Water pump failure leads to dead engine

[TwinExes]

Man, I wish all I had to worry about in life was if my water pump was going to go. Four 3.5’s in the family. Two around 100k, no problems. 80+ PIU’s I’m responsible for, half around 60k, no problems. Best friend is a service advisor for a large Ford dealership, very rare occurrence. Nothing to see here.

 

[Sixonemale]

Man, I wish all I had to worry about in life was if my water pump was going to go. Four 3.5’s in the family. Two around 100k, no problems. 80+ PIU’s I’m responsible for, half around 60k, no problems. Best friend is a service advisor for a large Ford dealership, very rare occurrence. Nothing to see here.

Unfortunately several owners in this thread were caught by surprise with little or no warning that there water pump failed causing catastrophic damage to the engine and leaving some stranded.

I look forward to you checking back in when your four 3.5's have 150,000 miles, if you keep them that long and also would like to hear about the statistics of your 80+ PUI's that you are responsible for, if they are still your responsibility in higher mileage.

Conversely to your best friend, my service advisor as well as another service advisor mentioned in this thread are seeing more and more failed water pumps just from one year ago.

In summary, this thread is much more about an engine seizing with very little or no warning caused by a failed water pump than the water pump itself.

 

[2011MKX_owner]

My 2011 Lincoln MKX with the same engine just had a sudden engine failure last month due to the water pump suddenly leaking and mixing coolant with oil. $7,000 engine replacement on a vehicle with only 73,000 miles. No, this needs to be class action!!! I think Ford and Lincoln are keeping this hush-hush. Designing an engine with a water pump failure causing the need for engine replacement????
My '99 Mercury Mountaineer with over 160,000 miles that I traded in for this vehicle never had this kind of expensive repair!!! That was a great vehicle... wish I'd never gotten rid of it for this ritzy looking piece of junk. Never ever another Ford product, be it Ford or Lincoln.

 

[blwnsmoke]

My 2011 Lincoln MKX with the same engine just had a sudden engine failure last month due to the water pump suddenly leaking and mixing coolant with oil. $7,000 engine replacement on a vehicle with only 73,000 miles. No, this needs to be class action!!! I think Ford and Lincoln are keeping this hush-hush. Designing an engine with a water pump failure causing the need for engine replacement????
My '99 Mercury Mountaineer with over 160,000 miles that I traded in for this vehicle never had this kind of expensive repair!!! That was a great vehicle... wish I'd never gotten rid of it for this ritzy looking piece of junk. Never ever another Ford product, be it Ford or Lincoln.

Feel free to hire an attorney and go after Ford.

 

[peterk9]

My 2011 Lincoln MKX with the same engine just had a sudden engine failure last month due to the water pump suddenly leaking and mixing coolant with oil. $7,000 engine replacement on a vehicle with only 73,000 miles. No, this needs to be class action!!! I think Ford and Lincoln are keeping this hush-hush. Designing an engine with a water pump failure causing the need for engine replacement????
My '99 Mercury Mountaineer with over 160,000 miles that I traded in for this vehicle never had this kind of expensive repair!!! That was a great vehicle... wish I'd never gotten rid of it for this ritzy looking piece of junk. Never ever another Ford product, be it Ford or Lincoln.

Welcome to the Forum.
Despite the length of this thread, the issue is not a common one. See this post; http://www.explorerforum.com/xenfor...ads-to-dead-engine.424482/reply&quote=3647956
The explanation for the design has been mentioned a few times in this thread. A new engine can be had for a little more than $3000. http://www.explorerforum.com/xenfor...ds-to-dead-engine.424482/page-15#post-3647204
Good luck.

Peter

 

[Sixonemale]

Despite the length of this thread, the issue is not a common one. See this post; http://www.explorerforum.com/xenfor...ads-to-dead-engine.424482/reply&quote=3647956

Peter

With all due respect no one has any idea how common or uncommon this issue is with such a young generation of Explorer. I know this engine has been around for a lot of years, but we will know much more about the frequency of this issue from owners that are used to driving previous generation Explorers into high mileage with average maintenance cost.

How an engine be designed with an internal $40 part that can cause up to $7,000 in damages due to seized engine is still beyond rational belief IMO and yes I do think Ford should on the hook for all costs associated with ruined engines caused by a failed water pump up to 150,000 miles.

Also, in the survey at the top of this thread where did 95k miles come from, out of thin air?

 

[blwnsmoke]

With all due respect no one has any idea how common or uncommon this issue is with such a young generation of Explorer. I know this engine has been around for a lot of years, but we will know much more about the frequency of this issue from owners that are used to driving previous generation Explorers into high mileage with average maintenance cost.

How an engine be designed with an internal $40 part that can cause up to $7,000 in damages due to seized engine is still beyond rational belief IMO and yes I do think Ford should on the hook for all costs associated with ruined engines caused by a failed water pump up to 150,000 miles.

Also, in the survey at the top of this thread where did 95k miles come from, out of thin air?

With all due respect right back, you continue to spew the same stuff and can't back it up with facts. You can't say this is a major issue without proving it is. The burden of proof is on you to prove it. You are ABSOLUTELY correct, Ford should be covering these repairs. But you really seem in all your posts on this to insinuate that this happens a lot. And as previously stated, this motor is 10-11 years old. How long do we need to wait to for us to see this happens a lot? How many of the millions of motors out there does it take to say this is a major issue (ie happens a lot)?

It does happen, it shouldn't happen and Ford should pay if it does. But you come off like the Ex is POS and should run away. Frankly I honestly don't know why you own one with all the negativity you post on here.

PS - no clue on the survey.

 

[Sixonemale]

With all due respect right back, you continue to spew the same stuff and can't back it up with facts. You can't say this is a major issue without proving it is. The burden of proof is on you to prove it. You are ABSOLUTELY correct, Ford should be covering these repairs. But you really seem in all your posts on this to insinuate that this happens a lot. And as previously stated, this motor is 10-11 years old. How long do we need to wait to for us to see this happens a lot? How many of the millions of motors out there does it take to say this is a major issue (ie happens a lot)?

It does happen, it shouldn't happen and Ford should pay if it does. But you come off like the Ex is POS and should run away. Frankly I honestly don't know why you own one with all the negativity you post on here.

PS - no clue on the survey.

IMO the water pump design is a potential fatal flaw on this generation of Explorer and you are correct I'm not sure how much longer I'll own it because at some point and time the water pump will fail and only if I'm lucky I'll have to replace it, if I'm unlucky I'll have to replace the entire engine. No, I can't back it up with perfect facts yet, but I've asked Ford in this forum what is the frequency of water pump repairs and engine failures and with it being the "information age" it should have been a simple request, but it was not.

If I recall correctly you have around 110k miles on your Explorer and recently extended your warranty. If you are so confident this is a one in one hundred event, why extend your warranty?

I've owned a first and third generation Explorer and owned both of them into high mileage. IMO not many Explorers of this generation will see high mileage unless very costly repairs are done or the engine is replaced.

As I have said several times many Explorer owners are used to driving their Explorers into high mileage with average repair costs, so yes, I do think Explorer owners will be much more vocal about this issue than other models of Fords and Lincolns that have this engine. Similar to the exhaust issue time will tell all.

At the end the of the day very few owners of Explorers actually post in a forum of like this vs the total number of Explorers sold.

I'm still curious as to who put the survey at the top of the thread.

 

[blwnsmoke]

I extended the warranty because I do not want to deal with any repairs at the moment. I never keep my vehicles putnof warranty period. I have 3 more years of a $1,000/mo. truck payment and do not want any surprises. If I was banking the $1,000 a month, then sure, no problem.

I have 117k now, was just in the shop for a upper right strut mount that is going.

I assure you more people whonhave problems join forums then don't. I am heavily involves in 4 forums and you see many first time posters join because of issues that they are experiencing and googled.

You are ABSOLUTELY right and I did post that I was worried about 3 things (EPAS failure again, ptu which is original with original oil and the water pump). I got the ESP extended for 50% of dealer cost so it was a No Brainer to do.

 

[Forddealz]

I extended the warranty because I do not want to deal with any repairs at the moment. I never keep my vehicles putnof warranty period. I have 3 more years of a $1,000/mo. truck payment and do not want any surprises. If I was banking the $1,000 a month, then sure, no problem.

I have 117k now, was just in the shop for a upper right strut mount that is going.

I assure you more people whonhave problems join forums then don't. I am heavily involves in 4 forums and you see many first time posters join because of issues that they are experiencing and googled.

You are ABSOLUTELY right and I did post that I was worried about 3 things (EPAS failure again, ptu which is original with original oil and the water pump). I got the ESP extended for 50% of dealer cost so it was a No Brainer to do.

Over 100,000 or more XP sold year after year and probably probably hundred or so people have this water pump failure. If it would be something that happens on regular basis then Ford would probably do something about it. It could be just a bad apple.

 

[Irishfred]

Many thanks to the people in this forum. Between the PTU and the water pump issue, I have decided to sell this Explorer and purchase a Toyota Highlander or Lexus GX/LX.

I work too hard for my money, and I do not lease. I buy a car and keep it for the long term.

After reading your posts, and seeing pictures of the PTU and water pump design, and the labor to repair these items, I get the gut feeling that the manufacturer does not care about longevity of it's product. I don't lease, so I have no other choice but to cut bait.

I am so thankful that forums like this exist, and that you all post your relevant problems with your cars. You are an invaluable resource for us out there to make an informed decision. I was pressing my parents to purchase a Ford Edge - but have since changed on that course as well. We will give Toyota a try (the high mileage Toyotas for sale on the used market, and their retained value is nuts!)

Thanks again to all of you. Best of luck to all of you. Cheers!

 

[RandyH2]

Here is a good way for folks to get their data into the public: https://www.truedelta.com/

And here is the data for the '11-'15 Explorer. A very limited data set, but it's not good: https://www.truedelta.com/Ford-Explorer/problem-histories-85,2011-2015

 

[awd_sr]

This forum has been so helpful to me and the family through the ownership of our 2008 Explorer Sport Trac, which we traded in for a 2011 Explorer... at a little under 126K miles this weekend, we experienced the "failed water pump with no warning leading to failed engine" fiasco... We've also had to replace the PTU, I just dropped close to $1K on the A/C this summer, now waiting on the dealership to get me the estimate.

It doesn't look like this is a problem that Ford has assisted owners with, but I will read through all of the posts with my fingers crossed, with rabbit's foot in hand.

 

[peterk9]

......It doesn't look like this is a problem that Ford has assisted owners with, but I will read through all of the posts with my fingers crossed, with rabbit's foot in hand.

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for any help on this one Tony.

Peter

 

[awd_sr]

yeah Peter, I've been through a few of the pages on this post and it looks like I will have to add "new Engine" to my list for Santa...

 

[peterk9]

yeah Peter, I've been through a few of the pages on this post and it looks like I will have to add "new Engine" to my list for Santa...

Well that should take of having to change plugs for a while and worrying about timing chain going. Not a pleasant way to start off the upcoming holiday season. Hope all turns out for the best. I really liked my 2011 Limited.

 

[thefranchise713]

This forum has been so helpful to me and the family through the ownership of our 2008 Explorer Sport Trac, which we traded in for a 2011 Explorer... at a little under 126K miles this weekend, we experienced the "failed water pump with no warning leading to failed engine" fiasco... We've also had to replace the PTU, I just dropped close to $1K on the A/C this summer, now waiting on the dealership to get me the estimate.

It doesn't look like this is a problem that Ford has assisted owners with, but I will read through all of the posts with my fingers crossed, with rabbit's foot in hand.

I would call the Customer Relationship Center and ask for assistance. Explain that you're dealing with an endemic issue on this platform, enjoy your vehicle but given the high failure rate would like Ford to consider assisting in at least a partial way. You might get lucky. My regional customer service manager was the most useless arm of Ford I could ever encounter--which I blame Ford for, not her--but you might have better luck.

Either way, the more people that complain about this issue, the more that they'll have data to support a "customer satisfaction program."

I will not say why, but I do not think the issue is as cut and dry to Ford as people think. Don't think I haven't called them out on it--even while avoiding this engine myself.

 

[blwnsmoke]

^^^ with 127,000 miles on the odometer, I don't see Ford giving any assistance on this.

 

[thefranchise713]

Probably not.

But it doesn't hurt to ask and add the data point. A water pump is expected to fail but it shouldn't be causing cascading failures that take out a whole engine, and even if it didn't, take 12 hours of labor to replace. Some foolishly misguided engineer, further victimized by the penny pinchers, decided a lifetime pump with a crappy impeller was a good idea. Nobody needs to take that idiocy in silence.

 

[Sixonemale]

Probably not.

But it doesn't hurt to ask and add the data point. A water pump is expected to fail but it shouldn't be causing cascading failures that take out a whole engine, and even if it didn't, take 12 hours of labor to replace. Some foolishly misguided engineer, further victimized by the penny pinchers, decided a lifetime pump with a crappy impeller was a good idea. Nobody needs to take that idiocy in silence.

Ford should absolutely be on the hook for a seized engine due to an internal water pump failure whether it happens at 50,000 miles or 140,000 miles, etc. The only requirements in the maintenance manual are periodic inspections and replacing the coolant at 100,000 miles. Had awd_sr known that his engine was going to seize due to a failed water pump do you really think he would have kept it vs selling it or trading it in? When external water pumps begin to fail or are failing you sometimes hear noises, see coolant on the ground and/or the temperature gauge goes up and that is more than likely coupled with a check engine light coming on, nothing like what happened in awd_sr's case, no warning whatsoever. Now unfortunately he has to make a major decision as to whether throw money at an older vehicle or to take a loss and move on to buy another vehicle, not to mention the inconvenience of not having a car and maybe having to rent one.

With technology today, almost any vehicle made should run to 100,000 miles trouble fee with only normal maintenance being done. This is a poor design that Ford should take ownership of. Let's hope a third letter is sent out soon.