs of the application (required CA and CCA), condition of the battery.
If my vehicle's load shedding algorithm decided to leave my battery in a state where apparently the ONLY way to get it to stop displaying the annoying message is to trickle charge it twice a month, I must ask why the vehicle's charging algorithm can't increase the ALT output and charge the thing up itself? The only acceptable answer to that for me would be "it can't" because the battery condition sucks and the battery will not hold the additional charge being provided.

Again, how many of us have ignored the message and killed a battery within a month or 2?

Essentially, how conservative, underconservative, overconservative alarmist is that message when the state of charge is at play?

I have to think Ford is playing it extra safe---but maybe overly so --or they are shipping batteries w poor quality control, or are they knowingly undersized NOT in that they cannot reliably start the vehicle, but undersized such that they are breaking down internally from the stress and cannot hold a full charge 2 yrs into a 3/36k battery?

Any and all data accepted. Thanks!

I might add "system of to save battery" means if I turn my system off I will save battery capacity.
It does NOT say "system off to ensure vehicle starts at next key on".

Granted it is a battery health message where there was none before except maybe a few slow crank starts, and it may help to flush some early failure batteries out of the woods, but HOW CONSERVATIVE is it?

 

[thefranchise713]

^ The thresholds are published in the Workshop Manual. I would post the exact numbers but I lost access to mine some time ago and it's not affordable to renew it.

If memory serves, load shed kicks in:

Engine Off: 40% SoC or 45 minutes of stereo/MFT operation, can't remember voltage ##.
Engine On: Somewhere south of 11 or 12 volts.

The BCM triggers err on conservative with engine off/key on. As far as the battery dilemmas, I blame poor suppliers on that one. My battery just died a week or two ago and I never had a load shed warning, although one could argue on the engineering side that they were designed for a different purpose. The engine off strategy is more about getting the car started again, the key on strategy is keeping the critical components running should the battery/charging system begin to fail catastrophically.

For your stats, mine failed after about 7 months or so and 15,4k miles.

 

[peterk9]

Hi....still lurking....

How many of us, over the years, old and new, have ever had this message pop up on the screen AND done nothing about it AND had their battery be dead/useless within a month (again having done NOTHING to the system) under continued normal usage? 2 months, 3?

I had the battery saver message come on in my 2011 Limited and 2014 MKT. With the 2011 it would come on about 1 or 2 times a month. Just put the trickle charger on it each time and the battery never died during the 3 years I had it. On the MKT is didn't happen quite as often but again the battery never was replaced. After 3 months of having the 2017, I'm getting a somewhat similar message but it pops up on the Sync screen when starting up.

Peter

 

[lcarolashley]

2013 SYNC issue

I am having problem with the sync on my 2013 Ford Explorer LTD. It tells me system off to save battery. I am not sure what is happening. I have lost all the setting on my seats and doors. Please advise. NEED HELP

 

[Jon M]

It sounds like your battery is going bad/is bad. Any other electrical or starting issues?

 

[peterk9]

2013 SYNC issue

I am having problem with the sync on my 2013 Ford Explorer LTD. It tells me system off to save battery. I am not sure what is happening. I have lost all the setting on my seats and doors. Please advise. NEED HELP

Welcome to the Forum.
When does this happen? After you shut off the vehicle or when driving? If it occurs while driving it is an indication that your battery isn't able to keep up with the demand and the Battery Management System (BMS) will begin to shut down certain secondary programs to preserve power. See your Owner's Manual, page 351 of the 4th edition, under Battery Management System.

Peter

 

[lcarolashley]

It sounds like your battery is going bad/is bad. Any other electrical or starting issues?

No, I just change battery about a year or two ago.

 

[lcarolashley]

Welcome to the Forum.
When does this happen? After you shut off the vehicle or when driving? If it occurs while driving it is an indication that your battery isn't able to keep up with the demand and the Battery Management System (BMS) will begin to shut down certain secondary programs to preserve power. See your Owner's Manual, page 351 of the 4th edition, under Battery Management System.

Peter

It happens after I turn call off.

 

[peterk9]

It happens after I turn call off.

I've merged your thread with this one found using the Forum's 'Search' feature.
The issue isn't with Sync, it is more than likely the battery or the Battery Management System (BMS). Did you read the last paragraph on page 351?
Some members have said that when you replace a battery that the BMS should be reset so the system will know that a new battery has been installed and will erase the previous memory in regards to the battery's age. It is not mentioned in your Manual however.
see this post; Battery Replacement / Upgrade - Battery Re-Learn

Peter

 

[thefranchise713]

No, I just change battery about a year or two ago.

Check it again. First battery died after 8 months, second battery began to fail after a year.

After that I abandoned the Motorcraft brand.

 

[ljcorby]

All, although I have not read the entire thread, and as I am sure someone has already said, this is a battery issue. Replace or have the batter replaced and be done with it. I also had a similar issue on our 2013 XLT. The battery that gets installed at the factory is, in my opinion, not adequate enough or powerful enough. The one in our 2013 was small and only 550CCA. I replaced it with the correct model battery but with 850CCA.....haven't had a stitch of issues since. I know this is an expense if your out of warranty, but you will thank yourself for doing it. If you are still under warranty, tell your local dealer you want a real battery installed in these very expensive vehicles.

 

[thefranchise713]

^ I put an 850 CCA monster in mine, too. Cheers.

 

[GeraldFord]

I assume this also has something to do with the overall issues people are seeing...

• 
  
  
  • Well here is the information from the Service manual - This is clearly an issue..
    
    This is taken directly from the 2016 Ford Utility Interceptor Service Manual **Also applies to civilian vehicle** regarding battery state of charge monitoring, external charger connections, jump starting and battery replacement:
    
    Battery State of Charge
    
    The BCM uses the battery current sensor to keep track of the battery state of charge. The battery current sensor is a Hall-effect sensor attached to the battery ground cable. During a drive cycle the Electrical Energy Management software adjusts the battery state of charge by monitoring the charge and discharge current and adjusting the state of charge up during charging, and down during discharge. During rest periods (key off with no electrical loads) when the vehicle enters sleep mode, the battery voltage is sampled to calibrate the State of Charge. The BCM automatically executes this calibration anytime the vehicle enters sleep mode and when the total vehicle current draw is below 300mA. It takes 8 hours in the sleep mode to calibrate the battery state of charge to high accuracy. If the system draw does not allow the battery state of charge calibration over the previous 7 to 10 days the State of Charge quality factor changes to flag this and some Electrical Energy ManagementFunctions which rely on the accuracy of the battery state of charge may be temporarily turned off until a calibration takes place.
    
    Battery Charging
    
    When charging the vehicle battery by connecting the charger to engine or chassis ground , the negative charger clamp must be connected to an unpainted chassis surface or a solid engine component such as a generator mount or engine lifting eye. In this instance, after charging, the BMS Reset is not required . Through this method of charging the BCM updates the battery state of charge during the charging process.
    
    When charging the vehicle battery by connecting the charger to the negative battery terminal is necessary , such as when using a combinationbattery charger and battery tester/analyzer, like the GR 1 190 V3.0 Intelligent Diagnostic Charger, the BCM does not immediately update thebattery state of charge. In this instance, the BMS Reset must be carried out using a diagnostic scan tool. This reset is needed for proper engine off load shedding and to prevent invoking of engine off load shedding earlier than normal.
    If the reset is not carried out, when the battery is charged by connecting the charger to the negative battery terminal, it takes approximately 8 hours for the BCM to learn the new battery state of charge. During this 8 hour period, the vehicle must be undisturbed, with no doors opened or keyless entry button presses. If the vehicle is used before the BCM is allowed to learn the new battery state of charge, engine off load shedding can still occur and a message may be displayed.
    
    Jump Starting
    
    When it is necessary to jump start the vehicle it is important to connect the cables properly in order for the Electrical Energy Managementsystem to measure the energy input to the system to keep an accurate state of charge. Connect the positive cable to the battery positive post and the jump start negative cable to a vehicle ground. Do not connect to the negative battery terminal. Connecting directly to the batterynegative post bypasses the ability of the vehicle to measure the input current, and does not adjust the battery state of charge accordingly. For a good connection point, follow the negative cable from the battery monitoring sensor to the vehicle body connection (typically on the shock tower sheet metal). If the vehicle was improperly jump started, the Electrical Energy Management system calibrates the battery state of charge after about 8 hours.
    
    Battery Replacement
    
    If the vehicle battery is replaced, it is very important to perform the BMS Reset using a diagnostic scan tool. If the BMS Reset is not carried out, it holds the old battery parameters and time in service counter in memory. Additionally it tells the system the battery is in an aged state and may limit the Electrical Energy Management system functions. For more information,
    Refer to: Battery and Cables - System Operation and Component Description (414-01 Battery, Mounting and Cables, Description and Operation).

OMG. So why have this battery message if nobody’s going to have the time or tools, or heads up to follow through on this? Buy the battery and hook er up and go, right? Is the battery even dying; has anyone ever been broke down by the side of the road thinking “I should have listened”?

 

[peterk9]

OMG. So why have this battery message if nobody’s going to have the time or tools, or heads up to follow through on this? Buy the battery and hook er up and go, right? Is the battery even dying; has anyone ever been broke down by the side of the road thinking “I should have listened”?

Welcome to the Forum.
In the post you quoted, I don't see where any "tools" are required. As for the statement " Buy the battery and hook er up and go, right?" Yes you can but see the part about "Battery Replacement"
I get the message occasionally because I don't drive that much or very short distances. When it pops up I just throw the charger on it.

Peter

 

[GeraldFord]

Welcome to the Forum.
In the post you quoted, I don't see where any "tools" are required. As for the statement " Buy the battery and hook er up and go, right?" Yes you can but see the part about "Battery Replacement"
I get the message occasionally because I don't drive that much or very short distances. When it pops up I just throw the charger on it.

Peter

Hi Peter,

Welcome to the Forum.
In the post you quoted, I don't see where any "tools" are required. As for the statement " Buy the battery and hook er up and go, right?" Yes you can but see the part about "Battery Replacement"
I get the message occasionally because I don't drive that much or very short distances. When it pops up I just throw the charger on it.

Peter

Hi Peter, I guess I was referring to “GR 1 190 V3.0 Intelligent Diagnostic Charger” as a tool.

I’m pretty sure my problem is battery/alternator related, and I do use a lot of plug it in because I’m an Uber driver. I bought a used 2012 explorer in January and aside from some body work there are problems galore… Right now it,s my cooling fans and ac system. I am flooded with repairs I don’t have money for. I do work on my own vehicle but the parts are not cheap

 

[GeraldFord]

Hi Peter,

Hi Peter, I guess I was referring to “GR 1 190 V3.0 Intelligent Diagnostic Charger” as a tool.

I’m pretty sure my problem is battery/alternator related, and I do use a lot of plug it in because I’m an Uber driver. I bought a used 2012 explorer in January and aside from some body work there are problems galore… Right now it,s my cooling fans and ac system. I am flooded with repairs I don’t have money for. I do work on my own vehicle but the parts are not cheap

The previous owner of my Explorer dumped it at the perfect time LOL Time for a new this in time for a new that!

 

[Jon M]

These things eat batteries, so if you're having electrical issues that's the first stop. If you're a Costco member, they sell Interstate batteries for about 1/2 the normal price.

 

[Dhamrick74]

(2014 XLT AWD) System Off to Save Battery right after turning off engine

Started to see this today, -22C outside, 2nd hit this winter for low temperature.

I don't know how long does it takes to fully charge the battery. Some threads mentioned something like 10-15min which doesn't make any sense for me.

Just came back from a 300Km round trip, assuming battery fully charged. I might left a CAR DVR running overnight, which has tag DC input 5V/1A. I don't know if it's responsible for the battery drain. 12Hrs is about 6AH for 12V battery, it should not affect a car battery much. I had a slow start, but it started.

A side questions will be, if the front Cigarette charge can be programmed to turn off after some idling time.

It's very weird for me, the front cigarette charge doesn't see to power the 5V car DVR at all, normally when temp is lower than -5C. But it definitely provided power last night, because I can see DVR recordings which were taken when car is under -20C. I felt the cigarette charger has some smart logic behind, or the the 12V output is not that stable (CAR DVR turn on/off based on the input voltage it detects). Very confused!!!

Thanks for any comment, I will drive some distance to charge battery today.

I’ve noticed, the majority of these complaints are during colder weather seasons. Is this a link to the issue possibly?