Transmission flush 2003 Explorer?

[grabill68]

I have an 2003 XLT w 114,000 miles. I bought it with 50,000 miles about 5 years ago. I have never had the trans fluid serviced since I have had it. I have no idea if it was done by the previous owner. Is this something I should get done. Should I get a flush and filter change or just a flush? I hear differing theories on this. Anyone with experience on this? Thanks.

 

[Ocean Pacific]

I would definitely get it changed. With there being no dipstick, people often overlook it. I would try and avoid a flush however. Just have them drop the pan and replace the filter. By dropping the pan they'll be able to get out most of the fluid and clean whatever debris has collected there.

 

[Exproblems]

>>>>>>>>>>I have an 2003 XLT w 114,000 miles. I bought it with 50,000 miles about 5 years ago. I have never had the trans fluid serviced since I have had it. I have no idea if it was done by the previous owner. Is this something I should get done. Should I get a flush and filter change or just a flush? I hear differing theories on this. Anyone with experience on this? Thanks.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Grabill,

I would recommend a complete transmission fluid flush, including the torque converter, plus a filter and gasket change. With that many miles on it and you not knowing the history of maintenance or how it was used (towing etc), it makes sense to do it. If you decide to have the complete system flush (torque converter incl), you will need to have it done at a shop that has the specific type of transmission fluid flushing machine that is designed for flushing out these sealed Ford transmissions (no dipstick). Make sure to mention you want the torque converter flushed, because some of these fluid change places have machines that only do the tranmission and pan only, and don't have the right machine that can also do the torque converter. Most transmission shops should have this machine, the oil change quick lube places probably won't. From what I've heard, these machines cost around $4,000 and not every shop has one. BTW, the torque converter is considered the "trash can/dumping ground" for transmissions. It's where a lot of the worn out particles inside a transmission wind up besides what gets caught in the filter. In my area a complete system flush is around $139.00 -$169.00, you might be able to find a coupon or special deal if you look around. These trannys hold approx 12+ quarts of fluid, counting whats in the torque converter. Below is a web link you can research tranmission stuff at. I found it helpful when I needed to lookup some info on tranny issues I was having. Good luck.

http://www.aa1car.com/library/2003/ic60340.htm

 

[Pontisteve]

I should warn you that it's been my experience that sometimes, if a tranny has never had it's fluid changed, it can be a bad idea to start now. For example, I have 120k on mine, and I doubt the fluid has ever been changed. It's a real tossup as to whether or not this is a good idea. I have definitely seen in the past that cars that were just fine had their high mileage fluid changed for the first time, and magically a week or two later, the tranny failed.

Normally I would recommend getting input from your tranny shop about this, but that's problematic too. If they recommend you flush it, they stand to make money on the flush, and then they stand to make money if the tranny fails. Good for them, not so much for you. This is one of those ugly deals where you may have to decide for yourself or ask your mechanic friends what they think.

I've never been able to explain how in the hell changing old fluid for new stuff causes a tranny to go bad, but I know for sure this does sometimes happen. Those in the industry will be familiar with this age old argument, and I don't think anybody knows for sure.

I say if you have under 120k and it's never been done, I would maybe change the filter and the fluid in the trans only. Over 120k, I would start thinking this might not be a good recommendation. If you have under 70k, I would not worry and just do what you want. Maybe ask member Brooklyn Bay on this forum. He's a tranny guy.

 

[BrooklynBay]

Don't use a power flush machine on the transmission. They sometimes connect the lines backward, and push the junk out of the internal filter. This will cause issues with the transmission since these particles will clog everything up.

 

[Pontisteve]

Brooklyn Bay,

I have an 03 Explorer 4.6 4WD with 120k, and the tranny has probably never been serviced. What do you think, change the filter and pan fluid? Or just forget it entirely?

I've had mixed results with changing tranny fluids when it's never been done before, and the vehicle has some mileage on it.

 

[JoshMcMadMac]

Brooklyn Bay,

I have an 03 Explorer 4.6 4WD with 120k, and the tranny has probably never been serviced. What do you think, change the filter and pan fluid? Or just forget it entirely?

I've had mixed results with changing tranny fluids when it's never been done before, and the vehicle has some mileage on it.

Yep, drop the pan and replace the filter. Refill, then drive it a bit. You can drain/refill the pan a few times and get most of the old fluid out that way without a flush.

 

[BrooklynBay]

New fluid has strong detergents. You could strain the old fluid, and reuse it if you don't feel comfortable using fresh new fluid.

 

[1AJeremyD]

I would say because the transmissions of that era weren't the best made, If you are concerned with deterioration, I would recommend what Brooklyn recommended with just replacing the filter. The full system takes about 13quarts and the pan is just I believe is 4.5 quarts. Changing the filter would be your best bet overall

 

[Pontisteve]

Strong detergents, that degrade over time? Is THAT why we used to have the issue of changing an old 150k car's original tranny fluid, and suddenly the tranny goes bad? Those cars we used to have trouble with that in, they were an older variety of car. Do you think these newer cars born with Mercon 5 will fall prey to the same problem?

Can you buy tranny fluid (Mercon 5 now) that doesn't have these detergents?

Would you advise changing just the filter and the 4 or 5 quarts that you lose, and not worry about the detergent aspect? What would you do if it were your car?

One more thing... what exactly is it inside the tranny that this detergent is washing away, that would cause the trans to go bad? Is it some specific part you can point your finger at? I've always wondered about this!

 

[fedyfedz]

im about due for this as well, as to im not sure what the previous owner did or did NOT do. i will drop the pan and change filter and clean and crap out. My question is would it be worth changing over to synthetic tranny fluid? If so what should I use, i have 2002 limited v8 with 100k.....

 

[1AJeremyD]

The thing with transmission fluids today is they all have detergents. The point of detergents is to keep the transmission clean and lubricated and reduce the stress of the internals. The transmission has bands inside that are like a brake pad. They spin around freely until the solenoid is engaged and clamps down on them. If the solenoid does not pressurize properly the bands slip and create heat which then breaks down the fluid more. Its a viscous cycle of slipping and heating. The foaming agents in the transmission fluid help keep the fluid from bubbling. Bubbles in fluid does nothing for pressurizing anything.

 

[BrooklynBay]

Clutch packs have a bonded paper surface that eventually wears down over time. The detergents might remove some of this material on an old transmission. Transmission additives such as Lucas cause seals, and gaskets to swell, and make a tigher bond until they eventually goes back to their original size.

 

[Pontisteve]

Im not a big fan of using additives to rig things, but for years when I was in the car business, it was well known that Lucas tranny additive saved some trannies from having to be rebuilt. It seemed like the swelling that it caused didn't seem to go away too fast.

I had a chrysler V6 car I added Lucas to, to aleve a complaint about not engaging reverse until you gave it a little gas. Once you did give it gas, the added pressure overcame a leaking seal and it would bang into gear. A Lucas treatment and some driving around fixed it up, and the car ran like that for years. Again, I hate additives, but I sure am fond of Lucas tranny additive, after it saved my butt many times in the car biz.

So it's the detergent that's causing the old trannies to die after a fluid change. Finally, a reason! I've always wondered about that. Next question, how can I tell when this is gonna be a problem? My 03 Explorer with 120k for example. How would I know if it's a good idea or not, to change the fluid and filter?

 

[neilpridenz]

Just about to get my 2004 Explorer XLT with 95k on the clock in for a pan drop, clean out, new filter and valve body gasket (doing harsh shift into reverse). Never been touched since new.

Mechanic says removing valve body helps drain most of the torque converter fluid too, leaving about 3 quarts in the system ie 25%. He recommended not to try and get all the fluid out for the same reasons already discussed.

I figure I will run it for a few weeks like that and drain the pan from plug (simple!) and replace what comes out with new.

Depending on how fresh the fluid looks then I may repeat one more time. By the end I reckon I should only have <10% old fluid and gunk circulating which has to be way better than it is now. Also no shock to the system by sudden changes of all fluid.

See how it goes. Mainly want to fix the harsh shift but keen to avoid expensive tranny rebuild which seems all to common according to this forum...

 

[JoshMcMadMac]

My question is would it be worth changing over to synthetic tranny fluid?

Mercron 5 is synthetic.

Im not a big fan of using additives to rig things, but for years when I was in the car business, it was well known that Lucas tranny additive saved some trannies from having to be rebuilt. It seemed like the swelling that it caused didn't seem to go away too fast.

I agree 100% about Lucas transmission additive. It has help a few vehicles I know of last a long time after the transmission was thought to be on its last legs. Be careful with these transmissions, though; I tossed some Lucas into a 5R55S and it drove funky for about 100 miles. The codes for the solenoid came on, and the stall converter seemed to engage a bit higher. It runs like a champ now, but I would be careful of doing it again.

Mechanic says removing valve body helps drain most of the torque converter fluid too, leaving about 3 quarts in the system ie 25%.

Dropping the valve body will have no impact on the fluid in the converter. Pulling the valve body and letting everything drain off is good for 7-8 quarts, which is about half of the capacity.

 

[Pontisteve]

I don't plan on putting Lucas in my tranny unless it starts acting up, and I have nothing to lose. My truck is symptom free at 120k, which to me seems surprising, given the other posts here.

Pro's... how long do these 5R55s trannies usually last?

One thing I don't really like about my Explorer is the torque management for the tranny. The thing shifts like a wet noodle. There is an awful long, yet probably correct, pause between shifts when the vehicle is warm. Being an EFI tuner, I know this is in the calibration on the upshifts, when warm. I have SCT software for modifying this, yet I know better than to remove all torque management. On the GM 4L60E's, that is a real good way to wipe out a tranny, since the tranny can't hold up to the amount of torque the LS engines have. I don't know if that is as big of an issue on Fords, but either way if I modify the torque management in my tune, I won't remove it entirely.

Any pros got any experience with the effects of removing torque management vs longevity on Fords?

 

[grabill68]

So what if i dont change the filter or fluid in my tranny. It runs good now at 116,00 miles without it being serviced before. Am I playing with fire?

 

[BrooklynBay]

Automatic transmissions require clean fluid to run. Just because it's fine now doesn't mean that it will never need to be serviced in the future.

 

[Pontisteve]

Ford says it's serviced for life.
It uses Mercon V, a synthetic fluid.
It is filtered, and since there is no external dipstick, it can't easily be contaminated.

Despite all that, I still feel that it generally never hurts to do oil changes. But I'm conflicted in this case, because installing fresh tranny fluid, in my experience, can sometimes cause a good tranny to go bad. Apparently, the fresh detergent in the fluid can wipe out weak clutch material?

So what to do at 120k with a virgin tranny. Change the fluid, or not?