Transmission...fluids....again...

[Fischer]

Opera House,

I feel this is a good filter. He told me that it is the same one that Ford would sell me for $30+. This is the more expensive one out fo the two on that site for my trans. I think it will be fine. I also got 2 pan gaskets, I am new at this and if I tear one then I have another.

Also I have been considering doing the trans flush like dog friend said. Though I am now under the impression that that is a risk. If the tranny fluid is not that bad then just drop the pan and clean it then add the 4 or so Qts. and just keep up on it. You should not need to do that flush if you don't have a VERY dirty transmission.

I feel that the pan drop is enough for me as I beleive it was flushed 20K ago, I also have an external filter Mobil1 filter. So I think I'll be fine with just the pan drop.

Thanks for all the help

 

[Opera House]

It took me a long time before.....

I did a tranny flush by the pump out method. It made me pretty uncomfortable. I thind the best method is to add two extra quarts. It can take that easily if you are just at idle, might even serve to clean the upper case. Then pump out three quarts and refill. This should keep the tranny pump from running dry.

I'm taking apart an old A4LD and it is remarkable the condition of the clutches. If it wasn't for the hard parts that break, these transmissions could go on forever.

 

[james t]

Originally posted by Fischer
I also got 2 pan gaskets, I am new at this and if I tear one then I have another.

all you have to do is smear grease around the pan, and "stick" the gasket to it. this will ensure a good seal, and will keep the gasket aligned when re-installing the pan.

 

[410Fortune]

You dont need to go to the expensive dealer for the flush or for the filter, you are throwing $$$ away if you do.

Grease Monkey can backflush your trans for $80, the same process as the dealer, just cost less.

Dropping the tranny pan is not messy if you are prepared for it. I went to wal mart and bought a huge under the bed flat tupperware/rubbermade container. It's like 36" x 48" x8" or something like that. I then lined it with a large trash bag, and dropped the pan right down into it. Not a single drop of ATF on the garage floor. PIck up the bag, hold it over your drain pan, and cut a small hole. All the ATF went right into the drain pan, then into the proper containers for disposal. Didnt spill a drop.

Putting the filter in and the pan gasket on is a snap. Just torque the bolts in the proper sequence and you are done.

I think it cost me about $80 total to do the job with synth. If you look around you can find synth ATF in gallon jugs insteadof messing withthe 12 quart containers that are like $9 ea.....

 

[socky3850]

Just to add fuel to the fire, I just had my 5r55e rebuilt and I asked the trans shop what in their opinion would be the best way to maintain the trans. Would they flush the trans or would they would drop the pan, drain the fluid, and replace the filter? They said that they would advise against flushing the trans for various reasons. Even Ford dealers cannot come to a consensus on this issue. Earnhardt Ford in Tempe, AZ, only flushes the trans. (they did mine twice) Pioneer Ford in Phoenix drops the pan, drains the fluid, and replaces the filter. I think that in the future I will just change the filter and replace the fluid that is lost. Flushing cetainly didn't help the longevity of my trans.

 

[410Fortune]

this has gone around and around a hundred times here. The basic idea is that if you start with a new tranny and flush it every few years, you will be okay. However if you never change your fluids or if you flush a high mileage tranny for the first time you can actually do damage to it because you disloge the gunk and it gets trapped in the passages in the valve body which leads to failure.

I am with you however, I will change my ATF and filter every year and thats good enough for me. I expect to get 200K miles from my A4LD, and my tranny guy stands behind that.

I will empty the cooler, external filter, and lines every time I drop the pan as well.

 

[Bzz]

whoa...this is getting confusing..=)..

..great tips coming in though...but I'm back to square one as to whether to flush or not..


..I guess it comes down to whether I want to do it myself or not..=)..if I do it myself..I'll just drop the pan..and make it a routine to do it every year. Otherwise I'll just bring it in to some place like jiffy lube to do it..=)..

...I called the dealer for a flush price just to get a ball park on how much it would cost to get someone else to do it.

 

[dogfriend]

Originally posted by Fischer


Also I have been considering doing the trans flush like dog friend said. Though I am now under the impression that that is a risk. If the tranny fluid is not that bad then just drop the pan and clean it then add the 4 or so Qts. and just keep up on it. You should not need to do that flush if you don't have a VERY dirty transmission.

I feel that the pan drop is enough for me as I beleive it was flushed 20K ago, I also have an external filter Mobil1 filter. So I think I'll be fine with just the pan drop.

Thanks for all the help

I'm not saying that you must do this, I was just answering the question that Bzz asked which was: how can I get all of the old fluid out?

Reflecting back on doing this, I think the biggest danger would be if you pumped out too much fluid so that you were sucking air out of the pan instead of ATF. This shouldn't happen as long as you are careful about watching to make sure that you only pump out one quart at a time. You have approx 4 qts in the pan, you could probably be 3 qts low before you would be in danger of sucking air. I used clear one gallon containers to monitor the amount pumped out. I eyeballed the level in the containers; 1/4 of the container = one quart. If you are ****, you could mark the container.

Opera House suggested adding an additional qt (overfill). I think this is a good suggestion in retrospect because I was about one qt low after replacing the cooler lines and letting the trans warm up to get an accurate reading on the dipstick. I didn't want to overfill; the additional qt was due to the fluid needed for the cooler and cooler lines.

The other part to keep in mind is that you are running the trans in park, so you aren't putting any load on it; just let it idle to pump the fluid out. I would estimate that it took between 1 min to 1 1/2 min per quart but I didn't time it or anything like that. You really aren't flushing it like they do with the machine, just pumping out the older fluid and replacing with new. I'm sure that you are getting some mixing of old and new fluid as well, but you are getting the majority of the old fluid out.

 

[Robert]

410Fortune - The one thing you need to realize is that your 4.0L pan and BII are completely different than Bzz's 4.0L SOHC. He has a catalytic converter that runs right about 3" directly below the pan. If his is 4x4, then he also has the differential on one side while the second catalytic converter is on the other side. It isn't nearly as simple to change the pan filter as yours is. Regardless of how you try and drop the pan, you will get fluid all over things that you don't want fluid on. My second time doing mine, I completely covered the bottom cat with aluminum foil so that I didn't have to smell burning transmission fluid for the next two weeks. I also dropped my front driveshaft to gain the necessary clearance to slide the pan out towards the center once I got as much fluid out as I could. There is no way I would go through this every year. I'll stick to every 30K (about every 2 years).

I also did the same method as Dogfriend. I drained one quart at a time through my transmission cooler, shut off my engine and added a new quart. I did this until the fluid coming out was as clean as the fluid going in. It took me about 30 minutes using this method and was much cleaner and easier than doing the pan and filter (which I did at the same time). The fluid comes out slow enough that you aren't in any danger running the transmission dry unless you aren't paying attention. It pumped a quart out about every 4 or 5 seconds. I just had my Wife start it up and shut it off when I told her to.

 

[Gator]

Transmission fluid change

Could someone please clarify for me whether it is permissable to mix non-synthetic trans fluid with new synthetic fluid. My '97 SOHC 4wd Explorer needs to have the fluid changed and I would like to go with synthetic. From the forum I have learned that there is not a drain plug on the torque converter on this model so I thought that I would drop the pan and change the filter and then after replacing the pan, pump fluid out of the cooler line and replace at the same rate through the filler tube. Will this exchange all of the fluid? If there is some fluid left will it mix safely with the new synthetic fluid? Will this method work if I remove only the upper
( from trans to cooler) line or do I need to take off the lower (cooler to trans) line as well, (or visa versa). Is it safe to run the trans in park at idle to pump the fluid out when the pan is empty from having just been reinstalled?

Thank you to all. I appreciate your knowledge and experience.

 

[dogfriend]

I copied this from the AMSOil website:

"AMSOIL Synthetics Automatic Transmission Fluid is completely compatible with other synthetic and petroleum automatic transmission fluids. AMSOIL ATF is a universal, multifunctional fluid and greatly reduces the need for specialized fluid inventories and the possibilities of misapplication."

From the Mobil website:

"Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF is a synthetic transmission which
meets Dexron® III and Mercon®.
The product is manufactured from synthesized hydrocarbon
base oils and a specially balanced additive system. The
synthetic fluid is fully compatible with petroleum ATF
products."

So there should be no problem with mixing with standard ATF.


I did the one quart at a time exchange, but if you aren't comfortable doing it, then I would go to a shop with the machine to flush out the old fluid. Syn ATF will mix ok with dino ATF, but you won't get the full benefit of syn ATF if you mix.

 

[dogfriend]

Re: Transmission fluid change

Originally posted by Gator
Will this method work if I remove only the upper
( from trans to cooler) line or do I need to take off the lower (cooler to trans) line as well, (or visa versa). Is it safe to run the trans in park at idle to pump the fluid out when the pan is empty from having just been reinstalled?

I tried to remove just the top line on the radiator cooler (this is from trans to cooler on mine) and leave the other in place. Unfortuneatly, fluid came from BOTH lines for about the first two quarts, so I would recommend putting both lines into containers.

Also, I filled the pan with 4 qts of new fluid before starting the engine to pump the first quart out. I would NOT recommend starting the engine with a dry pan.

 

[Gator]

Thanks for the response DogFriend.

I was not sure that Amsoil or Mobil would mix with the non synthetic, but it looks as though it will so I'll drop the pan and replace the filter and then replace the pan and put new fluid into it before pumping the rest of the fluid out through the cooler lines.

This method will probably require a little more fluid but will ensure that I get the most out of the system that is possible. It would be nice if Ford had engineered a drain on the torque converter as they did with my other explorer that has the 4R70W trans.

Thanks again. Now its under the vehicle to see if I can get the pan off with the frame members and crossbracing in the way.

Gator

 

[Robert]

Gator - remember that when you pump your old fluid out of your cooler lines, only do it a quart at a time before pooring a new quart in the fill hole. You do not want to try pumping all of the fluid out before adding more fluid. A transmission does not like to be ran empty. It will probably take about 3-5 seconds to pump a quart out. Pump it into a bucket with lines for each quart. Have someone sit in the driver's seat and start it when you tell them to and stop it when you tell them to. Do this every quart. It should only take about 1/2 hour and is very easy. This is how I replaced all the fluid in mine. Also, you might find it easier to use the rubber hoses going to the bottom of your auxillary transmission cooler if you have one installed. It isthe little radiator looking item in front of your radiator on the passenger side. Disconnect the hose going from the cooler to the transmission and put an extra piece on the outlet of the cooler. Plug up the hose going to the transmission and let the other hose empty into the bucket..

 

[rgiles]

Mobile 1 and Valvoline Durablend claim on the bottle that it will mix with standard ATF. I put both in my Toyota without any problem and I didn't do a complete flush.

To those that say to use Mobile 1 for a tranny requiring Mercon V, the bottle does not claim compatability with Mercon V, just Mercon. I tried to ask Mobile 1 about this on their website, but no answer. Might require a call. The way I see it if it were Mecon V compliant, why wouldn't they list it?

Anyone using the Valvoline Durablend? It is a synthetic blend and claims Mercon V compliance.

 

[dogfriend]

Originally posted by rgiles
Mobile 1 and Valvoline Durablend claim on the bottle that it will mix with standard ATF. I put both in my Toyota without any problem and I didn't do a complete flush.

To those that say to use Mobile 1 for a tranny requiring Mercon V, the bottle does not claim compatability with Mercon V, just Mercon. I tried to ask Mobile 1 about this on their website, but no answer. Might require a call. The way I see it if it were Mecon V compliant, why wouldn't they list it?

Anyone using the Valvoline Durablend? It is a synthetic blend and claims Mercon V compliance.

I don't want to start an ATF war, but on the Mobil 1 site that I quoted above it says specifically that Mobil 1 ATF is NOT a substitute for Mercon V applications.

"It is not a substitute for Chrysler Type 7176 ATF, Chrysler Type 9602 ATF or Mercon® V"

http://216.239.51.100/search?q=cach...f/mobil1synatf.pdf+Mobil+1+ATF&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

 

[rgiles]

Originally posted by dogfriend
I don't want to start an ATF war, but on the Mobil 1 site that I quoted above it says specifically that Mobil 1 ATF is NOT a substitute for Mercon V applications.

"It is not a substitute for Chrysler Type 7176 ATF, Chrysler Type 9602 ATF or Mercon® V"

Thanks for pointing that out since it appears people were suggesting using Mobile 1 ATF in Mercon V applications. Somehow I missed this on their website, but I wasn't going to use it unless M1 specified it met the Mercon V standard.

 

[aldive]

I have used Mobil 1 ATF for over 50k miles ( with changes at 25k ) in my 99 with no worries at all.

 

[rgiles]

Originally posted by aldive
I have used Mobil 1 ATF for over 50k miles ( with changes at 25k ) in my 99 with no worries at all.

When did you switch over and was it during the warantee period? I probably can't do that on my '02 Explorer as the warantee could potentially be voided. I have a 7 year 75,000 mile warantee. What transmission is in the 99's? Any other fully synthetic ATF's that meet the Mercon V requirement that you know of?

Thanks

 

[aldive]

Amsoil ATF is Mercon V compatable. I plan to switch over to Ansoil at my next flush.