positive camber after replacing upper control arms

[chrissm14]

hi guys, been reading alot on this site since i bought my 04 XLT about a month ago. 2 weekends ago i replaced both front upper control arms, and it took FOREVER because of the rust on the bolts. i got it all put back together and torque'd to spec, but both wheels now have positive camber, tilting inward at the top like this /\. The angle isnt that extreme but its definitely noticeable. my truck pulls to the right now so i want to try to fix this this weekend to avoid tire wear. the new ones looked to be exactly like the factory ones, but the new UCA-to-frame nuts that came with it were regular hex nuts. they did not have a washer on one end, so they are about an 1/8" shorter than the factory bolts. i have looked online at various UCA's for sale, and all the pictures of them show nuts with washers. Since the new nuts are 1/8" shorter than the factory ones, could this be throwing the camber off? if so, would i be able to just put some 1/8" thick washers between the nuts and shims to correct the problem?

if that wont work, how can i adjust the camber? ive searched several places but cant seem to find a good answer. im still using the factory shims, shouldnt i be able to adjust the camber without installing a camber kit, since i just installed an oem UCA and didnt lift the truck or anything? thanks in advance for the help yall!:exp::exp::roll::roll::JP:

 

[Dave8338]

Did you replace the lower ball joints at the same time? I've seen it where just doing the tops, if the bottoms are loose, and the bushings are soft from age can cause them to tip in at the tops.

Also, you'll need an alignment as it certainly changed that.

 

[2000StreetRod]

positive vs negative camber

Positive camber:
top
\ /
bottom

Negative camber:
top
/ \
bottom

Negative camber allows better cornering.

Move the vehicle and check again. Tires may be holding arms at abnormal angle after jacking. Worn lower ball joints contribute to negative camber. If ball joints are good then you just need an alignment. Camber and caster adjustments effect each other.

 

[Number4]

Did you reuse the camber shims? With the two hooks on one end? They go on just before the mounting nuts to the chassis. If these were reused, you should be fine. If not you'd have the potential for movement on top of being out of spec.

 

[chrissm14]

Positive camber:
top
\ /
bottom

Negative camber:
top
/ \
bottom

Negative camber allows better cornering.

Move the vehicle and check again. Tires may be holding arms at abnormal angle after jacking. Worn lower ball joints contribute to negative camber. If ball joints are good then you just need an alignment. Camber and caster adjustments effect each other.

My bad, it is negative camber. Would neg camber cause it to pull to the right? i have done my own alignment in my old 95 integra, but the only thing that is adjustable on that was the toe. I did this 2 weeks ago so ive been driving the truck as it is. When it pulls to the right, the steering wheel is straight ahead and slowly drifts to the right.

What is the procedure for checking the lower ball joints? i checked for play in both wheels with my hands at 12 and 6, but it did not have any. only reason i changed the uppers was because the boots were split open and dry rotted. the lower boots appear to be fine.

does anyone know the exact procedure for adjusting the camber and can it be done with the factory shims?

 

[chrissm14]

Did you reuse the camber shims? With the two hooks on one end? They go on just before the mounting nuts to the chassis. If these were reused, you should be fine. If not you'd have the potential for movement on top of being out of spec.

i did reuse the factory shims, but the nuts that came with the new control arms did not have a washer on them so they are about an 1/8" shorter than the factory nuts. also every picture ive seen online of UCAs for sale include the nuts with the washers.

 

[Ronin8002]

i did reuse the factory shims, but the nuts that came with the new control arms did not have a washer on them so they are about an 1/8" shorter than the factory nuts. also every picture ive seen online of UCAs for sale include the nuts with the washers.

Sounds like you need an alignment. Both caster and camber can be impacted by replacing the upper control arms, so I'd just take it into a place to get it done. Might be possible to eyeball it/measuring tape it but it's hard to do and it's usually not as good as the machine used by a technician who knows his business.

 

[cross6]

i did reuse the factory shims, but the nuts that came with the new control arms did not have a washer on them so they are about an 1/8" shorter than the factory nuts. also every picture ive seen online of UCAs for sale include the nuts with the washers.

Moog sells an "alignment kit" which is just a small box with 8 of the real thick washers for the upper control arm nuts.

 

[Number4]

I agree, work like that always has me getting an alignment. With tires that cost $200 each, I prefer the piece of mind of having a shop do it.

 

[chrissm14]

Thanks guys I think im just gonna give in and take it to the shop to get an alignment tomorrow. I was wondering though, do I need a 4 wheel alignment or just front end alignment? I cant see how the alignment in the rear would have been affected.

 

[Dave8338]

Thanks guys I think im just gonna give in and take it to the shop to get an alignment tomorrow. I was wondering though, do I need a 4 wheel alignment or just front end alignment? I cant see how the alignment in the rear would have been affected.

YES. Anytime you replace major suspension parts on an fully independent suspension vehicle, a four wheel alignment should be done. I'd be surprised if a shop would even do just the front...

 

[roboron13]

Moog sells an "alignment kit" which is just a small box with 8 of the real thick washers for the upper control arm nuts.

NO IT IS NOT!!! It includes the aligning bolts, 8 washers and bolts, complete set. But 1 set is 2 bolts, so u have to order 2 sets, 1 for each side!!!

 

[Number4]

NO IT IS NOT!!!

Shhh! No yelling, we were all sleeping.