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V8 Swap offically started today

NICE59FORDF100

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I'm going to throw my $.02 in here as I feel im qualified to answer (having done a 5.0 swap in a job 1 ST, a job 2 sport, and a 98 eddie bauer)

The donor 98 has 3.55 Limited Slip with disc brakes rear end.

are you sure about this? pretty sure all v8's came with 3.73 ratio

as far as pats...the best option for any swap is the have the original keys to the vehicle programmed to the different pcm...trust me, it prevents a lot of headaches. second gen PATS explorers (98-01) use 4 components to PATS:

Key with RFID chip
Key transceiver (antenna)
Pats Module
PCM

the transceiver "sees" the key, sends the RFID number to the pats module over the SCP data network, then the pats module sends a yay/nay signal to the pcm telling it to either start (correct key) or disable the injectors (wrong key)... Tying the old key to the transceiver is a bad idea because

A) defeats the purpose of having PATS (to prevent theft)
B) could cause RFID interference between two pats keys, thus could cause no start P1260 codes and disabling the vehicle

If it's a job one ST, swap the 98 pcm over, and have the pats system reflashed to accept the ST keys (same style keys...easy way to tell is if the ST keys and the 98 keys look identical, you have job one. if the ST key is more oval shaped and does NOT look identical to 98 keys, you have job 2)

if you have Job 2 ST, you will need to swap over the pcm, and wire in the PATS module from the 98 to the ST (not hard to do, already done on my 2002 Sport 5.0). then get two new keys cut from your original ST keys in the style of the 98 and have them programmed. Job 2 keys are incompatible with 98-01 PATS

Now for the motor...obviously the engine and trans need swapped over, as well as the motor mounts, power steering cooler (and if Job 2 ST, the entire rack...reason is the power steering lines will not thread in and you will either need new lines custom made or swap over the rack), radiator and condenser, engine harness (more on electrical in a moment), exhaust from muffler forward. And since you have a 98 donor (which is a return type fuel system) you will need a returnless fuel rail from a 99-01 5.0 (probably from a junkyard). obviously all the front engine dress (water pump, brackets, ect). all the evap vacuum lines that are 5.0 specific. also the vacuum supply line that runs to the hvac control head will need swapped over as well as the accel cable and the cruise control module. you want to mimic everything in the engine bay of you ST to be that of your donor (except the fuel rail...easier to swap that then convert your fuel system to return style)


now wiring...you can actually use you SOHC engine BAY harness (the harness the wraps around the engine bay from the firewall) by moving some circuits around (im doing this from memory, so this is more a guide than instructions)

  • Yellow/white wire charging circuit
  • Dark Green/white oil pressure circuit
  • a/c high side switch (in SOHC, part of engine harness, in 5.0, part of engine BAY harness
I think there a couple others, but can remember off top of my head. you will have to swap over the tach ground wire from behind the cluster to a different pin for the tach to work correctly. also the battery cable that connects to the fuse box will have to be ground down slightly to fit properly on the posts (the fuse box posts)

It's best to extend the bulkhead connector that sits on top of the engine 14 inches in order not to bind, as the 5.0 connector sits further to the passenger side on the firewall, as compared to the SOHC connector which is on the driver side of the engine


that's all I can think of at the moment, biggest thing is bite the bullet and have the pats system programmed properly so that way when everything is said and done, the truck runs, starts, and drives as designed, and even to a factory level. Ill close this with some inspiration:

1381816_10101140099877941_2598323960494218318_n1.jpg
 


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ttbit

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Always best to know what you are dropping in there. (engine-wise)
 




crispins

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Always best to know what you are dropping in there. (engine-wise)

Yea that is what I had originally planned on. I think I am feeling a bit overwhelmed with everything that needs to be done.

My goal from the beginning was to build a reliable, easy to work on, drive in any weather, does everything, good looking truck that I can have for many years.

Rebuilt motor
new radiator
all new hoses and soft lines

I am going to pull the motor out in the next couple of days and tear it down and see where I am at from there.

Thank you everyone for your input and help.

This is a BIG project for me and it helps a lot knowing that there are guys who have done this already and are going to help me get everything done correctly.
 




NICE59FORDF100

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Just take it slow, tackle each problem one at a time and don't be afraid to ask questions. Many of us have tackled this and completed them without much fanfare. It's easy enough that with all the parts ready to go, we (with help from kris guilbeaux of course) did a complete 5.0 swap in that 01 ST in 36 hours
 




crispins

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What do you guys think of this motor?

http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/item/LRS-6009E/79-95-Economy-50L-Mustang-Short-Block

It's a $1,000 with free shipping.

Yes it has cast pistons but I am not going to boost the motor or even really run it that hard.

That short block with my GT-40p heads does about 300 HP at the crank.

300 HP was my goal and this seems like a very easy and cost effective way to get there.

I'll have to spend around $400 - $500 to have my heads rebuilt. I do need to buy a cam as well or I could reuse mine I would think if it is in good shape still.
 




ttbit

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Why not have a machine shop look your engine over and give you an estimate? Plenty of folks in TN for this kind of thing. The ex cam is nothing to write home about either. It is made for low rpm torque and is very mild.
 




vroomzoomboom

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here is where i am going to sound like a ass. 300hp at the crank is going to take a lot more then a short block an p heads. if your cam isnt nicked anyplace, you can reuse it. roller cams normally dont wear like a flat tappet cam. or you can put a mustang cam in it with stock parts on your heads and be ok. but if you start going into a bigger lift cam, you will need better springs and whatnot
 




crispins

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here is where i am going to sound like a ass. 300hp at the crank is going to take a lot more then a short block an p heads. if your cam isnt nicked anyplace, you can reuse it. roller cams normally dont wear like a flat tappet cam. or you can put a mustang cam in it with stock parts on your heads and be ok. but if you start going into a bigger lift cam, you will need better springs and whatnot

I am basing that 300 off this info from a guy who has been running the engine for 4 years. He has 265 at the wheels which is around 300 at the crank.

"4 years and still going strong
By Jeff Brady on 10/20/2014
I blew-up my stock motor after a H/C/I swap. Being on a budget, I got the Economy Short Block from Late Model Restoration. I put the old GT40P heads and Cobra (replica) intake on, and went with a new E303 cam. It's been running great for 4 years and about 10K miles. 265HP/290TQ at the rear wheels through an AOD. Best bang for the buck out there."

He is running an "E" camshaft and a China made knock off intake
 




vroomzoomboom

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in an explorer? and did he have a dyno sheet? the reason why i ask is my old setup i had made around 255hp at the tires on a dyno and there was way more done to it then what he has listed.
 




crispins

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in an explorer? and did he have a dyno sheet? the reason why i ask is my old setup i had made around 255hp at the tires on a dyno and there was way more done to it then what he has listed.

He is in a Mustang but don't think that should make a difference.

I don't want to get hung up on HP.

My thoughts are I want to get this truck going.

I feel like buying a motor would be so much faster than having mine built. Plus mine is in bad shape. I expect when I go to get mine rebuilt there will be tons of extra expenses due to issues with my motor.

Buying a short block I know what the cost is going to be. I have $1,500 right now that I can spend on getting the motor going. I can buy a short block, toss in my cam, have the heads rebuilt. $1,500 and a couple of weeks I can be ready to instal into my Trac.
 




vroomzoomboom

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here are some things to consider that are different from a mustang vs. a explorer. the computer system is way different. a explorer isnt as easy to tune compared to a mustang. a mustang is 2wd only. most explorers are 4wd meaning everything not only has to be driven threw a transmission, but also a transfer case. even if its only in 2wd, it still have to go threw it. on a chassis dyno wheel height will also come into play. a taller tire takes more power to turn, and torque then a smaller one. explorers for the most part will have a taller tire. and lastly, and this is the one that really hurts all of us is the exhaust. most mustang guys will run either a 1 5/8 or 1 3/4 header. us, we have the tiny torque monsters. given, they are better then a stock manifold, but if i am not wrong, a mustang stock manifold is probably the same size as a torque monster header. once you add all of them up, there is a lot of power loss.
as for buying a short bock, why dont you take it to your machine shop and as them for a quote? it may not be as bad as you think, then also ask them how long it will take them to do it? that way you can decide if its worth redoing your motor vs. buying a new short block.
 




crispins

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So after buying a whole V8 Explorer donor and everything sitting untouched for 2 years I pad a shop to put a good running V6 in my truck.

I drove it today for the first time, I am very happy it runs but also very disappointed that I did not complete my swap I wanted so bad.
 




ttbit

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How much did it cost to have that v6 put in? Engine swaps are not for everyone. It is a ton of work, to do it correctly and complete. Don't feel bad about it, and enjoy your ST!!!

I'd be willing to sell my v8 ST, if you want one. :)
 




crispins

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It is a newer good motor with no chain rattle. Valve cover was removed to view guides.

$1,800 total including a 120 mile tow to the shop

I also got a new (used gas tank, pump)
 




ttbit

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Glad you got it back on the road.
 




N2FORD

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Glad you got the ST back on the road. Who did the work if you don't mind me asking?

My son's ST has developed the front chain rattle. So I am trying to decide whats next. I have it at a shop to verify what's wrong and if its only the front chain. If its only the front I might just get that done. If its both chains and since it has a head gasket leak I will probably replace the engine with a good used one. I did find a 100k V8 Mounty awd at the junkyard near me. Not sure if I want to go though all that again. Not sure if Rick would do it again for me, its over my head for sure.
 




crispins

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I found a great guy / shop in Sweetwater.
He does V8 swaps as well as he just finished one.
It is called 68 Car Care

It would be the first shop I have ever recommended in my life.

The owner is Mark.

This is the engine he put in.

00t0t_iibKGHk1enX_1200x900.jpg



I have no check engine lights, everything works perfect.

My a/c blows ice cold.

He really did a great job.
 




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