Engine underheating?

kvanmet · September 29, 2013

Hello everyone, I have an 1996 explore Eddie Bauer. The problem I'm having is that I can't get the engine to warm up! Today I tried first replacing the thermostat with a motorad, and that got my gauge up to just under a quarter. I did my best to burp out the air, but I just couldn't get t any higher on the gauge and the heat was only warm. Later in the day I got a stant superstat, and the results were just slightly better than the motorad. I'm currently at about 1/3 heat on the gauge. Heat in the cab is slightly better as well. With both new thermostats, the gauge bounces up and down sporadically. The heat in the cab also goes in and out from warm to not so warm. I'm at my wits end, I can't get my heat up. I will say that now I'm running warm enough for the computer to run open cycle which has done wonders for performance. I first questioned the gauge, but the cab heat has gone up incrementally with the gauge. Any suggestions would be helpful because I have no more!

vroomzoomboom · September 29, 2013

to me it still sounds like you have air in the system. when it has cooled down, open the cap, and see how much is in the rad, fill it, and as well as the overflow.
now here is how i normally burp the system. if you have done this already, sorry for posting. leave the cap on the first notch. start the truck and let it run for 10 or 15 mins. that normally burps all, if not most of the air out. let it cool, recheck, and repeat. if that doesnt solve it, there is a chance your rad cap might not be holding pressure, and you may want to look at getting a new cap.

kvanmet · September 29, 2013

Thank you very much for your reply. I forgot to mention that I also replaced the cap. When you say you leave it on the first notch when burping do you mean you screw it on but not all the way so that it is sealed down?

vroomzoomboom · September 29, 2013

yup. if you notice when you screw it down, it will lock but not be tight, then you turn it more, it will lock and be tight. you want it to lock, but be able to wiggle it somewhat. you will see what i mean when you twist the cap

kvanmet · September 29, 2013

Well since you said to keep burping I've gotten quite a bit more coolant in, just very slowly. I'll keep at it tonight and report back tomorrow. Thanks for your advice

pbnj22 · September 30, 2013

You can look up the "aspirin" trick to help burp as well.. open the thermostat and keep it open with aspirin and install it that way. the coolant will dissolve the aspirin after 5 minutes and it will not harm a thing. someone told me that you should park up hill when filling with coolant too.. so your front wheels are higher than the rears..

bandit11 · September 30, 2013

kvanmet said:
Hello everyone, I have an 1996 explore Eddie Bauer. The problem I'm having is that I can't get the engine to warm up! Today I tried first replacing the thermostat with a motorad, and that got my gauge up to just under a quarter. I did my best to burp out the air, but I just couldn't get t any higher on the gauge and the heat was only warm. Later in the day I got a stant superstat, and the results were just slightly better than the motorad. I'm currently at about 1/3 heat on the gauge. Heat in the cab is slightly better as well. With both new thermostats, the gauge bounces up and down sporadically. The heat in the cab also goes in and out from warm to not so warm. I'm at my wits end, I can't get my heat up. I will say that now I'm running warm enough for the computer to run open cycle which has done wonders for performance. I first questioned the gauge, but the cab heat has gone up incrementally with the gauge. Any suggestions would be helpful because I have no more!

to bleed the system you can try drilling a small hole in the flange of the thermostat before you install it (some thermostats already have a jiggle pin installed). when filling the radiator cut the base out of a 2litre coke bottle or other and jam it in the radiator then fill half way and idle the engine as the air comes out the water level in the coke bottle goes down, top up accordlingly

kvanmet · September 30, 2013

I bled and bled last night, and drove to work this morning and still no heat and a very sporadic temp gauge. At one point it got up to 1/3 but averaged 1/4 for 15 miles. I even parked on a steep hill on my way home, took the cap off and tried to bleed it with the radiator uphill. Didn't seem to get much air out. I'm starting to wonder if something else is going on. Any suggestions? As far as no heat, I'm wondering if my heater control valve is faulty. Is it possible the valve shut with air or water trapped in the heater core, unable to escape the valve? Or some kind of other extremely elusive air bubble? Just brainstorming. Not sure how it is supposed to operate but when I tried to manipulate it by hand it didn't move easily. Also felt very cheap. Any ideas are welcome and thanks to all who have replied

IAmTodd · September 30, 2013

I've recently gone through this with my Explorer. I want to mention a couple things I've learned.

1. If you stopped on you way home and popped the cap and you were not scalded in a shower of coolant you're system isn't properly pressurizing.

2. I chased leaks, an unsteady temp gauge and low heat output on my 94. After replacing a leaking radiator and a leaking lower intake manifold and replacing the thermostat and rad cap with Motorcraft parts I now have a steady temp gauge and good heat.

I think you may have an issue with the cooling system itself. Like I said, the system relies a lot on pressure in order to work properly (notice that 16psi rating on your rad cap?). The OHV is notorious for bad lower intake gaskets. Check over yours carefully. If you find its leak, mine was only damp, replace it with a Ford gasket, don't use any other brand! I used a two piece RockAuto brand and had horribly oil leaks with it.

Kiliona · September 30, 2013

radiators are also fairly prone to going bad on explorers

kvanmet · September 30, 2013

Radiator and water pump were very recently replaced at a shop, I should have mentioned sooner. As far as the gaskets, if I had a failing gasket would I not be leaking? This car doesn't leak a drop of anything and my coolant remains at a constant level. Would it be worth getting a motor craft or ford radiator cap? Or is problem beyond that point? At the time I replaced the thermostat I replaced the cap, however the cheapy one I put on was the exact same cheapy one I took off. Thanks for your insight, I hadn't really thought about it like that.

Dave 1955 · September 30, 2013

kvanmet said:
Radiator and water pump were very recently replaced at a shop, I should have mentioned sooner. As far as the gaskets, if I had a failing gasket would I not be leaking? This car doesn't leak a drop of anything and my coolant remains at a constant level. Would it be worth getting a motor craft or ford radiator cap? Or is problem beyond that point? At the time I replaced the thermostat I replaced the cap, however the cheapy one I put on was the exact same cheapy one I took off. Thanks for your insight, I hadn't really thought about it like that.

Did you have this problem before the work?

Strange..usually when a system has air things can get hot.
What temp t-stats are you using?
Did this problem happen all at once or did it slowly evolve?

kvanmet · September 30, 2013

The car was not mine at the time of work, but it's been on the family. i know it's always had strange heater issues. At the time of work it was overheating. Since I've had the car I've had my problem, about five months. Currently it has a 195 degree tstat

kvanmet · September 30, 2013

Also, tested the heater control valve and that doesn't seem to be faulty. Fully engages and disengages when in different modes

kvanmet · September 30, 2013

Some more back information: my dad says the car had always been "cold blooded" but that the key to getting heat was the eatc test mode (simultaneously pressing OFF and FLOOR and within 2 seconds pressing (AUTOMATIC). He doesn't remember what the test mode did but all I can seem to do is clear the codes. Not seeing another way that can be helpful. Right now I'm always going to have a code because the blend door actuator is removed so I could manually operate the blend door through a whole I cut in the ductwork during prior troubleshooting

bigcrunch · October 1, 2013

1. You are using a 195F stat? take it put it in a pot with water turn on heat stick in a cooking thermometer when it reaches right under 190F watch your thermostat see if it opens up should at 195F be fully open. IF it opens way before or after the 195 bad thermostat.

wash the pot thoroughly if you use it in a kitchen for food prep.

2. get one of these
http://www.harborfreight.com/non-contact-infrared-thermometer-with-laser-targeting-69465-8905.html
after running for 15 minutes take temp of thermostat housing, upper radiator should be hard

. Housing should be around 190F.

While doing all of this make sure overflow tank is full to the top, keep a eye out if its overflow starts spitting out coolant.

bigcrunch · October 1, 2013

you have the thermostat in right way??? spring side in the manifold.

koda2000 · October 1, 2013

maybe it's not "underheating" if you're going by the amount of heat coming out of the heater and the position of the idiot gauge. try sticking a meat thermometer in the radiator to see how hot the water's really getting, or use one of those laser temp sensors. any engine will get close to whatever temp the thermostat is rated for. while it's possible to have a bad t-stat, it's unlikely you got 2 bad ones in a row.

IAmTodd · October 1, 2013

koda2000 said:
maybe it's not "underheating" if you're going by the amount of heat coming out of the heater and the position of the idiot gauge. try sticking a meat thermometer in the radiator to see how hot the water's really getting, or use one of those laser temp sensors. any engine will get close to whatever temp the thermostat is rated for. while it's possible to have a bad t-stat, it's unlikely you got 2 bad ones in a row.

Or plug in a Scangauge like device. Not sure if 95+ has two temp sensors but my 94 does.

deweyville65 · October 1, 2013

Here's my .02 worth. I firmly believe in the infrared thermometer. Check the temp all the way from the back of the head to the radiator and the heater core. Only then will you know what you actually have as far as heat. You don't have to check the back of the head/s but it can't hurt. You can start at the thermostat housing.

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