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Pats


TestPoint

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Lets start over . . . .

I just spent over 2 hour setting on the bottom of a mud bucket going through the SCT 3015 programming.

Here is the sequence of events:

Program Vehicle - select
Custom Tune - select
Adjust Additional options - no - select
Program with Custom Tune - select
Begin Program
Error 1019 - Unlock ECM failed
Download failed - turn key off -

I did this several times and am now convinced that the tuner device is not uploading the tune at all and never has. I did this with and without the PATS module. Back to pin out continuity testing.

The Data Port communicates between the PCM and multiple OBDII tools including the SCT device. There are only 6 wires to deal with, 2 ground, 2 data buss, a 'hot at all times' B+ and the a 'Reprogramming Power Supply'. The Data Link + and - connections must be valid as they read from the PCM. There is permanent B+ on the Data Port connector pin 16 as it should be. That leaves only one wire . . . the 'Reprogram Power Supply'. Now that seems like a likely candidate for a screw up! I have verified that the pin 13 of the Data Port connector is, indeed connected to pin 13 of C202, the PCM connector.

Had a moment of serious concern when I discovered that the pin 13 wire (violet) had a twin violet wire associated with the AC controls to the PCM. Fortunately, even a blind pig will find a acorn occasionally and I had used the correct violet wire.

Upload of the custom tune still fails consistently.
 

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TestPoint

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I have down loaded and reloaded the stock tune several times based on what is displayed on the little screen. Somehow I suspect that the stock tune is never leaving the PCM even though the device seems to indicate that it does.

The 3015 allows me to select from two copies of the same custom tune with different names when attempting to upload the tune so I would assume that the custom tune is, indeed, resident on the device.

It then gives me an error report that the down load failed.
 


Dono

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So, 'Unlock ECM Failed'. What does that mean?

Does the SCT device think its paired to a different ECM?
ECM Wiring?
ECM Faulty?
Faulty SCT?
 


2000StreetRod

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stock tune to computer

Have you saved the stock tune to your computer? That's a good idea in case your programmer should fail. You can check the file size on your computer. All of the tunes (stock and custom) are the same size.

Did the PCM and PATS module come off the same vehicle?
 


TestPoint

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"Does the SCT device think its paired to a different ECM?"
The SCT device clearly states that it is dealing with a 5.0L Explorer with the correct stock tune ID.

"ECM Wiring?"
I have done pin out continuity tests to the point that I would not recognize a wiring error if I saw it.

"ECM Faulty?"
How do you definitively determine that?
"Faulty SCT?"
How do you definitively determine that?

Thanks for your comments!
 
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TestPoint

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2000StreetRod

"Have you saved the stock tune to your computer? That's a good idea in case your programmer should fail. You can check the file size on your computer. All of the tunes (stock and custom) are the same size."

No, not sure how to do that.

"Did the PCM and PATS module come off the same vehicle? "

No they did not. They are not synced.
 


2000StreetRod

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PATS wiring

SCT has reviewed James' tune and confirms that PATS is turned off in software. James has been doing this too long to have it turn out any other way.

I have done connector to connector continuity test so many times I have little faith that I am going to find anything new. If you will check out this link you will see the detail that I have gone to in building the wiring harness.

http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=250604

I have all the Ford electrical drawings and an education and work experience in electronics so this is not some mysterious subject.

The electrical drawing for what I have done can be found here:

http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=250746

There is certainly the very valid possibility that this is a wiring error but it is beyond me to find it at the moment.

I appreciate everyone's efforts to help me solve this.
I didn't see any PATS wiring in the above threads. You mentioned two grounds. What did you ground besides pin 7 (570)?
 


TestPoint

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Multiplex Communications Port Schematics

Here are the drawings I am relying on:

fordelectricaldataportpage14-1_5-001.jpg



This shows two grounds. I did not use the pin 7 (ISO 9141) as it goes to the body modules that don't exist on the Volvo.

fordelectricaldataportobdii_4-001.jpg
 
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TestPoint

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Since I do not have the transceiver module it is wired to ground on pin 7, perm B+ on pin 15, switched b+ on pin 16 and the two data links, circuits 914 and 915.
 




2000StreetRod

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remote possibility

I vaguely remember a thread about someone who was working on his Explorer and disconnected one of the crash sensors. After the work was completed he forgot to reconnect the crash sensor and the engine would not start. I'll have to search for the thread to learn the symptoms. The Restraints Control Module (RCM) communicates with the PCM via the OBDII bus. Ask James if there is a way to turn off the RCM function.
 


TestPoint

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Did you confirm that the PCM and the PATS module were from the same vehicle?
The PCM and PATS module are not synced or 'married'.

After the work was completed he forgot to reconnect the crash sensor and the engine would not start.
I think my problem is upstream from the 7 modules that the PCM module communicates with.

Restrains Control Module (RCM)
Generic Electronic Module (GEM)
4 Wheel Anti-Lock Brakd System Module (4WBS)
Remote Anti-Theft Personality Module (RAP)
Driver Seat Module (DSM)
Parking Aid Module (PAM)
Air Suspension Control Module (ARC)

James is going to have to turn off all of those in order to end up with a CEL that is not on all the time.

I see no indication that the SCT 3015 is uploading the PATS removed tune to the PCM.

The device seems to communicate fine with the PCM just won't upload a custom tune. I can read OBDII codes, check the VIN and recover the Ford strategy number. I have verified continuity from the Data Port to the C202 for the circuit 107 'Reprogramming Power'. This morning I am going to try to measure the voltage on that lead from the SCT device while trying the program sequence. Who knows what I should expect to see on that circuit.

Since all the auto manufacturers have moved to a component replacement strategy there is little documentation as to how circuits function.

After that the next action is to drive over to Hueytown, AL to see if James can program my PCM with my 3015 device.
 


TestPoint

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For the last time . . .

. . . I have verified continuity from the Data Port Connector to the PCM.

C941 Data Link Connector

Pin 2 (circuit 914) is connected to C202 pin 16 SCP Data Bus (+)
Pin 4 (circuit 57) is connected to ground
Pin 5 (circuit 570) is connected to ground
Pin 10 (circuit 915) is connected to C202 pin 15 SCP Data Bus (-)
Pin 13 (circuit 107) is connected to C202 pin 13 Reprogramming Pwr Supply
Pin 16 (circuit 693) is connected to B+ (hot at all times)

I have also verified that there is:
Keep alive power on C202 pin 55
Ignition switched 'run' power on pins 71 and 97
Grounds on pins 24, 25, 76, 77 and 103

The SCT 3015 will read DTC's and read the PCM strategy number so it would appear that the device is communicating with the PCM and that it is being powered by the car. When attempting to program the pin 13 is reading 17.92v, apparently from the SCT device. Those are the only 4 connections between the device and the PCM. The device goes through all the programming steps which I follow like a religious chant and it tells me to turn off the ignition.

The device is never loading the Custom Tune onto the PCM.

When I go to 'Read DTC' / 'Vehicle Info' it tells me that the strategy is the the original Ford number. Also, it will attempt to transfer each of the custom tunes without prompting me to return to original first.

Suggestions?
 
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Dono

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Sorry for interjecting, as I don't have any experience dealing with pats. My info is just based on my electronics knowledge from many years ago.

The question would be, what would stop the pcm from taking the new program? If there's power to the pcm, and the data port is connected properly, shouldnt the SCT be able to force the pcm into programming mode?

Sounds like this issue needs to be resolved before looking at the other inputs.

Can gou get another ecm and try flashing it? Is the SCT currently locked? If so, to what pcm? How do we confirm this?

I am starting to think the SCT device security might be causing an issue. Again, sorry for interjecting again, but the issue might be staring you right in the face and your looking too deep.
 


TestPoint

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I appreciate any questions that lead to a solution!

The question would be, what would stop the pcm from taking the new program?
I have no idea. I have spent an inordinate amount of time understanding the Ford electrical system and I am out of ideas as to what might be incorrect in the wiring. If you look at the link to the electrical section of the 'Volvo's That Run' manual you can see the level of detail I have been through.

I see 4 pieces of this puzzle: the wiring, the PCM, the SCT 3015 device and the Custom Tune by Henson Performance.
Is the SCT currently locked?
Not sure. The device shows a 5.0L Explorer but the original Ford strategy is resident on the PCM. With the original strategy on the PCM it should be able to lock to another vehicle.

How do we confirm this?
Not sure. If you have any experience with the SCT product then you must know that documentation is severely lacking.

I have copied the previous message to the string of messages between SCT Tech Support and myself. We will see what they have to say Monday.

If I knew anyone that would trust me to load a tune onto their '98 to '05 Ford V8 perhaps we could resolve some questions but I do not. Without a solution from SCT Tech Support I plan on driving 200 miles with my SCT device and PCM to Henson Performance to let James try it. He has a '98 Explorer.

Keep asking questions!
 


CDW6212R

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I like that Volvo project, and I expect it to turn out great.

I plan to sometime soon convert my 91 Lincoln To OBDII, using the 96-97 PCM and lots of Mustang/Explorer wiring.

I watch the PATS thread here, and there was a different member posting there recently who knew more about the varying Ford PATS systems. I suggest finding and reading that thread, the last part mainly, and contacting that member in case he can help.

I tend to think the use of a PATS module which isn't married to the PCM as the issue. I would expect that it isn't needed, but maybe when a PATS PCM first sees an improper PATS module, it locks the PCM from accepting new programming etc. I have a friend, Ford tech at a local dealer, who knows most of the general procedures of the PATS etc.

Your project with a different vehicle system/PATS/key/program, may have created the condition there now. The questions are many of course, is it the individual devices, or the combination of certain different ones, or a circuit failure or being miss-wired.

Keep at it, I like these kinds of projects.
 


TestPoint

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I said I wouldn't . . .

. . . but I did anyway.

I went back and pushed pins through all the critical wires on the C202 connector.

I am getting 12v on pin 55, keep alive power, ignition sw 'run' power on pin 71 and 97 that are spliced on the PCM side of the C115 connector.

Getting grounds on 24, 25, 76, 77, and 103.

Unless someone can tell me that I overlooked something that it for wiring testing.

Restored the PCM to stock and tried to reload the custom tune. Everything you would expect to happened on the little screen happened. No cigar.

Getting B+ at injector red lead, no ground on the other . . . no start.
 

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RangerSVT

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You have a couple possibilities, and things you can try. First, the fpr (fuel pump relay), it is grounded by the ecu ONLY when pats has been satisfied. Cut this wire from the ecu and ground it (this is common on 01+ ranger V8 swaps). The ex has a type B pats, which means the key sends a signal to the transceiver, the transceiver sends it to the transponder (aka pats module) then the transponder sends it to the ecu. Second, it is possible your tuner malfunctioned during uploading at the dealer. However, since you said that SCT has been contacted, this might not be the case (still a possibility though, I've seen tuners improperly uploaded twice, but take it a third time). You say the fpr fired after tuning several times, this leads me to believe your ecu may be faulty. What I would do is verify that your wiring is intact by hooking up a known working pre-pats ecu (96-97 ex V8 ecu). If it starts and runs, odds are your ecu is bad. Also, if the tuner successfully deletes pats, your theft light will not flash, blink, or illuminate after the key is turned on. If it does, there is an issue with the uploaded tune...

SVT
 


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