1997 Explorer 5.0L, replaced Fuel pump 3 times, same problem, I need HELP!!

[410Fortune]

you have checked the vacuum hoses and routing but can you do a vacuum leak test?

either with a pump or with spray while running?
it is difficult at best to see anything on the 5.0L with your eyes, especially the PCV! You may need a new intake gasket and to remove the upper intake to see adequatley, or perform a manifold vacuum test first

also weekends are FOR working on your explorer LOL a whole day is a blessing!!

 

[williams.cory]

you have checked the vacuum hoses and routing but can you do a vacuum leak test?

either with a pump or with spray while running?
it is difficult at best to see anything on the 5.0L with your eyes, especially the PCV! You may need a new intake gasket and to remove the upper intake to see adequatley, or perform a manifold vacuum test first

also weekends are FOR working on your explorer LOL a whole day is a blessing!!

lol! yeah ive been waiting for the weekened to come so I can have some more time to work on the X.

Oh, and I dont think I'll be able to get a vacuum tester and any tools like that. I'm on such a tight budget and I lost my job last week:thumbdwn:

So I really dont have money for stuff like that. Luckily I was able to take that CPS back! My parents have been trying to help but they have a tight budget to, times are bad as everyone know.

I just keep replacing a part here and a part there. My X has been out of comission for over 3 months now I cant wait to get it fixed and go drive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Edit: I'm not sure where all you guys are from, but here in Michigan the econemy is horrible! So bad, a nearby Dairy Queen opened for the first time, and on the first day accepting applications, 200 people formed in line in hopes of getting a job.

Since moving here in August, I looked for a job for 5 months before being hired finally! And after that, I only got to work there for about a month before they had to let me go because they couldnt afford to have so many employee's.

Its a bad cycle in Northern Michigan. The adults are being layed off, therefor they take they college students' jobs because thats all they can get. Then, the college students are now out of a job, and so they go for the jobs high schoolers take, and so high schoolers have hardly any jobs availible....

 

[robertoa1a]

The thing is, I pull smal vacume lines all the time and it still runs. If it is indeed a vacume leak then I would think that it would be large. Like the break booster or egr stuck open. I know you don't have a vacume pump but you can put a hose on the egr and suck on it and hear it opening and closing. You can plug the power steering booster hose temporarly to rule that out too.

I like the idea of making a check list.

 

[410Fortune]

PCV is a big vacuum leak also, buried under fuel lines on the very back of the engine, I checked the one on the 98 I am building yesterday., blind, with my hand LOL its seated fine
if the PCV is bad it can also stick open

 

[williams.cory]

PCV is a big vacuum leak also, buried under fuel lines on the very back of the engine, I checked the one on the 98 I am building yesterday., blind, with my hand LOL its seated fine
if the PCV is bad it can also stick open

I'll try to check the PCV. But I'm trying to shoot the idea down, but if it was stuck open then wouldnt all kinds off black smoke be coming from the exhaust, and the oil dipstick or cap be shot off because of the trmendous pressure in the crankcase? I was just wondering...but anythings possible. I'll add that to my list of things to checl tomarrow.

 

[williams.cory]

I just realized, i said in my last post if it was stuck open then wouldnt there be a pressure buildup. Well after reading, I was thinking if it was stuck closed then it would do that.

I havnt read about syptoms if it was stuck open...what would some be?

 

[robertoa1a]

Ya' can't get pcv and egr confused. Check bouth though. Fortune is talking about that pcv that none of us 5.0 guys can never seem to find. Theres a sticky thread on that.

 

[CDW6212R]

Fuel pressure, it must be 32-35psi at minimum all of the time, WOT gives it about 40-42psi.

 

[410Fortune]

I have said many times I believe your issue (obviously) is the 24# at the fuel rail, its NOT ENOUGH PRESSURE and its NOT LIKELY ALL 3 PUMPS

First thing I suspect is the in tank unit and plumbing on it
then the fuel lines from tank to engine
filter, etc

fuel pressure test

Dont forget your problem can always be a combo of problems = one at a time troubleshoot and diagnose

 

[V8BoatBuilder]

once again a vacuum leak test is suggested! great advice as long as you can keep it running long enough and smooth enough for that particular test!!

A Vacuum gauge, such as the one on the mightyvac, can also help pinpoint a vacuum leak.

 

[TheVarmit]

How's it going williams.cory? The suspense is killing me!!!

 

[williams.cory]

How's it going williams.cory? The suspense is killing me!!!

lol! Sorry for not posting sooner.... Took fuel tank back down and took the return line off the fuel pump assembly. Pointed the hose into a gas can and starter the X up. Went back and looked to see how much gas was flowing and there wasn't to much, definetly not over 5 PSI if that. Went to go turn the vehicle off, and as I got up I noticed a pretty big puddle of gas underneath of the explorer!

Checked it out and the fuel line going from the fuel filter to the fuel rail had a hole in it and was leaking pretty good. So I'm working on getting that gas line out and getting some more to replace it.

I have never noticed gas leaking and never saw any puddles of gas anywhere. So I suspect that it was a minor leak at first and got alot worse. I'm thinking this could be my problem all along, letting gas out and air in the system. Makes sense to me.

Replacing tomarrow and I'll let you all know what happens!

 

[410Fortune]

what a shock! a leak in your gas lines! LOL

So glad you found your possible problem! Fuel line leaks = SUCK!!

Napa has some replacement hoses, you can also have them made, or a junk yard, heck if you tell me which hose and need one shippind I probably have one laying around too

 

[williams.cory]

Well the leak wasnt the problem! The leak was coming from the return line!!

Anyway the leak is fixed.

I dropped the tank again so I could take the main hose off to the fuel pump assembly and run a hose to a gas can so I could see what kind of pressure I'm getting. I was getting good pressure, but half of the gas coming out was literally full of THOUSANDS of little bubbles! So something was definetly wrong.

Took the pump back out of the tank. This time I soldered the wires, shrink wrapped them and I put a new rubber hose on it. Put it back together and checked the line again. This time no bubbles and more pressure than before!

So put the tank back up and everything back together. Took her for a ride and it was fixed!! Ran so good!....

BUT!

After about 5 miles of driving the problem was coming BACK!!!!!!!!! Can't give it more than 1/2 throttle or it will bog down. Between 1/4-1/2 throttle it will jerk like fuel is fed to it then stops and gets more fuel. But anything under 1/4 throttle is fine. But I'm sure it will get alot worse as the past has shown me...

So what the heck????????????

Taking the fuel line off again today to see if there any bubbles like last time.

Oh yeah, I took the return line off to see how much pressure was there, and hardly any gas was coming out. Is this normal? I would think I would have to get a good amout of gas coming from the return...

 

[410Fortune]

yes you should

Your pump should be sending like 80 psi
the fuel rail only needs 36-42 ish psi
so the overflow, or excess 44-38 psi should be returning to the tank

You need to get a fuel pressure tester, or at least a few cheapo tire air gages, the round dial type, you can use them once or twice to check fuel pressure

Check your fuel pressure regulator line for gas in it, I know you said you replaced the regulator and there was no change??????

Maybe you have another air leak? check your lines again, up near the engine

 

[410Fortune]

Williams I want you to pull a couple of spark plugs after you run the truck for a bit and it bogs down, tell us if they are wet with gas

 

[williams.cory]

There was no change after I replaced the fuel pressure regulator.

Will be checking the lines again today.

Took the return off, and there was hardly any gas coming out, but there were no bubbles in it this time.

So I got a hose and connected it to the main line and ran the hose back into the gas tank. Got a wire and connected it to the power to the pump and hooked it to a battery. Let it run for 10 minutes to see if there was any change...There wasnt, entire time there was a steady stream that had some good pressure to it.

Just got done with driving around, took a spark plug out and it was nice and dry, with a light brown tint.

I still have my old FPR and I'll swap it with the new one...I know I've said that before but I havnt done it yet. I'm heading out to do it right now...lol

 

[CDW6212R]

How did the rubber hose look exactly in the tank, and the clamps? The later trucks are susceptible to that hose leaking pressure, but they run 50% more pressure. is there a chance that the rubber hose had an internal cut, not just a loose clamp?

The fuel pressure check is still needed, still the first thing to do. If nothing else suggests itself then I'd swap the FPR back again.

 

[williams.cory]

How did the rubber hose look exactly in the tank, and the clamps? The later trucks are susceptible to that hose leaking pressure, but they run 50% more pressure. is there a chance that the rubber hose had an internal cut, not just a loose clamp?

The fuel pressure check is still needed, still the first thing to do. If nothing else suggests itself then I'd swap the FPR back again.

I replaced the hose just in case and tightend the clamps down ALOT! lol.

I just swapped FPR's, but one of the hole's I accidently stripped out. So now its leaking gas! So I got a different bolt and put a nut on it. After an hour of fustration of trying to get that nut on the bolt because of limited space, it still leaks gas! So I took it all off and i needed new O-rings. got those, and finally got everything back together only to find out its still leaking...So I just gave up for the day as I'm so exhausted.

Today I dropped the tank again so I could hook another wire onto the power source to the fuel pump. I ran the wire to the front seat so I could keep a eye on the voltage if there was a short in there somewhere. Held a steady 13.4 volts so the wiring is good.

I noticed that when I took this new FPR off there was kinda of alot of pressure and gas came gushing out. It wasnt like that when I took the old regulator off the first time....

 

[410Fortune]

your fuel rail is pressurized, before you work on it you must bleed the system of its pressure!!!

Something you are not used to since you have had a lack of pressure

For the o ring, clean the FPR and the rail, then coat the o ring with some vaseline or ATF before installing it, press on FPR by hand, then clamp down both bolts slowly, one at a time, so it seats evenly