Solved No start.

[danno2944]

After driving most of the day yesterday, I came home for a few hours then when I went to start truck it started, barely, got to around 900rpm and died out.

Went to start again sounded like it was going to go, was definitely firing, but wouldn't start.

The timing chain rattle has been occurring at cold starts for about 7500kms, it goes for about 5seconds then goes away.

I have no error codes, truck has ran well for the winter, but a few symptoms I have experienced prior to this no start problem are,
A, During initial start up, the engine will rev from anywhere to 1200-1900 rpm, then normalizes.
B, The idle has been a little rough as of late, not bad at all, but still noticeable low rpm idle dip up to about 100rpm fluctuations.
C. During start up, only very recently and sporadically, I have had to hold the starter for extended period 3-5 seconds for a start up.

Rented a Fuel pressure tester today, plenty of fuel. Pre prime held at 60psi.
I haven't tested spark, but I am sure it's there, I will figure out how to test that tonight and give it a go tmmrw.
I have a compression tester, but last time I tried to get the spark plugs put, I couldn't, last bit of Maintenence (changing plugs) that I have yet to accomplish for this reason.

Also was wondering if it Could it be a cam position sensor? Mine has the fuel line running directly over the nut... and I can't really tell where the clip for the electrical connectors is for this sensor?

 

[BrooklynBay]

Check the condition of the spark plugs.

 

[danno2944]

I believe they are crap, I tried to remove in the spring and fall since I already have new plugs. I felt like they were going to break. I will try again.

You think this could cause a no start?

 

[BrooklynBay]

It can't start if the plugs won't fire.

 

[danno2944]

Your probably right, I really soaked them with penetrating fluid, so hopefully they will go.

 

[Mbrooks420]

It should start with a failed cam sensor. After a good soak, the plugs will probably come out. I’d make sure to use the proper type of plug socket with the insert to help from breaking them off when you try and torque them out.

 

[danno2944]

I have followed that exact procedure twice now Mr Brooks. Thirds a charm hopefully...

 

[Mbrooks420]

A secondary option wold be pulling the valve covers to see if the valves are actuating.

 

[koda2000]

Not to be the voice of doom, but if it's been rattling on cold-start for 7500 miles, it's possible it's jumped time. This is most likely to happen at cold startup, before oil pressure gets into the chain tensions. You probably have a broken chain guide(s) and broken pieces of plastic sitting in the bottom of your oil pan. Removing your valve covers and checking for broken TC cassettes will tell the tale.

Two things I would do before spending much time (or any money) is to drop the oil pan and remove the valve covers. If you get the spark plugs out a compression test (be sure to do both banks) would also be helpful. If you've jumped time and have bad compression on one bank your engine is toast. If you have broken cassettes, but good compression your engine is savable, but if the passenger side cassette is broken the engine will have to come out to replace it.

 

[danno2944]

Been rattling about 5000miles/7500kms.

Really hoping the timing is fine, does it normally fail on a start up, I have only heard of them failing at cruising speed?

Thanks for the advice, I will work on plugs today.

So it's possible that if spark is good, compression is still present, and it still won't start, that the cassette breaking caused a no start.

So test spark, compression. If that's good and no start, than drop pan.

 

[Mbrooks420]

The tensioners won’t cause a no start condition unless you’ve jumped time and bent the valves. As mentioned above this is likely to happen on cold start before the tensioners are primed.

 

[koda2000]

They tend to jump-time at cold-start because this is when there is the most slack in the un-tensioned timing chains. They tend to break timing chains at higher RPM (like cruising speeds). I hope your issue is something simple, but timing chains cause the typical death to the SOHC engine.

 

[donalds]

.

 

[danno2944]

.

View attachment 168670

Is that a picture of a tensioner?

Seems odd that it could jump timing on such a limp start, as I have said, the thing barely started for maybe a 1/2second and stalled before even reaching 1000 rpm. But knowing it started, and now sounds so limp turning over, almost like it's lacking power/timing, it could be the worst case scenario here...

 

[Mbrooks420]

As mentioned 3 times it’s due to them not being primed.

 

[danno2944]

Tried to start again, it sounded like she was going to go, maybe 2 cylinders fired. Stumbled a rumble and nothing.

Battery is juiced barely hass enough to crank her over.

Charging and going after plugs.

 

[donalds]

They tend to break timing chains at higher RPM (like cruising speeds)

Damn I never heard of them jumping at cruising
Is that with bad guides or just randomly break

 

[Mbrooks420]

In my experience timing chains breaking are almost always in conjunction with another problem. Usually bad tensioners, or too little manual tension and then the chains fatigue from the constant chain slap. Granted, this is experience from small displacement high performance motors, but most of the principles translate to the auto world.

 

[koda2000]

I've never had a vehicle with spark plugs sooo bad it won't start. Run poorly, yes. Get poor fuel economy, yes. Not want to idle, yes.

Do the diagnostics and see what you find. Begin with the easiest stuff first.

 

[BrooklynBay]

This once happened to my 1988 van. It wouldn't start until I replaced the spark plugs.