Solid Axle Swap??

[SpikeMan]

Hello. I have been thinking about swapping out my Dana 35 TTB front end on my '91 Explorer 4 door with a solid front axle. I need ideas as to wheather it is possible and if it is what axle to go with. I already have a 4" SkyJacker suspension lift in place with 33x12.5" tires. Would a old Bronco axle be good?
Hey Rick, I noticed you are attempting the same thing. Are you going to take LOTS of pictures and post it here??? Do you have any tips? I see this done on Rangers alot but I haven't seen any Explorers done. Will the solid axle hook up to the stock transfer case?
Any help will be great! Thanks. I really would like to see if I can get rid of this STUPID vibration problem that Ford couldn't lick and at the same time get a simple front end. Thanks.

 

[Rick]

I am going with a custom cut Dana 44 from Tri-County Gear. That will give me the exact width I need and the proper alignment of the front diff with the transfer case.

I do plan on posting lots of photos and a good write up to go with the project. Unfortunatly the project has been put on hold as I just layed out over $1000.00 fixing my rear axle after my mishap at Truck Haven.

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Rick Horwitz
Editor
explorer@4x4central.com
Editor
www.4x4central.com

 

[SpikeMan]

Would it be more cost effective for me to have one custom made or go to a junk yard and get a Dana 44 Solid Axle and have it sized correctly? Would my original gears fit in the pumpkin? Should I go with leaf springs or track bars and springs?
Sorry to hear about the rear end. I know that hurts.

 

[TNExplorer]

I Drive a 1993 EB with a solid axle swap, I used an axle from a 77 bronco(dana 44) with steering kunckles from a 78 F-150. The axle measured 59 3/4" the same as the rear. There is alot of things to look at when doing this swap not just the width. Such as the steering the spring mounts on top of the axle, radius arm drop brackets(They will control the amount fo caster that is in the front axle). Bottom line is that it is alot of math, fab work, money and time. Then you will ask if it is worth it and I say yes. I love the way my truck drives and rides both on and offroad.

 

[SpikeMan]

Man, I'm glad to hear somebody has done it! As far as I'm concerned with the Dana 35 it already feels like my buddies solid axle truck. I have been doing research all day today finding every photo I could and I also came to the conclusion to use a 77 Bronco Dana 44 axle. I went to alot of the bronco web sites and read up on it. I know it's a lot to ask but do you think you could shoot some photos and do a how to for the web site? I really am not pleased with the pivot arm brackets. They just look... well... WEAK! I plan on doing some real wheelin' and I'm scared to death of the explorer front end. I love the solid axle setups because they are so simple but effective. I definatley want to stick with coil springs. Much better ride than leafs. If you don't have any photos that's cool. Thanks for letting me know somebody has done it. Does your engine brace get in the way of the pumpkin on the trail? All in all I love the Explorer and I am totally dedicated to making my truck an excellent trail vehicle. I love the looks of people when they look at a jacked up explorer.

 

[TNExplorer]

I am working on a story of the build up and what it takes to do this swap with pictures. I have been in contact with Rick about posting the story on this web site. Keep in mind the swap that I did was done as a prototype there a some changes I am making to the set up that will provide more durability. The only thing that is wrong with using the axle from the early broncos is that axle is a standard cut housing, that puts the yoke below the center line of the axle so your front drive shaft will be at a good angle. I am in the process of cutting down a reverse cut housing from a 1978 F-150 to help with the drive shaft angle. So just give me some time with the story and it may help with some questions I plan on having some pictures of the build up, some of the componets that I built, some pics of the truck in action, and some tecnical info as guide lines.

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Lance

 

[Explorerdude]

Sounds great guys!!

Now did you swap both the front and rear axels?? My buddie said that I should be able swap both the front and rear axles out of an older mid 70's bronco. It sounds like he's right. Dead Link Removed That's great news! Dead Link Removed Maybe when I get another daily driver and a 302 I'll have the money to drop those rears into the old explorer. Dead Link Removed

Happy Wheelin,

Joe Dead Link Removed

 

[SpikeMan]

TNExplorer- Hey I see that you live in Tennesse. I'd be interested in popping by some time in the spring or summer. I live in Hampton Virginia. My brother-in-law and his wife live near Fort Campell. I'd really like to get a hands on look at your truck. I'm tellen ya' the '91-'94 Ford Explorer is going to be the next most modified vehicles since the 66-77 Bronco. These truck are great as raw material.
By the way- do you think the Super Runner Steering System will work with the Dana 44? I don't see why it wouldn't. I'm getting ready to get one and I really don't want to make the investment if it isn't going to work with the 44.

 

[TNExplorer]

First to Explorerdude; I didn't swap the read axle I kept the ford 8.8 and had Moser Engineering Build custom alloy axles to fit the 8.8 housing with the 5 on 5 1/2" bolt pattern so it matches the front 44.
Second to SpikeMan; I know that the Super Runner Steering System will not work with the setup that I have because I used the steering kunckles from a 78 F-150 4x4 and the tierod ends are much bigger than on the super runner swstem. My prototype steering I used the stock steering arms from the 78 F-150. I cut the steering arm that goes from wheel to wheel down and rethreaded the end to mach the stock adjuster sleeve. I then cut the drag link down and rethreaded each end of it and installed a stock adjuster sleeve in it so I could cenetr the steering wheel. I did have to modify the pitman arm to accept the larger tie rod end. This set-up has worked very well I do not have any bump steer and the truck tracks very well. As I stated before This was A prototype I am making new steering arms using 3/4" chrome molly rod ends rated at 28,000 lbs. each I will move the steering arms on top of the steering kunckles and that will provide a better angle for the drag link. NOTE: If you use the steering arms from a 78-79 F-150 the threads are a 1"-18 This is a special thread and the dies are hard to come by you will need one right hand and one left hand the left hand took me a month to get and it is not cheap.

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Lance


[This message has been edited by TNExplorer (edited 12-28-1999).]

 

[SpikeMan]

Sounds excellent! I think you may have a part time job developing!!! Hint! I can't wait to check your truck out! It sounds like it's gonna be a billy goat on the trails!

Spike

 

[RON COX]

I know you guys are talking about a solid axle swap, but in Jan. '98 FOUR WHEELER mag. did a write up on how to build a Ranger. In the article Currie had built a axle using a F-150 TTB. I contacted Currie on this and they did not have any plans to put together a swap kit. Maybe if enough people enquire about this they will change there minds. I'll be watching for the write up on the solid axle swap. Good luck!!

 

[TNExplorer]

Mr. Cox,
The work it takes to put a TTB 44 from a F-150 under a explorer whould not be cost effective for the gains. I will try to explain some of the findings I have come across building and working on Explorers. I hope this post will be of some help to other readers. Please don't think I am trying to sound smarter than others on this site this is just my opinion. First I looked at the possibilities of improving the durability of the dana 35 TTB. I found some design problems with the 35 (and also with the 44 TTB). First was the design of the rotors and spindles, although the 35 uses large wheel bearings, very capable of supporting the weight of the truck with larger wheels and tires, the bearings are placed very close together in the rotor. I felt that this provided less than adequate lateral support for large tires when turning (I also feel this is the major source of thr notorious 65 MPH shakes). The second problem I found with the 35 TTB (and 44 TTB) was the compound arc that the wheels travel when the suspension is cycled. The caster arc which is controlled by the radius arms is very short, this can be improved by installing longer radius arms. The real problem is with the camber arc. This is controlled by the lenght of the two axle housings (Same with 44 TTB cut to fit Explorer unless you want wide axles). They are very short in Explorers and Rangers so the wheel do not stick out from under the truck. When the suspension is cycled the camber changes a geart deal, the top of the tire moves in and the bottom of the tire moves out when the body of the truck moves down (bounce on front bumper and watch tires). As this is happening the radius arms are moving the center of the tire towards the back of the truck. I felt that this compound movement places a great deal of pressure on the wheel trying to force the wheel bearings, spindel nuts and locking hubs to the outside. All of this force is compounded when the wheels are turned. These are the reasons I swapped in a Dana 44 solid axle. I Hope this info helps understand why wheelbearings don't last long and front tires wear fast.

 

[SpikeMan]

I'm going to have to totallt agree with you on the 35 and 44 TNexplorer! I had started to think the same thing about a year ago when I compared the bearings with my dad's 78 full size pickup 4x4. Once he decides to trash his truck I'm going to swipe the front axle. I think he's getting rid of it next year. Have fun!

 

[RON COX]

Lance, sounds like you have done a lot of homework. Looking foreward to more data. Did'nt Ford also put a 9" in the front of late model Broncos? Have you looked at the feasibility? Just wondering. I have 145k on my '91 xlt with a Superlift 5-1/2" lift, super runner steering, extended radius arms and 32x 11.5's and I have only gone through one hub and bearing assembly. Although I destroyed 2 sets of auto hubs. Guess I just got lucky, seems like quite a few people burn out bearings quickly. Anyways, hope to read your write up soon.

 

[TNExplorer]

The Ford 9" was used in the rear of F-150's and Broncos until 1984 then they switched to the 8.8 I may be wrong but I don't think that the 9" was ever used in the front of any truck or bronco. Now Currie has modified ford 9" axles to be used in the front of just about any thing you wish to put them in. Beware the 9" axle has a very low pinion placement and may be a problem when used in the front with short front drive shafts (short wheel base). I think the best axles for the front is the reverse cut Dana 44 and Dana 60, both of them have the pinion very high which helps with drive shaft angle and keeps it out of harms way this also goes for the rear. Dynatrac Products can build either one of these axles for the front or rear.

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Lance

 

[Rick]

The trouble with Dynatrac is that they are incredibly expensive. I had a custom cut reverse pinion Dana 44 shipped out with gears and a standard carrier for 1025.00. Dynatrac wanted nearly three times that.

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Rick Horwitz
Editor
explorer@4x4central.com
Editor
www.4x4central.com

 

[rpenner54]

Rick does that price include, the locker, hubs, and all brake parts attatched? Also is there some place you could post the number or website for the company you bought it from. I would like to start thinking about doing this same mod here someday. I am sure others would find it helpfull also.



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Ryan Penner
1992 Explorer Sport

 

[Extreme4x4]

A couple of questions TN: Have you had to limit the up travel of the axle to avoid having the pumpkin contact the engine crossmember? Or have you modified the engine crossmember in any way? The reason I ask is me and my X were doing a Ranger with a solid front. This was being built as an extreme travel suspension, and this posed a real problem. Most solid axle vehicles do not have a big crossmember running under the engine, thus they do not have this problem.

Also, just for ***** and giggles, even with the extreme travel that I run on my TTB (19"), I do not have excessive front tire wear. Nor do I really have much of a wheel bearing problem. I change them once a year whether they need it or not. I do run them tight, which has helped on the wear. When the truck was basically stock..... was doing the same, so all the mods have not affected this.

Anyway, just food for thought. Sounds like you are putting as much time in this front swap as me and my X put in our front suspension mods. Good luck in your venture.

Gloria
93 EB Explorer (heavily modified)
94 F150 Lightning

 

[TNExplorer]

To Extreme4X4,
I have not had any trouble with the cross member and axle contact. I did do some mild modifications to the cross member befroe I put the axle under the truck. My problem was with the track bar that locates the front axle. It ran close to the front part of the cross member that turns down towards the ground. I work in a welding shop/machine shop so I cut the front edge of the cross member off and fabbed some bracing under the crossmember. I whould also like to thank you for the inspriation, when people found out that I was cutting apart a Explorer I directed them to your truck on this site so I whould not be viewed as the only crazy person around. I am very impressed with your truck and you should be very proud. I spoke with you some time ago about the trans mods on your truck, Thanks. One other thing I live in middle Tennessee and the wheeling around here does not require the type of setup that you have on your truck we do not have any desert or dry rocks all of ours consist of mud and mud and mud and trees. It was cheeper for me to get the durability I needed by doing the solid swap than to do the modifications to the Dana 35 because I had all the parts except the 77 Bronco Dana 44 housing ($75).
You have a great truck Happy Wheeling.

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Lance


[This message has been edited by TNExplorer (edited 01-09-2000).]

 

[Rick]

Ryan, my axle came with 4:56 gears and an open diff. I need to come up with an ARB myself. I can get one for less than they wanted to sell me one for. I'm also supplying the knuckles, spindles, hubs and brakes.

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Rick Horwitz
Editor
explorer@4x4central.com
Editor
www.4x4central.com