Only defrosters....Lightly

[LoquetusofBorg]

haha, your right. I have had that stripped on the inside and never noticed that. I obviously was not looking for it but you think I would have seen it.

 

[koda2000]

haha, your right. I have had that stripped on the inside and never noticed that. I obviously was not looking for it but you think I would have seen it.

BTW, IIRC the blue or green colors for the various displays are controlled by the color of the lens.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

Yeah, I remembered that after I got the spare out and looked. After I said to CDW6212R about the dig read out, I thought to myself "I don't remember soldering anything" and made the correction. Thanks Koda2000
Robert

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

Well here we go. Took off the canister,(globe), and when I took off the engine to globe vacuum line there was a big slow hiss of air going into it. I don't have a vacuum pump but I do have some big syringes. The vacuum from the engine took the syringe down to nothing in about a second. Then I put more air in the syringe and tried to hold it back, again it took it down quickly, you would think you could hold back 19-20 lbs but it was hard to do. Took the syringe and tried to put air into the line,(between globe and firewall), No-way would not go, tried to suck air from that line and no go. Moved into the interior and disconnected the line from firewall to eatc and re-cerc valve, then took the syringe to the black hose and tried to put air in,(lightly), and no go. Then tried to get air out- again no go. Hooked it up to the white line and it went in and out as easy as you please. I will have to get some hose for my syringe to test the re-cerc valve this week. Now I fixed the 4 little vacuum pumps so I know those Should be good. So Koda2000 do you think it is the head unit or the lines? When I had the head unit out some time ago I did check it for hair line cracks and carbon trails not to mentioned just cleaned it good to and it works the fan and temp great. The head unit also checks out electronically too, God I hope it is not that. I will see about getting a new or newer set of lines from firewall and eatc unit. When I get the line from syringe to the re-cerc valve I will test and post results. Thanks for letting me bounce these things off you and I look forward to any input you may have on this.
Robert

 

[koda2000]

Well here we go. Took off the canister,(globe), and when I took off the engine to globe vacuum line there was a big slow hiss of air going into it. I don't have a vacuum pump but I do have some big syringes. The vacuum from the engine took the syringe down to nothing in about a second. Then I put more air in the syringe and tried to hold it back, again it took it down quickly, you would think you could hold back 19-20 lbs but it was hard to do. Took the syringe and tried to put air into the line,(between globe and firewall), No-way would not go, tried to suck air from that line and no go. Moved into the interior and disconnected the line from firewall to eatc and re-cerc valve, then took the syringe to the black hose and tried to put air in,(lightly), and no go. Then tried to get air out- again no go. Hooked it up to the white line and it went in and out as easy as you please. I will have to get some hose for my syringe to test the re-cerc valve this week. Now I fixed the 4 little vacuum pumps so I know those Should be good. So Koda2000 do you think it is the head unit or the lines? When I had the head unit out some time ago I did check it for hair line cracks and carbon trails not to mentioned just cleaned it good to and it works the fan and temp great. The head unit also checks out electronically too, God I hope it is not that. I will see about getting a new or newer set of lines from firewall and eatc unit. When I get the line from syringe to the re-cerc valve I will test and post results. Thanks for letting me bounce these things off you and I look forward to any input you may have on this.
Robert

You can probably borrow a hand-held vacuum pump with a gauge at most auto parts stores for free with just a deposit. They're only about $20 if you want to buy one. I don't know that trying to use a syringe to try to create vacuum would work.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

These syringes are heavy liquid syringes and they, believe it or not, work very well at checking for vacuum. You can look at these things as a very simple pump without the trigger. You can't gage the amount of foot or inch pounds but you can see if vacuum is present and is working or even if it holds. I will get my camera out and post a picture of these types of syringes later on today. I will also check into getting a vacuum gage if they are that cheep it would pay to have one. I am hopping it is just the white line or the re-circulation valve, something easy for once. Thanks for your help.
Robert

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

Koda2000 do you know how to explain the check valve inside the globe? My lines appear to be in working order with no vacuum in the cab's white line. I heard the air hiss when taking off the supply line to globe and as I said tried to push and pull air from the line that goes from globe to fire wall and got nothing,(would not budge, no air either way). I'm thinking check valve inside the globe. Has anyone here bypassed the globe and hooked it up straight? Would that even work? Thanks for letting me bounce ideas off you.
Robert

 

[Turdle]

Connecting it straight would identify if it is the problem. Does it feel like it may be full of water?

Another thing to check is whether the supply lines ( from globe to firewall) are clogged or melted in a way that plugged them. The line along the fenderwell will often get cracked .

 

[koda2000]

The check valve (wherever it's located) allows the ball to hold vacuum when the engine is not running, or is not producing much vacuum. The power brake booster also has a check valve to stop it from loosing vacuum back to the engine when it's turned off. This allows you to not instantly loose brake assist should the engine die. You typically get one stop before the assist is lost. The check valve for the vacuum reservoir/ball, while not as critical, works the same way.

There's no reason you can't bypass the ball as a test. You should see max vacuum with the engine idling.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

When I took the globe out there were no rattles or water. I took the syringe and tried to take air out and put air in of the line between fire wall and globe to no avail, wouldn't budge either way. I did make a visual inspection of that line and did not see any thing that would register as wrong. I have not checked for clogging as I did not know they could do that. That might explain why though as why I could not take air out or in on that particular stretch of line. Do you think mating them up directly would work? after I find whether or not it is clogged.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

Thank you for the input on the check valve as I was thinking it could have gotten stuck and although vacuum is being held in the globe it may not be getting by the check valve, but through your explanation of the check valve, my thinking was wrong.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

My worst fears... The eatc head unit is bad. I went to auto zone and borrowed there vacuum pump and checked every line. Then disconnected the lines from the back of the eatc and tested all of those, they all held pressure very well. Hooked up the pump to the black line input on the eatc and it would not hold anything. I just replaced those little o rings so I am sure those are good. The eatc unit displays the temp, actuates the blend door and gives heat, well a little anyway. I can't get the eatc to engage those dam little pumps so any ideas other then the obvious?

 

[CDW6212R]

Well that sounds difficult, finding a repair service for the EATC, or trying another used one. I have two myself that I got from the JY in hopes of using as a spare and to change to blue. It's complicated too, because the 98+ have a different kind of electronics in them, like the pulse width modulation versus relays. I don't think it's easy to swap across those models. Hopefully an experienced service business will know.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

yeah, I don't think I am going to have much luck in doing any of that because of the age of the units, do they even put those units in anything anymore? I have contacted ped5stang to see if he has a working one and he has one for 70 shipped but never said if it worked or not and I need it to be tested first to see if it works first before I buy, otherwise I would just be throwing my money away on another possibly dead unit. I may have to get my manual controls out and see if I can hook it up so that it works with the existing wires, can't hurt anything to try I guess. Need to do something now as rain and cold are coming.
Robert

 

[CDW6212R]

I hear that. I'm going to hopefully be able to test the one or two I have, in my existing trucks. The older 96/97 units are the ones I can't readily check. I want to also see if I can find a way to retrofit one of these, into my older 91 Lincoln. They are both EATC, but much different in wiring and vacuum controls. I doubt it can be done, but I'd love to get it done. I have a source to fix the older Mark VII electronics, but I don't know if the man has ever worked with the later stuff.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

ask him if he can or knows someone who can if you would, if just for the group knowledge base as I am sure I am not the only one that could use one getting fixed. I love working on my truck but I am getting just a little bit sick,, of working eatc because there is so much to go wrong with these units it is almost not worth it, I did say almost! Thanks
Robert

 

[CDW6212R]

I will see if he can do anything with these. His name is Paul Protos, he's a good man who has helped many people on the Mark VII forum. He works on all of those cars radios, EATC, compass(like ours), the message center, and CD changers, JBL amp. Those I know he fixes. I need him to rebuild two of my message centers(called trip computers in those), and the overhead compass for sure. The capacitors fail in those at this age.

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

Once I get the "new to me eatc unit" I will get my micro-scope out and look at the old board if no one is able to fix these things, just to see if I can spot any anomalies. I'm hopeful so that I can have a spare. In the mean time I will get my freshly downloaded eatc manual out and see what it would take to hook up the manual knobs.
Robert

 

[LoquetusofBorg]

Well got the "new to me eatc unit" yesterday and stuck it in today.....Nothing. So my problem is one that requires magic or something. does anyone have any suggestion that might help?
Robert

 

[CDW6212R]

I'm sorry to hear that, diagnosing something that is part of a wiring change is harder than in an existing system. The problem could easily be some of the wiring that has changed, or existed in the previous vehicle the wiring and parts came from.

It'd be easier if you could test the parts in a proper working EATC vehicle, a 98-01 Explorer or same model types.