PTU serviced....now what?

[Torataco]

Just had ptu done at 60k on base 2015 explorer w 60k miles and tow package ...can I add cooler or anything else to prevent a meltdown again?

 

[peterk9]

Welcome to the Forum.
If you have the factory installed tow package, you should have everything you need. Do you do a lot of towing?

Peter

 

[Mbrooks420]

Super short interval fluid changes. Flawed design. No way to actually “fix” it.

 

[ecoboost_xsport]

Cooler could be added, but you'd need a few parts. First, the PTU that has the side cooler attachment (it is slightly different than the one without the cooler), You'll need the supply/return lines, then the section of radiator hose that splits off the radiator. You MAY even need the radiator from one with a cooler. I've always speculated this conversion could be done, but no one has actually done it that I'm aware of. Not on an SHO, Flex, or XSport.

BTW, here's a blog post I wrote with some historical PTU information...

The Guide to Understanding the History of the Ecoboost Power Transfer Unit [Study]

Lot’s of talk recently about the Ford Power Transfer Unit (PTU). It is definitely a frequently referenced component and has been known to be prone to many failures. Below is very interesting video I was turned onto by a member of the SHO forum a few weeks ago. It’s not Ford-specific but does a...

www.fortheworkshop.com

 

[mguy13sport]

Do the vent pipe fill mod so you can regularly drain and fill it. There is no solution as mentioned

 

[ecoboost_xsport]

Yup, even with a cooler, you'd still want to do the vent mod extension. I'd assumed you already did that and wanted to try your hand at further modification...not impossible, but would require work and money. Juice may not even be worth the squeeze. Frequent fluid changes is the best answer to your problems. I change after every race weekend, but that may be excessive to some. Here are some other articles and how-to's as they relate to the PTU I wrote up that may assist you:

How to Install a PTU Drain Plug, Complete the PTU Vent Extension Modification and an Engine Oil Change [Infographic]

Got the engine as well as the PTU oil done. Engine Oil: Pretty straight forward, just showing you guys the switch I made from el cheapo middle of the road Pennzoil stuff to some better Amsoil fluid and filter… Oil filter is about 33% larger than that cheap service station filter I had on...

www.fortheworkshop.com

An In-Depth Analysis of Potential PTU Improvements [Step-By-Step Guide]

Introduction This is my attempt at doing what little we can to improve the PTU with what is currently available. I’d also like to make it a resource for those of you looking for detailed photos of the latest version of the PTU that has the cooler. I’ve completely torn down the PTU, and sourced […]

www.fortheworkshop.com

 

[94Eddie]

Just had ptu done at 60k on base 2015 explorer w 60k miles and tow package ...can I add cooler or anything else to prevent a meltdown again?

Doing a drain and refill every 30k miles is the best you can do to prevent another replacement. The PTUs are roasted by the engine and exhaust and this is very hard on the fluid in them.

 

[texsn95]

For the vent extension, is it better to pull the hose from the PTU and add a single long extension, or remove the vent cap from the existing tube and add a barbed hose extension?

 

[Odrapnew]

For the vent extension, is it better to pull the hose from the PTU and add a single long extension, or remove the vent cap from the existing tube and add a barbed hose extension?

I think the first would be best.
One less connection to worry about.

 

[mguy13sport]

Get 2ft of fuel line and a clamp. The factory vent hose is very short and No clamp.. just yank it off. Take the cap off the factory hose and put it on new one

 

[texsn95]

What ID fuel line, 3/4? Can you even get your hand down there to set a clamp?

 

[Mbrooks420]

You could always use a spring clamp. It’s a vent, so in normal operation it just lets air in and out while keeping debris/road water from entering. It’s not like it needs a pressurized seal.

 

[ecoboost_xsport]

What ID fuel line, 3/4? Can you even get your hand down there to set a clamp?

3/8"

Its better if you're under the car, on your back, feet facing our the front and put your hands up to the top of the PTU. You stuck doing it blind though.

Check out my link for a bit more info on the install.

How to Install a PTU Drain Plug, Complete the PTU Vent Extension Modification and an Engine Oil Change [Infographic]

Got the engine as well as the PTU oil done. Engine Oil: Pretty straight forward, just showing you guys the switch I made from el cheapo middle of the road Pennzoil stuff to some better Amsoil fluid and filter… Oil filter is about 33% larger than that cheap service station filter I had on...

www.fortheworkshop.com

 

[funwithbono]

Do the vent pipe fill mod so you can regularly drain and fill it. There is no solution as mentioned

I’ve been using the “vent pipe mod” since new on my ‘16 sport. It takes about 20 minutes for a good drain and I use an oversized syringe canister for the 17oz-ish refill into the hose up top (pre-heat the 75w140 for easy flow in hot water in my shop sink…still in the bottle of course). I change my PTU every other oil change (10,000 miles) and I use redline 57914 gear oil in the PTU and rear dif every 30K (75w90 redline 57905) Motorcraft Mercon LV CT-10-QLVC5 in tranny 5 qt swap at 5K and 10K grossing every 30,000 miles there.
175,000+miles…zero issues!

 

[94Eddie]

I’ve been using the “vent pipe mod” since new on my ‘16 sport. It takes about 20 minutes for a good drain and I use an oversized syringe canister for the 17oz-ish refill into the hose up top (pre-heat the 75w140 for easy flow in hot water in my shop sink…still in the bottle of course). I change my PTU every other oil change (10,000 miles) and I use redline 57914 gear oil in the PTU and rear dif every 30K (75w90 redline 57905) Motorcraft Mercon LV CT-10-QLVC5 in tranny 5 qt swap at 5K and 10K grossing every 30,000 miles there.
175,000+miles…zero issues!

I am curious if you have ever had a major drive train repair considering you follow a very aggressive maintenance schedule?

 

[ecoboost_xsport]

I cringe every time I hear people using a syringe to fill the PTU from that vent mod hose without having the side fill plug open. It's a disaster waiting to happen...you likely have just been lucky up to this point unless you have been removing the side fill plug (I saw no mention of it).

If you do have that fill plug off then disregard, but I've seen plenty people not do that. The PTU is a vented case, not designed to see any pressure. When the syringe method is used via the vent hose, you've essentially turned it into a sealed case. There is no place for the air that is being displaced by the oil you're pushing down into the case. In certain instances, this pressure will push past any number of seals that are in the case, to include the one you wouldn't be able to see, the one keeping the PTU gear oil and trans fluid separate. Once you've reached that pressure required to blow past a seal, that's it...you're done, that seal will never...well, seal, anymore.

I get it, filling this case is slow and tedious. As you mentioned, heating it helps, but I would never use that syringe method unless you've given the air some place to go. I've got a bottom drain plug installed in mine which makes draining super easy with no mess.

Then an added fill line, which allows for quicker fills since the real reason filling is so slow is because the oil going down is fighting with the air coming up. Back before I added the second fill line, I used to use the IV bag method (bottom of the bag has a hole punched into it and there is only the required 18oz in it) and just let it sit for a while as I go grab a cold beer and tackle the RDU drain/fill. I also heated the bag in hot water.

As for the second fill line, below is a pic of my concept, I didn't get a pic of the actual setup. This photo is for reference only as I ended up using a smaller stainless fitting instead of that large brass one.

Plenty of space underneath.

Lately, I been thinking about adding this somewhere topside to the second fill line to make it even easier.

Just gotta find a place to mount it up top.

Oh, and good choice of fluids! I use Amsoil products but the Redline/Mercon stuff has a good reputation as well. I use the Amsoil trans fluid with great success. As for the Mercon fluid...there has been some development with the SHO folks switching trans fluid to the newer ULV product and having less shifting-into-3rd issues (which takes the most pressure).

I'm Switching to Mercon ULV blend

I have been testing Mercon ULV in my car. Why? Ever since I hit the 500whp mark and beyond I would experience an issues with the transmission shifting into third. This particular issue seems to effect cars with similar power tuned by other tuners as well. It feels like the car is hitting a...

shoforum.com

I'm not ready to make that transition as it's too soon to tell about any possible 2nd or 3rd order effects, but it's interesting stuff and I'm keeping my eye on it. As for your service intervals, those are great as well. I typically change all my fluids after every race weekend, but that can be excessive to most. For daily driving, you've got a good regimen.

Great job and I'm sure you're using your syringe with the side plug removed, this is just my PSA for those who haven't been. That is all, carry on!

 

[Joek0617]

I cringe every time I hear people using a syringe to fill the PTU from that vent mod hose without having the side fill plug open. It's a disaster waiting to happen...you likely have just been lucky up to this point unless you have been removing the side fill plug (I saw no mention of it).

If you do have that fill plug off then disregard, but I've seen plenty people not do that. The PTU is a vented case, not designed to see any pressure. When the syringe method is used via the vent hose, you've essentially turned it into a sealed case. There is no place for the air that is being displaced by the oil you're pushing down into the case. In certain instances, this pressure will push past any number of seals that are in the case, to include the one you wouldn't be able to see, the one keeping the PTU gear oil and trans fluid separate. Once you've reached that pressure required to blow past a seal, that's it...you're done, that seal will never...well, seal, anymore.

I get it, filling this case is slow and tedious. As you mentioned, heating it helps, but I would never use that syringe method unless you've given the air some place to go. I've got a bottom drain plug installed in mine which makes draining super easy with no mess.

View attachment 423387

Then an added fill line, which allows for quicker fills since the real reason filling is so slow is because the oil going down is fighting with the air coming up. Back before I added the second fill line, I used to use the IV bag method (bottom of the bag has a hole punched into it and there is only the required 18oz in it) and just let it sit for a while as I go grab a cold beer and tackle the RDU drain/fill. I also heated the bag in hot water.

View attachment 423382

As for the second fill line, below is a pic of my concept, I didn't get a pic of the actual setup. This photo is for reference only as I ended up using a smaller stainless fitting instead of that large brass one.

View attachment 423383

Plenty of space underneath.

View attachment 423384

Lately, I been thinking about adding this somewhere topside to the second fill line to make it even easier.

View attachment 423385

View attachment 423386

Just gotta find a place to mount it up top.

Oh, and good choice of fluids! I use Amsoil products but the Redline/Mercon stuff has a good reputation as well. I use the Amsoil trans fluid with great success. As for the Mercon fluid...there has been some development with the SHO folks switching trans fluid to the newer ULV product and having less shifting-into-3rd issues (which takes the most pressure).

I'm Switching to Mercon ULV blend

I have been testing Mercon ULV in my car. Why? Ever since I hit the 500whp mark and beyond I would experience an issues with the transmission shifting into third. This particular issue seems to effect cars with similar power tuned by other tuners as well. It feels like the car is hitting a...

shoforum.com

I'm not ready to make that transition as it's too soon to tell about any possible 2nd or 3rd order effects, but it's interesting stuff and I'm keeping my eye on it. As for your service intervals, those are great as well. I typically change all my fluids after every race weekend, but that can be excessive to most. For daily driving, you've got a good regimen.

Great job and I'm sure you're using your syringe with the side plug removed, this is just my PSA for those who haven't been. That is all, carry on!

if we could get at the side fill plug to fill it... we wouldn't be filling it by the tube...
adding another tube sounds good, but not sure how to do it without dropping out the PTU, and there's a lot of stuff to remove for that. maybe with a flex extension down behind the engine.

 

[ecoboost_xsport]

if we could get at the side fill plug to fill it... we wouldn't be filling it by the tube...
adding another tube sounds good, but not sure how to do it without dropping out the PTU, and there's a lot of stuff to remove for that. maybe with a flex extension down behind the engine.

Yeah, I agree, I had the luxury of doing this modification when I performed some minor upgrades to the PTU and had it off the car and taken apart, so I completely get that it isn't very feasible with it on the car. As for the side plug, it is for sure a pain in the rear to get to, but it can be done. Unfortunately, the newest iteration with the cooler uses the old fill plug as the port for the temperature sensor, so its really that which needs to be removed. I sympathize with the poor design of this component, one of the reasons I did the modifications to it on the bench. It was a pain at first, but each fluid change afterwards, I am super grateful I did it.

 

[texsn95]

But are you really introducing enough additional pressure to sacrifice the integrity of the seals by using the top vent to fill and compress the air inside?
Just assuming total PTU volume ~ 24oz and adding 6oz of fluid, you proportionally increase the pressure by 25%. So instead of 14.7 psi you're at 18.4. I guess there's no way of knowing for sure unless you have the design specs of the PTU.

 

[ecoboost_xsport]

But are you really introducing enough additional pressure to sacrifice the integrity of the seals by using the top vent to fill and compress the air inside?
Just assuming total PTU volume ~ 24oz and adding 6oz of fluid, you proportionally increase the pressure by 25%. So instead of 14.7 psi you're at 18.4. I guess there's no way of knowing for sure unless you have the design specs of the PTU.

Look at the big brain on Brad!!!!

LOL. Well, first, the PTU fluid amount is only 18oz. Second, in order to get the math correct, you'd have to know at what pressure the seals blow at. It likely wouldn't be in any spec because, again, it isn't designed to see any pressure. Not to mention, any manufacturing variances would change between any particular unit that comes off the line.

Basically...why would you even chance it? It's all a moot point, too many variables. Simply don't do it. Period.

But hey, roll the dice if you'd like. There's likely no one in here who beats their car up more than I do, and I wouldn't even take this chance...