Need input/advice whether I should attempt Timing Chain Replacement

[SideTrackTap]

A little problem...

Working on a reinstall and here is where I am. I have the new left camshaft timing chain, sprockets, and guides in (the left cam sprocket loosely installed). The new main chain, sprockets, and guide only installed (the new jackshaft bolt is only snugged in right now) and the crank sprocket is in correctly with the recessed portion facing the radiator for the balancer.

My problem right now is the right hand camshaft. In the picture below, you can see due to the A/C lines there is absolutely no room to put a socket or even the socket and extension from the timing kit on the bolt for the right cam, should I need to loosen it. It was a battle just to get the holding tool and I had to loosen the main wiring harness on the back of the block to get that on.

Everything is very close to being in time right now, crankshaft and the right and left camshafts. My question is, can I use the tools to lock down the position of the right camshaft in time now, hoping that I don't have to loosen and adjust that cam during the timing process? I understand once everything is tightened up underneath the timing cover, the only adjustments are the positions of the cams, and even if the right cam is in the correct position, if I have to move the crankshaft, that won't matter anymore because it too will move.

I really don't see a way to have access to the right hand camshaft bolt without disturbing or removing at least one of the A/C condenser lines.

Any ideas or input?

Thanks,

Chris

 

[2000StreetRod]

shop manual procedure

My 2002 Explorer shop manual procedure for loosening the right camshaft sprocket retaining bolt only requires removal of: valve covers; fuel supply manifold; serpentine belt; thermostat housing; and camshaft roller followers. There is no mention of A/C lines. Are you trying to use the special tools for the right camshaft in the timing tool kit that fits between the bolt head and the firewall?

Use items 1 and 2 in the above photo.

 

[SideTrackTap]

Use items 1 and 2 in the above photo.

Yup, those are the tools.

Ok, so I just tried it again. I had to put item 1, inside the camshaft holding tool and adapter (items 4 and 7), and then put it on as one assembly. I have it on now, along with item 2, so it is possible. I ended up removing some of the wire loom material around the A/C line to give me a little more room, but it's still very tight in there.

I'll continue on with the process and hopefully have the front cover at least buttoned up by the end of the day.

Thanks for the help StreetRod,

Chris

 

[SideTrackTap]

Front Cover is on, but...

I broke a bolt; one of the bottom cover bolts that goes through the engine cradle into the cover itself.

The bolts themselves seemed to keep going for a while, but I was using my torque wrench set to 168 In/Lbs (supposed to be 14 Ft/Lbs, but my Ft/Lb wrench is too big). I don't know if it was just a weak bolt, or the torque wrench doesn't like working upside down. I did get one to proper torque according to the wrench. The others I was too scared to tighten anymore after that.

I know the proper procedure is to remove the cover and extract the remnants of the old bolt and start over. I'm curious though if I could run with it they way it is? The bolt that broke is the driver side outside bolt.

Of course I'll have to find a replacement bolt. I'm not sure if I could find something without going to the dealer.

Chris

 

[2000StreetRod]

I hate breaking bolts

I looked at the procedure and those vertical bolts are only torqued to 80 lb-in (6.7 lb-ft). Only the front bolts are torqued to 14 lb-ft.
The sealant in the designated places between the block cradle and the front cover will probably be too far from the broken bolt to help. However, the pressure from the bolt next to it may prevent leakage. If it doesn't leak you may never fix it. If it does leak, it may be more difficult to fix later than now. It's all up to you.

 

[SideTrackTap]

May as well do it right...

I looked at the procedure and those vertical bolts are only torqued to 80 lb-in (6.7 lb-ft). Only the front bolts are torqued to 14 lb-ft.

Crap, I wish I would've seen that before. Something didn't seem right because they just kept turning.

However, the instructions that came with the new kit says, after raising the vehicle, install the lower bolts to 14 lb-ft. I actually found that they were easier to tighten from the engine compartment with the truck lowered though. I'm not sure if in that position it would affect the reading on the torque wrench, but I wouldn't think it would. Before I lowered the truck, I did try one from underneath, but I needed a long extension and swivel (universal) adapter in order to use the torque wrench, and all those extensions may have affected the actual torque anyway.

Anyway, unfortunately I know the right answer is to remove the cover and remove the broken bolt and start over. It's not that big of deal to do it correctly. Do you think I can reuse the timing cover gasket? I think it should be ok. I think the oil pan cover bolts are the same as the lower timing cover bolts. If so, I think I'll steal one from the oil pan for now until I can get a replacement.

Out of curiosity, since I think the lower oil pan bolts are similar to the lower timing cover bolts, I checked the torque specs for the lower oil pan bolts and they are spec'd at 80 lb-in like you had found for the lower cover bolts.

Thanks again for your help StreetRod,

Chris

 

[2000StreetRod]

torque specs

I checked my post SOHC V6 Torque Specifications and it states that for block cradle Perimeter bolts/nuts: 80 lb-in.

 

[SideTrackTap]

I checked my post SOHC V6 Torque Specifications and it states that for block cradle Perimeter bolts/nuts: 80 lb-in.

Ok cool. We'll try again tomorrow. Thank you sir.

Chris

 

[SideTrackTap]

Quick update...

I removed the timing cover today and was able to extract the broken bolt. While either removing the cover or cleaning the gasket surfaces, I tore a small rubber section of the gasket that is between the upper oil pan and the front cover. Not much I can do about that. It did not separate completely, so I just made sure it was seated properly when I went to put the front cover back on. It's right near where you put silicone gasket sealer on, so that might help with any issues and hopefully it will be ok. I think I used a little too much silicone gasket sealant when I put the cover back on the first time and that made the cover a little harder to remove, but I got it off and with the exception of the previously mentioned gasket tear, the rest of the gasket was ok.

Timing cover was reinstalled. I took my time with the lower five bolts and hand tightened them first because I was scared I'd mess up again. I double checked them with my torque wrench and they all checked out.

Harmonic Balancer is reinstalled. The strap wrench from Home Depot (Husky Brand) worked well. The strap is rubber and is narrow enough it doesn't touch any of the notches on the balancer for the crank sensor. That's almost a two man job getting it that extra 90 degrees, but it's done.

After some errands in the morning tomorrow I hope to check the timing and get that all positioned correctly.

I also did get a replacement bolt for the one I broke yesterday. Not an exact replacement, but it should work well. I'm saving that for the oil pan and stole one of those for the lower cover bolts. Figure it's easier to access on the oil pan should I feel the need to replace it or it's not doing its job.

Night everyone.

 

[SideTrackTap]

Need a double check

I [think] I'm happy to report the right cam will not need to be timed, but I would like a second opinion. Right now with the front timing cover on, harmonic balancer installed, and the crankshaft position sensor installed, I have it set at TDC. I was able to install the camshaft holding tool and adapter (tool numbers 3 & 6 in the OTC-6488 tool kit picture) on the right cam. The right cam sprocket bolt was never loosened and the tensioner stayed in the entire time too. To me, it looks at though the right cam is in the correct position for timing. Am I correct? Pictures follow...

If so, I can move onto the timing of the left cam which will need to be done because I replaced that cam gear and it's loose right now.

Thanks,

Chris

P.S. Probably won't happen until tomorrow at the earliest.

EDIT: I realize now that I don't have the crankshaft holding tool installed per procedure. I will do this to double check and because I'll need it for the left cam, but I still think that this is pretty close to where the crank would be with that tool installed and it shouldn't matter that much.

 

[2000StreetRod]

looking good!

The camshaft tool is fully seated so the camshaft must be in the correct position. It looks like the crankshaft is about 1 degree after TDC but that's probably just the angle of the camera. Even if its off a degree that's not enough to warrant retiming.

 

[SideTrackTap]

The camshaft tool is fully seated so the camshaft must be in the correct position. It looks like the crankshaft is about 1 degree after TDC but that's probably just the angle of the camera. Even if its off a degree that's not enough to warrant retiming.

Ok, thank you StreetRod. I'll double check with the crankshaft holding tool tomorrow and hopefully I can get the left cam timed and start the reassembly process.

Chris

 

[SideTrackTap]

Tiny progress...

If I'm good at one thing, it's taking my time.

The engine should now be properly timed. Left cam was placed correctly and tightened.

Tomorrow, I'll get the oil pan back on, get some oil in there, and make a few revolutions of the engine to prime and check for interference, but I think everything should be good.

The rest will take me a while. After I reinstall the valve covers, I'm planning on replacing the injector o-rings since I'm down there (and already removed one fuel rail), plugs and wires, and of course the dreaded reinstallation of the radiator.

With any luck, I'll be able to take it for a test drive by the end of the week.

Chris

 

[2000StreetRod]

coolant

When you remove the front cover engine coolant drains from the block. After reinstalling it the block is full of air. When the engine is cold the thermostat is closed. Filling up the radiator will not fill the block. When the engine is started the water pump will pump air. Hot spots may occur until the thermostat eventually opens. Some members have had their newly reassembled engines overheat.

Don't forget to drain and replace the engine oil before starting the engine to get rid of coolant in the oil. I use cheap oil and filter.

My procedure is to connect the radiator bottom hose, fill the block thru the thermostat opening until the level is close to the thermostat, install the thermostat and rest of the hoses, then fill the radiator. That way there will only be a small air pocket in the block. Start the engine with the radiator cap loose so air can escape. When the engine warms up enough for the thermostat to open the coolant level in the radiator will drop. Add coolant to the radiator until the level reaches the top of the overflow port then install and tighter the cap. Add coolant to the overflow reservoir if its not half full. Shut the engine off and let it cool. As the coolant cools it will be drawn from the reservoir into the radiator. Then add coolant to the reservoir until the level reaches the normal mark. For the first few drives make them short and closely watch the engine temperature gauge for overheating. Check the reservoir level after each of the first two or three short trips.

After confirming everything is working properly then replace the cheap engine oil and filter with a high quality oil and filter.

 

[SideTrackTap]

Don't forget to drain and replace the engine oil before starting the engine to get rid of coolant in the oil. I use cheap oil and filter.

The oil pan is currently off and when I had the front cover off I blew out what coolant I could see in the upper pan/block cradle. I'm guessing I didn't get all of it, but most of it. Am I ok as it sits right now to fill it with oil and a filter, run it a few times, then change the oil again, or do I need to "flush" what coolant is left by filling with oil, then draining before I run it? I was planning on a soonthereafter oil change because I'm sure some dirt has gotten in in the engine from sitting open so long.

Thanks for the tips on filling the engine with coolant. I'll be sure to take precautions to get as much coolant in the block as possible. However, my radiator doesn't have a cap, it's on the overflow reservoir; but I can still adapt your process to my truck and make it work. Thank you.

Chris

 

[2000StreetRod]

coolant on the bottom

To keep from wasting oil I suggest just putting the pan on and adding the cheap oil. Don't bother flushing any more. Water/coolant will collect on the bottom of the pan. As long as there isn't enough to reach the oil pick up tube it won't circulate thru the lubrication system. When you confirm everything is functional then replace the cheap oil and filter.

 

[SideTrackTap]

To keep from wasting oil I suggest just putting the pan on and adding the cheap oil. Don't bother flushing any more. Water/coolant will collect on the bottom of the pan. As long as there isn't enough to reach the oil pick up tube it won't circulate thru the lubrication system. When you confirm everything is functional then replace the cheap oil and filter.

Sounds good, thanks StreetRod.

Chris

 

[SideTrackTap]

Success

Phew, I guess it's been a couple weeks; I had to go back to page six to find my thread.

I apologize for the delay in progress and updates to anyone who was following. HOWEVER, I am happy to report that as of right now, it was a successful repair. Truck was test run last night and was fully assembled this morning. Everything seems to be running normally. No timing chain rattle and no leaks as of right now.

Today I ran it (just idle, in park) until it warmed up, performed the computer relearn process, and took it out for a short test drive (about 3 miles), and all seems to be well. I only plan to drive it a couple more times for short distances while monitoring for leaks and noises. At that time I'll change out the oil and filter.

I hope to report back at some point with a summary of my repair and actual costs (I'm curious myself).

A big thanks to all who chimed in and offered any insight or advice; I know I wouldn't have been able to do this job without this forum and everyone's help.

And BIGGER thanks to StreetRod. Without his help and the writeups he has taken the time to share on the forum, this job would have been a lot more difficult, if even possible. THANK YOU.

Chris :exp: