700R4 going into my Explorer and Shifter Questions

[Dignan]

a 700R4 is a piece of crap too.

In their original form, yes they pretty much sucked, but they have a lot more after market options than the A4LD. For the first round, I'm glad I had the A4LD. I got 225,000 miles out of it, but after reading about so many other A4LDs after the rebuild, they are lucky to get 30,000. The 700R4 can be rebuilt much better than that and at the same time has more options in the aftermarket offroad industry. I'm not taking advantage of that right now, but sometime I might throw doubler in there or something.

 

[Dignan]

OK, get this. After the shop changing from "ya it'll be done on Tuesday" to "we'll probably start on Friday, so you're looking at Monday, maybe Tuesday" I was already a little upset. So, today I got a voicemail from the shop asking me to call them. I found it a little odd that they didn't mention it was done, but I still expected them to say that when I called back.... Wrong!

So they told me that they took a look at it this morning. (so I'm thinking: WHAT? YOU LOOKED AT IT THIS MORNING? YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO HAVE IT DONE TODAY!) "Ya and it looks like you're going to need to re-do your exhaust, we'll have to fab a new crossmember, and you'll need new drive lines. Instead of the $600 it is going to be a least $1000."

Suffice it to say I'm a little upset.

 

[Maniak]

Umm? huh?

New crossmember, new drive lines?

You got the Advanced adapters kit, right?

If so, you do not needs to modify the drive lines, or the crossmember.

The exhaust does have to be modified SLIGHTLY. AA even sends you a piece of exhaust so you can modify it. You loosen the the exhaust, cut it in the center of the cross over pipe, install the transmission, Maybe crush the exhaust down tube on the passenger side "slightly", put in the piece of exhaust AA sent you and weld the exhaust together.

With the exhaust out, putting in the 700r4 transmission itself is easy, and no harder than r&R of the a4ld. The adapter plate was easy to install onto the block, and onto the converter. The exahust requires a couple hours to do, at the most (thats pulling it, cutting, putting it back up and welding the new center piece into the cross over).

I'd say the most time consuming part was the shifter AND the wiring to/from the trans (from the shifter and from the brakes).

I also made a 33 ohm circuit to put into the A4ld circuit so the computer still thinks the a4ld is there.

~Mark

 

[Dignan]

Ya, no mechanics believe me when I say that it is that easy even though several of the guys on this message board have done it. I guess I'm just going to have to do it myself. I'm not a mechanic, but since its not a rebuild I think I can unbolt the old one and bolt in a new one.

I was really disappointed that they kept it that long before they realized that it would be so "difficult". I could have taken somewhere else and been done. I'm planning a road trip to Yellowstone for Labor Day and would have liked to have the Explorer back for the gas mileage. My Powerstroke doesn't do too much worse, but the price of diesel has gone up quite a bit. Oh well, I guess in the long run I'll be saving, just losing more down-time on the explorer while I try to figure out how to piece it together.

 

[Maniak]

I'd say that shop is worthless then, and would never give them any business and bad mouth them whenever I could.

Not becuase they couldn't wouldn't do the work, but becuase they promised to do it, then lied about doing it, then lied about starting it, then didn't want to do it.

A decen't shop would have least said we can't "quote" you a price, but we can charge you $xx /hour to do it. That way if they have problems they aren't out a bunch of money. And they wouldn't have said it would be done on day X and then not even look at it until a week after it was supposed to be done.

~Mark

 

[Dignan]

My sentiments exactly. It is an offroad shop, maybe some of you in the Salt Lake area are familiar with them, the shop is called Rocklogic. I have seen their work and their reputations proceeded them. I thought I was going to get quality work done at a good price, but I got nothin done at a big waste of time.

 

[Maniak]

Sounds like one of those shops that hires wrench turners, not mechanics. If its not a kit, doesn't have step by step instructions, or requires any thought, they can't handle it.

I'd try good trans shops. they won't waranty the transmission (they didnt' build it) but they know how to r&r transmisions won't make mistakes that people who aren't used to transmisions may make (like using the bolts to pull the converter).

~Mark

 

[Dignan]

Well I've tried just about every tranny shop in town and they all either don't do custom or don't do it cheap. I know that at least one guy, who was the one heading this project, is very accomplished with off road stuff, I don't know about trannies, but he certainly know off road stuff. I don't doubt their knowlege, but if they continue to run business like that, it doesn't matter how much they know.

 

[Dignan]

Update: I got it out of that shop that was jerking me around. I took it to a guy that my dad knows. When I first read about the option of a 700R4 a couple of years ago, I talked to this guy, and he was far less than enthusiastic about it, so when it came time to do it, I basically wrote him off. All though he knows transmissions, I figured he didn't want to do it, but after dealing with that other shop, I figured it was worth talking to him again. It definately sounds like he wouldn't do it to his own vehicle, but he is willing to do it for me and he is only charging $400. It has been funny to hear the various responses when I tell mechanics what I am doing. A lot of them know how crappy the 700R4 has been and have probably had to fix a lot of them so they think it is a bad idea. Some of them know that it can be rebuilt a lot better, so they think its a great idea. One guy even said, "a 700R4 in an Explorer? They have a kit for that? That's the best idea I've ever heard!" Unfortunately, that guy was too expensive. The guy that is going to do it told me that he actually likes the A4LD. I had a hard time not laughing and ridiculing him (you call yourself a transmission mechanic?!, etc.) but I held it in and just said that it was great the first time around, but I don't want a 30k mile rebuild. No offense to the mechanic, but I don't want to see him again for a long time.

So its going under the knife tomorrow. Hopefully it will be done when I return from Yellowstone after Labor Day. Someday this thread will have pics and a review of the 700R4 conversion.

 

[BKennedy]

I built the 1" tall subframe to mount to the console bolts, bolted to the floor, and the shifter is bolted to the subframe.

I built a center console so I could get the right height with a Megashifter from B&M. I really like the shifter, but my rig is mainly for off road.
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142078&page=6&pp=20

 

[Dignan]

Well, this guy that has my explorer certainly isn't breaking any speed records on a tranny swap. One of the main reasons I wanted to go to a mechanic, was the fact that I thought it would be done a lot faster than if I did it myself. I like to think that I could have done it a little quicker. It has been more than a month since I got the parts. Of course, a big part of that time was with the shop that was jerking me around. It has only been at this guy's shop for a week and a half, but I guess I'm just not very patient after a month. I want my explorer back. Maybe rather than complain here on the website, I should call the mechanic and see if I can push him along a little........

 

[BKennedy]

Well, this guy that has my explorer certainly isn't breaking any speed records on a tranny swap. One of the main reasons I wanted to go to a mechanic, was the fact that I thought it would be done a lot faster than if I did it myself. I like to think that I could have done it a little quicker. It has been more than a month since I got the parts. Of course, a big part of that time was with the shop that was jerking me around. It has only been at this guy's shop for a week and a half, but I guess I'm just not very patient after a month. I want my explorer back. Maybe rather than complain here on the website, I should call the mechanic and see if I can push him along a little........

My Explorer was in the shop for two months, mostly because the tranny had to be RR'd twice because it would not go forward the first time. Bowtie was not too cooperative, tried to blame it on the installer, then finally rebuilt the transmission. They sent the wrong TV cable also.

 

[Dignan]

That sucks, I really hope that I don't have those kinds of problems. My explorer was sitting for nearly a year with a broken A4LD while I saved up for this project, so it has now been about a year since I have been able to drive my explorer on a regular basis. I am pretty excited to get it back, so it is hard to be patient.

 

[Dignan]

Believe it or not, I still don't have my explorer back. Get this, after nearly a month I was a little impatient when I called the mechanic again, and I almost blew up when he told me that my explorer wasn't a priority. I kept my cool and just said, well, I don't have a car, so it is a priority to me. When I said that, he was totally shocked, he said that he thought it was just a project vehicle, and I had another car.

I understand where he is coming from, its not your average soccer mom explorer, especially with the crazy transmission conversion he is doing to it, but I really wish he had mentioned it wasn't a priority from the beginning, because even if I didn't need it as a daily driver, I'm still very impatient and would want it more quickly.

 

[Dignan]

Man, someday I hope to change my signature to not have an explorer that is "paws-up"

I still don't have it back from the shop. Supposedly he was putting in the shifter, transfer case, and drive-lines over the weekend, but I am wondering why it is now Monday evening and I haven't heard from him, I would have thought that was the easy part.

I must be impatient.

 

[Jefe]

Dang.

He better be giving you a heck of a deal on labor, being that your rig seems to be the lowest priority.

 

[BKennedy]

That just sucks! Mine took a few months, but that is because of the problems with the transmission, the modification involved with the NP231 transfer case, and the fact that my friend who did the work did it on slow days at his shop because he was charging me less than half price on the labor rate. But, that was discussed before it went into the shop so I knew what to expect. I guess the mechanics in your area are not into referals or return customers.

 

[Dignan]

He is giving me a great deal, I am just beginning to wonder how cheap I really am. If I knew it would be this long I would have shelled out a few more bucks to get it done quickly.

 

[BKennedy]

He is giving me a great deal, I am just beginning to wonder how cheap I really am. If I knew it would be this long I would have shelled out a few more bucks to get it done quickly.

Well, when I asked my buddy who was doing the work what it was going to cost and how long it would take he said; "I have no idea". Meaning, since he has never done one of these in an Explorer before, he had no idea....... If you are getting a good deal on labor, which is 90 percent of the cost of this job, then you need to be patient. Since my rig is not a daily driver (I don't think I would do this kind of modification to a daily driver) I had plenty of time to wait.

 

[Dignan]

Well I've tried to be patient, but I still think think two months is excessive. I took it to this guy in August and that was after I had a hassle with the first shop trying to double their estimate, so I think I've been patient enough. As for not doing this on a daily driver. Why not? I use this vehicle off road, and that is why I wanted something more heavy duty, when I started I also used it for towing, but now that I have a Powerstroke that's not a problem. It definately has benefits for off road use, but with its good drivability and higher OD, I don't see a downside for daily use.