Powertrax No-slip driving problems

[zensius]

Hey all. I installed a no-slip in the rear of my '92 about 4 months ago. I thought it was working right but I've hardly been off-road. And not for a while. So yesterday I was leaving a customer's house. They had a steep uphill driveway the had a sharp left turn. Every time I got about halfway through the turn the inside tire would spin and the outside tire didn't do anything! I was stopped. In a driveway for crissakes! So what's the deal? I know the design of the locker is so that one wheel dissengages on the turn. But this isn't working for me. Am I driving it wrong? I had to keep backing up until I got the truck straightened out before I could get home. Anybody?

 

[Alec]

did you try powerbraking a bit then slowly letting off the brake? or using the ebrake 1 or 2 notches? Oftentimes autolockers or ls' need a little help locking under heavy loads.

 

[jobunn]

Hey all. I installed a no-slip in the rear of my '92 about 4 months ago. I thought it was working right but I've hardly been off-road. And not for a while. So yesterday I was leaving a customer's house. They had a steep uphill driveway the had a sharp left turn. Every time I got about halfway through the turn the inside tire would spin and the outside tire didn't do anything! I was stopped. In a driveway for crissakes! So what's the deal? I know the design of the locker is so that one wheel dissengages on the turn. But this isn't working for me. Am I driving it wrong? I had to keep backing up until I got the truck straightened out before I could get home. Anybody?

It should lock up immediately at the slightest hint of wheelspin. A barking inside tire would be expected but if you are spinning just one tire there is something wrong. Does it do this only when you are making an uphill left turn?

 

[JDraper]

Definitely sounds like something isn't working right. Almost every time I've seen problems with Powertrax units, it's been because of the install. Biggest mistakes seem to be leaving shims in the case, not getting the little springs in properly, or grinding the centerpin. I have heard of people occasionally busting one of the lock pins, but that seems to be the exception rather than the rule.

 

[spindlecone]

Actually i believe your powertrax is working as designed, less power on a sharp turn is the key to making the unit work properly and as alec states power braking will help.
If you overpower the inside tire you will get no traction to the slower outside tire.
A full lock on both tires is only achieved when the vehical is straight, thats why the powertrax is so street friendly and quite.
I found the installation to pretty simple tho Time consuming, with my application the side gear thrust washers were reinstalled as per powertrax insructions.
If you still have the install manual, run thru the test proceedures at the very end to make sure all is working as it should, you can also download the entire install off the PT site, good luck

 

[JDraper]

Actually i believe your powertrax is working as designed, less power on a sharp turn is the key to making the unit work properly and as alec states power braking will help.
If you overpower the inside tire you will get no traction to the slower outside tire.
A full lock on both tires is only achieved when the vehical is straight, thats why the powertrax is so street friendly and quite....

I'm not trying to be a PITA, but....No ,that's not how it's supposed to work. The powertrax is supposed to let the wheel that is under no torque freewheel, not the wheel that is travelling faster. It will lock up on corners or in a straight line when torque is applied. When no torque, or very little torque is applied, the design allows one wheel to rotate faster. If you are in a corner and the unit is allowing slip, a quick shot on the throttle will lock the unit up. If it worked as you state above, no one would buy them because they would be useless offroading.

Here's a quick summary of the way the design works. The springs and the design of the hole that the cross shaft fits into are the key to how it works. The springs keep light tension on the teeth so that the power can be applied to the wheels at all times. When cornering under light loads, the torque applied to the unit by the difference in wheel rotational speed is enough to overpower the spring pressure, allowing the teeth to slip. That's when you hear the ratcheting noise.

If you look at how the cross shaft fits into the center hole, you will notice that there is some slop (this is why there is more drivetrain lash with the unit installed), and that the center hole is not the same shape as the pin. When torque is applied, the pin twists (front to back) in the hole, forcing the paddles out into the gears and locking the unit up. This happens when torque is applied, regardless of if you are in a straight line or cornering.

I have installed quite a few No-Slips and Lock-Rites, and I have run one of each in my vehicles. Every one that I have installed or run will lock up when torque is applied, regardless of how you are driving.

 

[spindlecone]

JD am not questioning your expertise, perhaps you can enlighten me, the PT no slips are 100% silent, as they are supposed to be, in my experiance you only hear the ratcheing on the lock- rights, as a true locker, thats normal as I understand it.
This from page 6 of the PT manual.
In a turn, the outside wheel in effect accelerates ahead of the inside wheel to compensate for the diff in the turning radius distance of the inner verses the outer wheels. as the outer wheel rotates faster, because it must travel farther than the inside wheel.It advances the coupler from the driver and relaxes power didtributed to the outside wheel. as the coupler continues to advance, it ramps the driver to disingage from the coupler. the syncro ring continues to turn with the coupler, untill it is stopped by the active spacer paddle, The syncro ring is than positioned to prevent re-engagment of the driver and coupler until the turn is complete, the outside wheel in the turn continues to rotate freely with power being deliverd to the inside wheel, when the turn is concluded, the syncro mechanism is reset and power is re-applied to both wheels, what am I missing here?

 

[jasonb]

my no slip sure as heck engages no matter what when i apply torque. turning, straight, whatever.

 

[spindlecone]

Jason
Do have the lock-rite, or the no slip traction system, differant animals

 

[jasonb]

no slip front and rear

 

[mrboyle]

Spindlecone, the Powertrax will lock in a corner when under power, it only unlocks when coasting.

 

[spindlecone]

Call me stupid but page 6 that I posted denotes under power

 

[GJarrett]

Actually, when I am already in a corner turning, I have to hit my throttle pretty hard to lock mine up. I can be halfway through a turn and give it a fairly reasonable amount of throttle and it won't lock up if the tires are already turning different speeds while in the turn. If I'm going straight, it locks up much sooner with a lot less throttle; but if already in the turn, it takes some power to lock mine up.

 

[JDraper]

Spindlecone, the No-Slips aren't 100% silent, they still ratchet like a Lock-Rite, but they are considerably quieter and smoother than the Lock-Rite. The manual is correct, but it leaves out some info. What it leaves out is that you can override the "cornering release mechanism" (For lack of a better term) two ways. First is by liberal application of power. In both my Explorer (No-Slip) and my Samurai (Lock-Rite), stomping on the gas in a corner will lock up the unit. If I'm in a sharp corner, the inside wheel will lock and squeal on the pavement (Doug got a ticket from a jerk of a New Jersey cop because his did this). If I'm in a more gentle corner, the truck will just twitch as the thrust vector moves from the inside wheel to the center of the vehicle.

The second way is if the inside tire spins. If the inside tire starts to spin, it and the outside tire will be turning at the same rate under power for a short time. To the Powertrax, it sees that both wheels are at the same speed, and it locks up.


The No-Slip is definitely smoother than the Lock Rite, and it definitely takes more power to lock it up in a corner, but it will lock while cornering under the conditions I mentioned above. The Lock-Rite is definitely less sophisticated in it's manners, and even my underpowered Sammy can lock it in a corner fairly easily. As Gerald said, when cornering, you definitely need to mash the stupid pedal to lock up the No-Slip, but it will lock.

 

[spindlecone]

Thx
That makes sense, mines only been in for about 4 mos and as a streeter I have not had the oppurtunity to really be in a position to try and lock it up in a turn.
I assume that what you are saying is that if one say in gravel or grass or whatever really jumps on the gas, once the inner tire reaches or exceeds the speed of the outer tire the no-slip will ramp power back to the outside tire and both will be fully locked?
Thx Bill

 

[JDraper]

Yup, that's what it will do. It will also transfer power from side to side if you are in a low traction situation where traction comes and goes. I was once on a very steep, wet smooth rock incline, and my rear wheels were randomly slipping. Power kept transferring back and forth to the wheel with more traction. Worked very nicely.

 

[aldive]

Thx
That makes sense, mines only been in for about 4 mos and as a streeter I have not had the oppurtunity to really be in a position to try and lock it up in a turn.
I assume that what you are saying is that if one say in gravel or grass or whatever really jumps on the gas, once the inner tire reaches or exceeds the speed of the outer tire the no-slip will ramp power back to the outside tire and both will be fully locked?
Thx Bill

Just curious but why would you add this rear end for your street truck?

 

[spindlecone]

Thx JD, being a little ****, was at a watch show today, off in the far parking lot they laid down about two acres of crushed granet, getting ready to pave next week, guess what I did? no slip works as advertized, tires are in pain, but my install works,WHOO HOO

 

[spindlecone]

Al
Because I had an open diff to begin with, it was cost effective to install the no slip over a ford LS which IMO is garbage, I wanted no clutches, I wanted a silent locker, I wanted to have 100% of the transferred power to be directed to each rear wheel equaly, need I say more? was the only intelligent thing to do, surely you understand

 

[zensius]

So, I'm hoping it's just driver error...but I want to run the test. Does anybody have the recommended test that comes in the installation manual? I've got no idea where my manual is.
If it's driver error. Actually I think it's a particularly sensitive situation (sharp uphill turn) for the No slip and an inexperienced driver. But I'm still not sure what I'm supposed to do in this situation. Mash the go pedal or ride the brakes a little?