Using cardboard in front of radiator???

[Premier]

I still don't think cardboard is necessary unless it's below about -20. It was -12 this morning here and my truck was putting heat out within 4 miles or so of driving, without letting it warm up any. It ran fine, went up to temp just fine. My gas mileage has gone down maybe .5 mpg since it got this cold.

when i was in montana, it was about -30 at night and below 10* in the day. i didnt use any cardboard, and my gas mileage was the same. truck heated up fine.

 

[IZwack]

I used a piece of plastic cardboard (ones used in those "For Sale" signs) between the core support and the grille of my van to keep the dual heater cores hot. While driving around local roads (on the highway it was fine), the back core wouldnt get as warm as the front until the cardboard was added.

 

[JDraper]

Ok im not arguing but if you have ever seen horsepower tv then youd know that they did a dyno test on a stock 350fi motor and it made about 11 more horsepower on 93 than on 87.

That's because you can advance the timing farther with a higher octane gas before you get detonation. For a STOCK VEHICLE you are blowing $$ out the gas using a higher octane than necessary. If you re-tune the motor you can take advantage of higher octane because you can increase the timing without getting detonation, which is exactly what they are doing on the motor you reference.

Some of us on here are quite familiar with motors and how they operate...............

 

[99XplorerGuy73]

Just thought id let everyone know I ran my tank down to empty and filled it up with regular, I crunched the nimbers and I averaged 14mpg. Thats even with all the playin in the new snow we got here today. I dont really know why for the last 2 tanks my mileage was crappy but this last one is a huge increase. Im happy

 

[Willard]

That's much better, well along the lines of acceptable.

 

[97 Eddie Bauer v8]

Just thought id let everyone know I ran my tank down to empty and filled it up with regular, I crunched the nimbers and I averaged 14mpg. Thats even with all the playin in the new snow we got here today. I dont really know why for the last 2 tanks my mileage was crappy but this last one is a huge increase. Im happy

I wish I got 14mpg. In my '97 AWD v8 I average 11-12 and I drive like a legally blind 100-year-old great great great grandmother who is currently suffering a syncopal episode (aka I don't take her over 2,500 RPM). People get really impatient with me and are glued to my assho'. I realize this can be bad for carbon buildup but it breaks my heart to beat her.

Anyway I do have a CEL - "o2 sensor out-of-range" so I'm hoping that is what is contributing to my poor gas mileage and replacing the sensor with a quality Ford part resolves it.

Figured I'd hijack the already hijacked thread a little since the OH (original hijacker) found a resolution.

 

[glfredrick]

I wish I got 14mpg. In my '97 AWD v8 I average 11-12 and I drive like a legally blind 100-year-old great great great grandmother who is currently suffering a syncopal episode (aka I don't take her over 2,500 RPM). People get really impatient with me and are glued to my assho'. I realize this can be bad for carbon buildup but it breaks my heart to beat her.

Anyway I do have a CEL - "o2 sensor out-of-range" so I'm hoping that is what is contributing to my poor gas mileage and replacing the sensor with a quality Ford part resolves it.

Figured I'd hijack the already hijacked thread a little since the OH (original hijacker) found a resolution.

Note that your o2 out of range may not be a bad o2 sensor! It may be that the reading it is sending to the computer is simply out of acceptable range. That may be from lugging the vehicle so much and fouling the converter. Wind it up once in a while -- get that converter hot so it can burn off the crud and see if your o2 reading gets back into specs.

 

[97 Eddie Bauer v8]

Note that your o2 out of range may not be a bad o2 sensor! It may be that the reading it is sending to the computer is simply out of acceptable range. That may be from lugging the vehicle so much and fouling the converter. Wind it up once in a while -- get that converter hot so it can burn off the crud and see if your o2 reading gets back into specs.

I will give that a shot, but it's bank 1 sensor 1 - isn't that BEFORE the cat?

 

[GaryR13G]

Yes this is true, because the computer could advance the timing more with the higher octane fuel, thus making more power. It cannot advance the timing on the lower octane fuel because the motor will start to ping(pre-detonate) because lower octane fuels will ignite faster under compression. I will agree that you may get more power/ low end torque from a higher grade fuel, but it is not because it is "more explosive." I know on my LS1 trans am I can hook an OBD II reader to the car, and see the amount of timing advance it uses. It has multiple maps depending on the fuel you use, and it will use up to 10* less timing advance on 87 fuel, compared to 93 octane.

Anyway, this thread has gone off topic.

I hope you can see an improvement in your fuel mileage. Cleaning your mass airflow sensor can help too. It's fairly easy to do.

-Gary

 

[CDW6212R]

The O2 sensors for the SOHC and 302 are about $50 each from online sources. I'm about to replace one for my SOHC.

Try running an open thermostat on the highway at temps below 10 degrees. That will get your attention.

 

[jahna]

if your temp gauge is only raising 1/4 way you need a new thermostat. Your truck wil run alot better, in the temp range it is supposed to.

 

[bluestream1]

sorry....... 93 is less explosive than 87, octane rating is the amount of heat a fuel will take before pre-detonation( resistance to knock) the higher the rating the less the performance and harder to burn, the less the number the easier to burn.go to low and the fuel burns up when it hits the hot surfaces of the combustion chamber before TDC is reached, go to high and the fuel doesn't burn before it leaves the cylinder and you loose power and end up wearing out your catalytic converter earlier to boot.

Well said; this man knows what he is talking about. It still Amazes me how many people think Premium fuel has more energy in it.

 

[bluestream1]

Cardboard is a great thing in the winter time, but NEVER block off the entire radiator.

The fan needs to have the ability to pull air so it doesn't suck the bearings out of the water pump. Cut a hole about the size of a 5 gallon pail in the center of the cardboard and all is good.

I am not sure how the fan could "suck" the bearings out of the waterpump? In cold weather the fan bearly even turns due to the viscus coupling. It is designed that way as the fan is not needed in cold weather.

 

[glfredrick]

I am not sure how the fan could "suck" the bearings out of the waterpump? In cold weather the fan bearly even turns due to the viscus coupling. It is designed that way as the fan is not needed in cold weather.

Fans connected to the engine are supported by the water pump bearings. When they pull against a wall (which is created when the radiator cannot flow air) they will destroy the bearings. The fan is litterally trying to pull itself out of the water pump. If it can move air, this is mitigated.

As for the fan not spinning, if one runs cardboard, the engine runs warmer, and the fan will run at times. Probably not as big a problem in this age of viscouous couplings on fans, but still a problem.

I've seen this problem multiple times on various types of vehicles with and without viscouous couplers on the fans. The latest for me was when I packed my radiator solid with mud on the 'Sploder and it cost me the water pump within a couple hours.

 

[bluestream1]

If the fan runs behind a cardboard barrier there is no air to pull on, and no load. It is basicaly running in a vacuum and spinning freely. Even with a cardbard shield the air temp at the viscus coupling will be much the same as the out side temp. This is due to the air that will flow up from below the vehicle when it is in motion. The fan will just free flow in cold weather as it is designed to do wether the cardboard is there or not.

 

[CDW6212R]

Fans connected to the engine are supported by the water pump bearings. When they pull against a wall (which is created when the radiator cannot flow air) they will destroy the bearings. The fan is litterally trying to pull itself out of the water pump. If it can move air, this is mitigated.

As for the fan not spinning, if one runs cardboard, the engine runs warmer, and the fan will run at times. Probably not as big a problem in this age of viscouous couplings on fans, but still a problem.

I've seen this problem multiple times on various types of vehicles with and without viscouous couplers on the fans. The latest for me was when I packed my radiator solid with mud on the 'Sploder and it cost me the water pump within a couple hours.

You are correct, and he clearly is not comprehending.

If the fan isn't being moved by the water pump, then no damage will occur. If the fan is being run due to the fan clutch engaging, a lack or an air source will cause the fan great restriction. Air doesn't magically get in front of a fan, these vehicles with a shroud only allow air through the radiator. Sucking(creating) a vacuum takes a lot of energy, the forces will increase loads on the fan clutch and water pump bearings. Regards,

 

[ericautopart]

FYI for all you gas nuts i just did the o2 sensors on mine and i got an extra 100 miles out of the last tank.

 

[hazmat456]

FYI for all you gas nuts i just did the o2 sensors on mine and i got an extra 100 miles out of the last tank.

100 extra, what were you getting before? I only get 225 to a full tank with 31/10.5 tires. never corrected the speedometer though , so actual mileage is a little off.

 

[offroadjosh]

i run cardboard covering my whole grill and even then(15 or so outside sometimes a lot cold sometimes a little warmer) but even then my temp never get fully to the center it sits just below the little temp icon thing.... and at best if im super careful i can get 190miles out of a tank.. 4.0SOHC

 

[hazmat456]

You are correct, and he clearly is not comprehending.

If the fan isn't being moved by the water pump, then no damage will occur. If the fan is being run due to the fan clutch engaging, a lack or an air source will cause the fan great restriction. Air doesn't magically get in front of a fan, these vehicles with a shroud only allow air through the radiator. Sucking(creating) a vacuum takes a lot of energy, the forces will increase loads on the fan clutch and water pump bearings. Regards,

just to clear things up a bit. the bearings aren't actually sucked out, but the increased load,from the vacuum of the fan,equal to maybe 30 pounds or more pulling on the water pump shaft, destroys the bearings. They stay there unless of course, vibrations from the bad bearings cause the fan to wobble causing the casting to break throwing the fan into the radiator spewing hot coolant everywhere , then I would say that the bearings got sucked out.