D44 SAS Steering Problems

[chad551]

OK well I made my maiden Moab voyage in my truck since doing the SAS last week.

And some problems reared their ugly heads:

1. Steering radius was and is terrible. I think I need to add some wheel spacers up front so my steering radius can be alot smaller. I am afraid to adjust the steering stops to far in, because i dont know how much bind the u-joints can take. And the tires will rub on the leafs as well.

2. When the tires are in a bind and not that bad of a bind, I cannot turn them unless I am moving. This is not good at all, and actually scared me a few times.

So can someone please offer some suggestions? I bought a Gen1 steering box when I did the SAS so it should be good.

 

[90ranajo]

What steering setup are you using? Are you using a inverted-T, inverted-Y, or High steer? Also how does your panhard and drag link angles & lengths look?

Could you post up a pic of your steering setup?

 

[chad551]

I have a high steer setup, but I almost think that now that everythig is breaking in I could use the the stock locations on the knuckles. Will have to get some pics later today. I have found 1 issue but it will need a pic to explain.

 

[crazyflights]

Will it steer sitting still if you get your RPMS up a little? When not moving.

 

[IZwack]

Is this with the ARB on or off? Because a locked front will increase turning radius - my Explorer used to crab walk sideways (and low tire PSI) because it didnt want to turn.

If you are running a Saginaw P-style pump (like the one from the first gen), maybe try bumping the line pressure via the West Texas Off Road pump mod: http://westtexasoffroad.homestead.com/powersteering.html. Another option is to do a hydro assist.

 

[chad551]

Locker was off, but the manual hubs were locked. I only used the locker when going straight up hill.. I remembered what you told me about when to use the locker.

I am using the gen1 pump, and revving the motor did not help it.

 

[IZwack]

I'd look into that West Texas pump mod - it will take you a few hours and besides the cost of more fluid, its pretty much almost free.

EDIT - oh and are you sure the ARB is disengaging? Maybe do a test with the front tires off of the ground and turn them by hand.

 

[Stic-o]

The steering just sucks on these SAS reguardless. you can't compare it to a IFS truck. and my turning radius sucks too

 

[crazyflights]

Mine turns pretty good, i thought? Havent drove many IfS rigs thoe
--it did look like ur front looked like it was still lock one time, thats why i asked. I noticed that once when you were backing up.??

 

[IZwack]

Oh another thing I forgot is the rear axle - if its locked and on the dirt, it will push the front even if the front differential is open.

 

[kert0307]

I don't know if it would matter, but would "ackerman steerning" angles come into play here on SAS'ed rigs since the steering setup is more than likely optimized for a longer wheel based vehicle? The high steer plates could effect it as well.

 

[dkchrist]

Good point Kert. What is the axle out of? What was the original wheel base of the associated vehicle? Also, caster may have something to do with your bad steering. Does it have a nice center feeling at highway speeds? In the Moab pics the steering angle looks fine. I am siding with IZ on line pressure. Then I would start looking at alignment specs.

Just because you swapped axles doesn't mean that steering should suck.

Here is an in depth view of vehicle handling characteristic that may help in getting it dialed in. Suspension 101

 

[chad551]

Vehicle drives fine on the highway, and caster is great as the wheel quickly spins back after making a turn.

The axle is out of a 89 Grand Waggy.

And the main problem with my steering is that does not turn real sharp (LARGE turning radius).

 

[RockRanger]

Mine sucks as well. It helped some adding wheel spacers to the front. It got worse when I welded the rear diff to lock it up. Not really sure what a good fix is. If you are already hetting the leafs you can't turn anymore anyway.

Find the fix so I can do it to mine

 

[DB_1]

Everyone has mentioned some fixes, it's the right combination that will help your situation.
Hydro assist will do wonders as far as turning the wheels while the front locker is engaged.
A selectable locker in the rear would help the situation even further, like IZ mentioned it wants to keep pushing the vehicle straight in turns.
Spacers on top of all that will give you a much better turning radius but you'll have to be careful if you are running stock axleshafts up front because if you get your tires bound up in a tight situation while in 4lo, you run the risk of snapping a joint or shaft.
Ask Rick or FAKRWEE about their set-ups, they both have ARB's front and rear wit hydro assist.

 

[chad551]

My axles are chromo superiors with CTM joints. The rear end just has a powertrax locker in it. When I get some extra money I want to put an ARB back there to match the front.

 

[Fusion213]

What's limiting your steering travel? Maybe your pitman arm isn't long enough? Are your steering stops hitting? Maybe the leaf springs are limiting it. I have a narrowed 44 w/ hydro and 1.5" wheel spacers and it turns pretty well. The high steer arms I used were the partsmike super arms and i'm running an inverted T setup w/ chevy "1 ton" TRE's.

For the weak steering, maybe it's the pump?

 

[crazyflights]

any improvements yet? I'm thinking I need to learn about Hydro assist, I think this may help you also, Im going to 37s, so thinking it might be a must I dunno yet thoe.

 

[chad551]

I have not worked on the truck at all since I finished the SAS. I am waiting to break in my new garage after we move in. However funds will be a little tight for soending on my truck for a while until i get our house the way we want it. I probably wont work on it until after Christmas.

 

[section525]

Chad.. do you have a panhard bar on this thing? I forget..