Rebuilt Transmission 4R55E STILL HAVE MANY PROBLEMS!

[1992fordgreen]

Could it be the torque converter? A friend mentioned that as a possibility but the trans rebuilderr guy said he tested it as much as he could and it was fine. This guy was VERY confident in his work...I have a feeling it is something to do with wiring...

 

[1992fordgreen]

The only thing left I can do is drop the pan and hope that something fell out...how am I ever going to get this Explorer working?

I have never seen this before where the trans has been rebuilt and still has problems like this...

 

[1992fordgreen]

Going to take it for one more drive, then flush the cooler lines and tranny cooler, drop the pan, and see what i can find. If all else fails, i'll replace shift solenoid B.

 

[arco777]

So the trans guy "replaced" the valve body, why? You might have to take it apart yourself. I am wondering if he installed an incorrect valve body. There are many year to year and model specific differences. Valve springs change, the valves themselves change, check balls, and so on. The valve body is so crucial to the transmission, I would never swap a valve body unless I was 100% certain I had an exact replacement and even then I would compare the two. I would suggest ordering a shift correction kit such as a Transgo one. These kits include instructions that lay out exactly what everything should look like, where check balls should be, and so on. Also if the wrong springs were installed, the correction kit will replace most of them anyways. Another consideration is if the valve body was installed with new gaskets and bolts were all torqued to spec. I know on the A4LD not all the bolts are the same length; in fact there are 4 different lengths. Crummy rebuilders will not always know this and end up damaging things; too long a bolt and it may not snug up applying clamping force to the valve body. Also a torque wrench MUST be used when installing the bolts; too much force will distort the valve body and can cause sealing problems, and even crack the valve body. Plus you have to use a new gasket for the separator plate and valve body, and you have to clean all the old gasket material off too. Long story short, there are far too many things that could go wrong with the valve body to entrust it to someone who is flaky or not 150% careful and thorough with their work. If you want it done right you may have to do it yourself. I rebuilt both my Explorer's valve bodies with correction kits and have had no problems since, despite it being my first time doing trans work. Just being careful is enough.

 

[1992fordgreen]

So the trans guy "replaced" the valve body, why? You might have to take it apart yourself. I am wondering if he installed an incorrect valve body. There are many year to year and model specific differences. Valve springs change, the valves themselves change, check balls, and so on. The valve body is so crucial to the transmission, I would never swap a valve body unless I was 100% certain I had an exact replacement and even then I would compare the two. I would suggest ordering a shift correction kit such as a Transgo one. These kits include instructions that lay out exactly what everything should look like, where check balls should be, and so on. Also if the wrong springs were installed, the correction kit will replace most of them anyways. Another consideration is if the valve body was installed with new gaskets and bolts were all torqued to spec. I know on the A4LD not all the bolts are the same length; in fact there are 4 different lengths. Crummy rebuilders will not always know this and end up damaging things; too long a bolt and it may not snug up applying clamping force to the valve body. Also a torque wrench MUST be used when installing the bolts; too much force will distort the valve body and can cause sealing problems, and even crack the valve body. Plus you have to use a new gasket for the separator plate and valve body, and you have to clean all the old gasket material off too. Long story short, there are far too many things that could go wrong with the valve body to entrust it to someone who is flaky or not 150% careful and thorough with their work. If you want it done right you may have to do it yourself. I rebuilt both my Explorer's valve bodies with correction kits and have had no problems since, despite it being my first time doing trans work. Just being careful is enough.

Thank you for your long descriptive response.

This rebuilder guy did know his stuff, especially 4r55e's and 5r55e's. He could have done it wrong I guess...when I looked in the valve body, everything looked perfect. Also something else I noticed, the tranny is good for the first 5-60 seconds. When it's warm/hot, thats when stuff acts up. If it WAS the VB, it would be bad consistintly. We got it to where it worked 99%. There was just a shift flare from 3-4 gear. I replaced the solenoid and now this mess came up.

Thnx

 

[masospaghetti]

How did you know the rebuilder knew his stuff? You said previously that's he's "basically ditched you" and that "you get what you pay for". Maybe it's worth the 45 minute drive to take it back to him.

 

[1992fordgreen]

How did you know the rebuilder knew his stuff? You said previously that's he's "basically ditched you" and that "you get what you pay for". Maybe it's worth the 45 minute drive to take it back to him.

He does this for a living. It cost me 400 dollars with the tran on bench delivered to him. The reason I don't want to bring the ex back to him is because he'll just wait one or two months to fix it and I don't want that!

Thnx for the reply

 

[1992fordgreen]

Update: (No, I'm not gonna stop updating until the tranny is fixed!)

Took it for a drive (schedule has been crammed) and it drove like usual, very driveable, but obviously something wrong. O/D light started flashing in 5 minutes. CEL turned on in 5 minutes. The first 5 minutes of the drive the trans worked perfectly...weird.

I pulled the code again and I got 1 code. Shift Solenoid C (Performance or stuck off). This is the solenoid I just replaced. Do you think the solenoid I got might have been faulty and/or not the right part? Well, thats what I think.

I'm going to put the old one back in, if I can locate it lol then see if the tranny does the same shift flare like before. Bands are adjusted to peak performance as well.

I really hope this is the issue.

Also, one more question to pick your brain. When I installed the tranny, I forgot to bolt this exhaust heat shield up to the trans. Would this affect any of these issues? Just thought I'd throw that out there. (Since it was when the tranny warmed up, it would go into limp mode)

I really hope this is the issue. If it's not, thats too bad. I'm so close with this hunk I cannot give up now.

Look at the pictures below to see the shield. I dont think it would cause any issues though.

Any answers are appreciated!

 

[PopRichie77]

Sorry but the shield is not your problem. It only keeps heat off the servos and would take a long time to do any damage.

 

[1992fordgreen]

Sorry but the shield is not your problem. It only keeps heat off the servos and would take a long time to do any damage.

That's what I thought. Do you have any more advice to shed on the subject? How long would it take for the shield to break the servo's?

Thanks. I'll report back here if and when I get the aformentioned subject swapped.

 

[Brett]

Servo's could be bad if the rebuilder did not replace. They are like $8 parts, so replace them.

Issues are most likely due to EPC circuit pressure issues in the valve body. When the trans warms us, the fluid viscosity changes, and valve clearances change. The 4R's / 5R's are known to have multiple valve body issues. Perform a wet/air test on the VB while VB is still bolted to the case. Will tell you where the VB may be leaking.

The VB should be gone through with a fine tooth comb. Very easy to mess up a plunger orientation, spring location, or retainer location.

Transgo and Superior kits are worthless for these valve body's. Use the Sonnax updates and Ford updates available for them.

Also find out what parts your rebuilder replaced in the trans. $400 is really cheap for parts/labor. Rebuilt VB's can cost over $400 alone. A typical quality rebuild for the A4LD/4R/5R will have $500-$600+ in parts, including a reman torque converter, frictions, steels, gaskets, seals, new bands, servo's, sonnax updates, Ford updates, etc. This doesn't count any hard parts that may need replaced. If the total parts/labor was $400, i can guarantee that the "rebuild" was skimped.

Brett

 

[arco777]

Transgo and Superior kits are worthless for these valve body's. Use the Sonnax updates and Ford updates available for them.

Are you sure on this point, or is this specifically about the 4R/5R? I installed the Transgo kits on both my A4LDs and was very happy with the improved performance.

 

[Brett]

Are you sure on this point, or is this specifically about the 4R/5R? I installed the Transgo kits on both my A4LDs and was very happy with the improved performance.

My experience with Transgo and Superior in the 4R/5R has not been that good. Ford updated the separator plate and EPC relief valve around 2002. Sonnax has good products that address the valve body bore and pressure issues. Between the Ford and Sonnax updates they work very well together. The Transgo and Superior kits came out well before 2002 to address 4R/5R issues, which have been addressed better now by Ford and Sonnax. (one thing to note, the Sonnax and Ford updates cost a lot more than the Transgo or Superior kits)

I've used the Transgo and Superior kits in the A4LD's. I always used both kits in the transmissions I built. These did work well in the A4LD's, along with the adjustable vacuum modulator. The A4LD is a bit more sensitive to shift timing, so these kits were useful to correct the shift points / firmness. Be sure to also use 5R bands when rebuilding the A4LD's. They are much stronger, have more surface area, and less prone to breakage.

Brett

 

[1992fordgreen]

Servo's could be bad if the rebuilder did not replace. They are like $8 parts, so replace them.

Issues are most likely due to EPC circuit pressure issues in the valve body. When the trans warms us, the fluid viscosity changes, and valve clearances change. The 4R's / 5R's are known to have multiple valve body issues. Perform a wet/air test on the VB while VB is still bolted to the case. Will tell you where the VB may be leaking.

The VB should be gone through with a fine tooth comb. Very easy to mess up a plunger orientation, spring location, or retainer location.

Transgo and Superior kits are worthless for these valve body's. Use the Sonnax updates and Ford updates available for them.

Also find out what parts your rebuilder replaced in the trans. $400 is really cheap for parts/labor. Rebuilt VB's can cost over $400 alone. A typical quality rebuild for the A4LD/4R/5R will have $500-$600+ in parts, including a reman torque converter, frictions, steels, gaskets, seals, new bands, servo's, sonnax updates, Ford updates, etc. This doesn't count any hard parts that may need replaced. If the total parts/labor was $400, i can guarantee that the "rebuild" was skimped.

Brett

This...this makes total sense...unfortunately. Before I undergo all of this crap, I'm gonna take the easy way first and put the old solenoid back in. I'm also going to call the rebuilder guy and ask him a few questions. Remember, this was on-bench.

Also, recall this I mentioned earlier...the transmission was 99% working fore TWO test drives that were well over 5 minutes after the bands were adjusted. The only issue was a "slow solenoid" that let the engine rev going from 3rd to 4th. That was it. Not a squat more than that. The code said to replace the shift solenoid C, so I did, and armegeddon broke loose.

Could you make any sense of this?

Thanks Brett...appreciate the reply(s)

 

[1992fordgreen]

Ok I have the pan down and the VB is exposed...what should I look for? I am going to swap the SS3 with the old one and see if I can at least get the Explorer back to where I had it before then go from there. I also have to get new tranny fluid (2nd time its been out) and in other news, the pan gasket broke in two.

Any thing I should look for while I have the pan down?

 

[1992fordgreen]

Any advice to be shed? JK or Poprichie?

 

[PopRichie77]

Make sure the wires inside the pan are good, also the connector on the outside. Be sure the brackets are holding the solenoids in all the way. You sure the valve body gaskets are good.

 

[JK080]

Maybe check for internal wire harness problems, check through the case connector and probe to the solenoid connector, maybe back probe from solenoid connector the PCM connector.

 

[1992fordgreen]

Make sure the wires inside the pan are good, also the connector on the outside. Be sure the brackets are holding the solenoids in all the way. You sure the valve body gaskets are good.

Ok, I'll check the wires. The connector on the outside was good, the bracket holding the 2 solenoids was fine, rebuilder guy said he replaced the VB gaskets. 200k on one, there's no going around that.

Thanks

 

[1992fordgreen]

Maybe check for internal wire harness problems, check through the case connector and probe to the solenoid connector, maybe back probe from solenoid connector the PCM connector.

Good idea, ill check that. Thanks!