1997 MM 5.0 c-n-p conv. *IT RUNS! 1st CL drive Problem with Overdrive*

[410Fortune]

I bet it’s in the programming? Anyone else you have found with this issue?

 

[allmyEXes]

Mention of one other person. Not for this project but a future solution is to use a 2003 Mustang GT PCM. I was already needing the wiring harness to use in an early Mustang. Newer Mustangs have tachometers. I'll purchase the Dakota Digital piece for the '54F100/Ranger project.

 

[Josh P]

Probably not worth the effort, but if you could parallel wire an edis module it would give the tachometer output signal

 

[allmyEXes]

Are you suggesting this and just use the tach part of it? It wouldn't be difficult to tap to the PCM signals. What ford had these? Explorer? Year?
That would work on a budget.

EDIS information

 

[410Fortune]

Gen 1 had them
Any ford from late 80 early 90 with a speed density distributor should have one I think?




Great idea!!!!!!! Does his pcm have the pip idm and saw signals? I dunno

Take us to school!

 

[allmyEXes]

Would need an EDIS-8 module. It may be built into the 1999 PCM.

 

[Josh P]

Are you suggesting this and just use the tach part of it? It wouldn't be difficult to tap to the PCM signals. What ford had these? Explorer? Year?
That would work on a budget.
View attachment 456882
EDIS information

It's external, so you might be able to tap signals but if not, mount a 2nd crankshaft sensor. Those modules are dirt cheap at the yards. An OBD1 thunderbird with a 4.6 had them.

 

[allmyEXes]

I have a 1996 4.6 Thunderbird complete. Saving it for the 4R70W to load in a 5.0 case.
I have 6 more crankshaft position sensors with brackets.

 

[410Fortune]

Nevermind I’m a moron Edis is diff from the earlier speed density ignition module
It’s in the very name!

Carry on

 

[Josh P]

Nevermind I’m a moron Edis is diff from the earlier speed density ignition module
It’s in the very name!

Carry on

For the tach to work, just needs crank signal and the pulses from the coils. Only a few wires. Even if the stuff had to be run separately, it could be hidden somewhere under the vehicle to keep the engine bay clean

 

[CDW6212R]

Have you had any contact lately with Decipha, he knows those Crown Vic PCM's well. I'd ask him if there is a tach signal in the PCM, that would simpler than adding an EDIS module etc.

 

[allmyEXes]

I have a note out there on his site. He is the one that mentioned that the Crown Victorias don't have an active #48 pin. Riner had asked. I found talk on corral.net where you told him about Dechipha.
I think my Thunderbird is too new to have an EDIS and connector. Maybe @CDW6212R Don has and early V-8 Thunderbird with an EDIS-8 module and connector on it. One that he is using for a 5.0 conversion?

 

[allmyEXes]

Guys, Thanks for the input. Jamie, I will get the Dakota Digital piece for the '54 project. I would need to check with DD to see if that will work with my "vintage" 1969 Mercury Cougar tach that is in the '54 F100 instrument cluster.
Josh, with the separate crank ps, I see where the EDIS module just might work. I don't think that the location around the circle of the tone ring would matter since it is not running an ignition system, just a tach.
Don in TN, I didn't know what years your other Fords are and what powertrains that they have or had and what you swapped to.
Here is a '91 CV part on eBay for reference. Up to '95 I think.

 

[CDW6212R]

On the SCCA or Thunderbird site long ago they spoke of using the EDIS from the Mark VIII and similar year Thunderbird's. I gather it was part of the first 4.6 ignition systems, prior to COP in 1999. So there are plenty of them still, but more rare as they push 25+ years of age.

I only have four 2nd gen Explorers, two Mark VII's and 73 Q code Ranchero's. I sold my last Crown Vic and didn't keep any parts really from those I had. I like the 03/04 Crown Vic as a PCM platform for any older Ford swap, they can run almost any V8.

 

[allmyEXes]

Monday the wideband AFR gauge kit arrived. I was able to remove the drivers side (US) down pipe and install a second bung for the WB o2.
With two 18mm bungs, I will be able to compare various brands of o2 sensors.

After spending possible unnecessary time loosening the rh down pipe to see what is going on with the leak, I had brother look at it with me.
He noticed that the bottom of the exhaust manifold was not contacting the head. Then he saw the big square nub on the 4R70W was sitting against the manifold, holding it off. @Josh P If josh is going to be putting a 4R70W in his 1977M II, he will want to know this before he installs it. Chop both of the square nubs off of your transmission. I'm about to tend to that now.

 

[Josh P]

I had to chop on a 4R70W to get it to fit in my 68 cougar in a similar fashion.

 

[allmyEXes]

Ace hardware wanted $24.99 for a 9" demo Sawzall blade. The sawsall wouldn't fit up in the tight space anyway. After removing the rh exhaust manifold, a small grinder with a 3" disc barely fit in there and chopped a bit off of the ear before the grinder vibrated a loose on the gear drive head. Brand new Harbor Freight piece. I knocked a piece off after the cut. I resorted to drilling several holes in it, pretty much Swiss cheese. A couple of more whacks and it was messed up enough that the manifold now fits. An air powered cut off tool would have worked or a mini saw even better.
HF is 22 miles one way, and the project is well over budget. Off topic a bit. I have a 1998 Explorer 5.0 and a 4R70W and when it comes out to go in the '65 Mustang fastback, I will remember to trim those ears early on. There is also a rh rear heatshield that would need to come off to clear the small Mustang tunnel. The Explorer tunnels are quite a bit larger.
Picture of messed up rh ear. It ain't pretty, but it worked.

The first time that I got the exhaust system all together, I was happy and it was happy. Today it fought me going back together. It was like it was spring loaded. I took out the bolts then boing! For the night, the manifold is being held to the head with two bolts. The flange is tightened back up. Just a little finish up on the exhaust and put the plugs back in. There is about 30 minutes to go on the WB o2 gauge wiring and then it is
ready to start back up. More tomorrow.

 

[410Fortune]

Man that edis
Module posted sure does look like the ignition module that came with the gen 1 trucks. I’m Gonna get my wiring chart out and compare

I learned that grinder wheels and metal sawzall Blades don’t cut aluminun very well. It is all I used to use and just dealt with it. Then a friend showed me that a wood
Cutting Blade goes right through aluminum without getting all Gummed up

 

[Josh P]

Man that edis
Module posted sure does look like the ignition module that came with the gen 1 trucks. I’m Gonna get my wiring chart out and compare

Same module. I think there's a wire or two difference between the edis 6 and 8

 

[allmyEXes]

@410Fortune Good tip on the wood cutting blade for aluminum. I heard that cutting fluid when machining some aluminum is not necessary.
I somewhat have the engine running. The manifold shouldn't be leaking at the head, but it could be and possibly it is at the exhaust flange too. This will require an exhaust shop to fix the down tube part. I suspect that the exhaust manifold may be warped and not sitting down flat against the exhaust ports. When I find some more money that can go into this project, I'll remove the manifold again and find shop that has a huge belt sander that they use to surface stuff and get the manifold really trued up.
I can understand that a leak like that could keep it from running correctly even in open loop? That is a question. The AFR gauge is all over the place but occasionally it will read stable for a short time. The throttle doesn't want to rev up when giving it some peddle. If you let it sit and idle from start up, it runs well then it gets slower and slower to the point that you can speak "1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8" then it dies.
In the meantime, I can be getting the other PCM ready with CRAI8 I think it is. One of the YYA2 varieties, with the QH etc. I just wish it would run well enough to make it to the exhaust shop. The leak is one the passenger side of the engine. The wideband sensor is in the lh exhaust pipe about 24" downstream.
The biggest problem is it won't throttle up to drive it normal.
Also wondering once it does warm up, what will the PCM think about the rear o2 sensors not present. Will it just post a code but not run any different otherwise?
Also here in a few minutes, I'm going to write the cop car bin file to the PCM that came out of @Josh P Josh's 1999 Crown Vic and disconnect the battery, swap out PCMs and see if it runs any different. 8 years ago, I heard it run on that PCM. The cop car PCM is an online junk yard piece. If the engine runs the same, then it is not the PCM. If it runs different, then the cop car PCM has a bad component, capacitor or something.
I'm looking forward to it being drive-able and I can say completed.
I think it would need to be an edis 8 module to work with a V-8. I don't think my'96 T-bird would have one.