New James Duff Ex lift

[ThatFabGuy]

Figured I'd post this on this site in case some of you don't read TRS. Seems to be more Explorers over here so it prolly fits better on this site anyway.

Well it's been a while now(1437 miles actually) since I got the prototype JD 6" lift on my Explorer. Mostly road miles with a few mild off-raoding trips. Just thought I'd update and let you know how it's done so far.
For those that didn't see the original post, it's here. 35s on my Ex - The Ranger Station Forums

I started with this

After trading around a few times I ended up with some 35s. They dont fit as good as the 32s with no lift. I had been in talks with the crew at James Duff about doing a SAS kit for a while. They had some things in development and wanted me to try out a new TTB lift for them first. Here is the Ex rolling into their shop (had to trim the fenders to get it outta my garage and to them)

They tore it all apart and installed a new set of coil buckets that will accept either RBV coils or EB coils. The rest of the front end is the same as their Stage 1.5 kit.

Coil buckets

The rear is a new lift spring that uses the factory spring-under configuration to improve stability and reduce spring wrap.
This is it on their ramp. Not too impressive cuz my bumper was dragging going up the ramp and with only 2 wheel peel I didnt have enough to push it on up.

After I drove it home.

That's my stock Jeep Grand Cherokee sitting behind it to give an idea of height.
Ride and drive has been excellent. It has a better ride than when stock. Railroad crossings, speed bumps, and rough gravel roads are all soaked up like they are nothing. I look for reasons to get out of the house just so I can drive the thing (1400 miles in just over a month). The stance is great in traffic, big enough so people get out of your way but not so big that its tippy. If I were going to keep the setup, I'd prolly run 33" tires and be done with it. I plan on going to a SAS when this is done being tested so that's why I have the 35s. I have ZERO vibrations and the suspension doesn't make weird pops and groans.
Unfortunately I dont have any wheeling pix, I've either been by myself or not had a camera along. The only snaps I have are a couple poser shots I took while me and Jim were at Windrock yesterday.

And then it went BOOM! Or better yet,,POP, POP, POP, POP,nothing. About 25 feet from where the pix were taken I had my lovely auto hubs grenade on me. Had to turn around and head out in 2low.
To sum it all up, on pavement or in the dirt, this kit rocks! I have zero negative to say about it so far. I am very impressed with the flex, stability, and overall ride.
Biggest thing now is should I spend some money to get manual hubs so I can wheel a little more before doing the SAS? Just go pick up some junkyard autos for spares? Or just keep driving it on road only until the SAS?

 

[Slowlyvverot]

so JD is going to factor your experience and satisfaction into the decision to sell the kit to the public? About how much did you pay/will they charge for the kit? It looks great by the way.

 

[SuRrEaLNJ]

So the difference is the spring retainer in the top of the bucket so that it'll take the eb or rbv springs? the rest of the front half of the kit is the same then?

 

[ThatFabGuy]

Since I have the only kit, it will be based on my opinions and input as well as input they receive from customers looking for an Explorer based kit. It costs them money to make and stock parts, money is tight for everyone now so they may not want to go all in on a kit if it's just gonna sit on the shelf and collect dust.
I have no idea of the final cost of the kit, lets just say I'm getting a discount for testing it for them. Final price will be announced either when testing is done or when people start calling and wanting the kit----whichever comes first.

As far as the front of the kit, yes, the coil buckets are the only change. Lots of people are wanting to run a softer spring in the front and this will allow it. Also is a great base for a TTB to SAS swap. In the rear, a new leaf pack will allow for a SPUA application for those that want a true bolt-on kit.

 

[crazyflights]

To me, you can run Bronco 2 or Ranger TTB lifts on Explorer 1st gens, so what did i miss on whats different in front, explorers are that much easier to do rear if u have welding experiance cause then just put axle under springs fronts same???????????

 

[crazyflights]

Which in turn saves money.
Side note I've been running Duff stuff for years and love it, super tough
This is bronco 2 SAS longarm on a 2nd Gen Explorer, scraping back and forth on Rock, did not bend just scratched up.

 

[Tbars4]

...Thanks for sharing with us over here...:biggthump

..This might be worth working on a group buy and should draw a bit of interest on this Forum...They could also become a vendor here and promote it, and their other products too..

 

[ThatFabGuy]

To me, you can run Bronco 2 or Ranger TTB lifts on Explorer 1st gens, so what did i miss on whats different in front, explorers are that much easier to do rear if u have welding experiance cause then just put axle under springs fronts same???????????

Engrish prease??

They tore it all apart and installed a new set of coil buckets that will accept either RBV coils or EB coils. The rest of the front end is the same as their Stage 1.5 kit.

So the difference is the spring retainer in the top of the bucket so that it'll take the eb or rbv springs? the rest of the front half of the kit is the same then?

As far as the front of the kit, yes, the coil buckets are the only change.

Ok. The coil buckets are the only difference in the front. Otherwise it's the same Stage 1.5 kit they sell everyday. The unique thing about the new buckets is that they will take the standard Ranger/BII/Ex coil or an Early Bronco coil which is waaaaaayyyyy softer. Softer=more flex. Also, lots of people start out with a TTB lift and then over time change over to a SAS. Here you use the same buckets, again using the EB coils.
When JD comes out with their SAS bolt-on kit, you will already have most of the components if you buy a new TTB lift kit. It's for the people that don't go all-in at once and like to build a rig in stages. Also with everything being bolt-on, anyone can do it.
Yes you can do a spring over in the rear if you have a welder, but not everyone has one. With a true bolt-on kit it appeals to the masses and not just to the ones that have a shop full of tools at their disposal.

Get it?

 

[crazyflights]

Sorry my grammer and english isnt perfect enough for you, I dont have enough time to waste on making sure its correct. These threads all basically a version of chat locked in place for everyone to see, if you want it perfect take your a$$ some where else and read a book.

But yes sweet kit, but if using EB coils that mount diff at top on buckets? they also mount different on bottom?

 

[explorerguy89]

sweet kit =p

 

[cmhaah06]

any new info on the coil buckets? im tryin to run an eb coil setup.

 

[ThatFabGuy]

I have swapped to EB coils to finish out the testing phase of the lift. In the process, I have encountered a major problem that is being addressed now. I'll fill you in on what has happened so far.

First, out with the old Ranger coils

Then bolt up the bottom retainer I made that attaches to the TTB and holds the EB coil.

Finally, bolt the keeper back up and BAM! ya got EB coils.

I put the 3.5" EB lift coils in which matched up pretty good with the 6" lift I have. It raised the front end about 1" higher than what it was with the Ranger coils in.

Now comes the interesting part, the Ranger coils are approx. a 475 lbs/in spring, the EB coils I swapped in are a 225 lbs/in spring. The stiffer Ranger coils mask a major problem with the TTB setup----steering. I never had a steering problem with the Ranger coils, as a matter of fact, it drove excellent. However with the softer EB coils, the steering has become a major issue. When I take off the front of the Ex lifts which makes the tires do this \ /, and they keep going up until the shocks extend all the way. We are working together to come up with a steering solution that will make the TTB behave correctly with the softer coils.
Here is the Ex after driving forward about 15 feet, without using the gas.

Until the steering problem is solved, I doubt the buckets will go on the market. They were originally intended to be used as a constant when switching from a TTB lift to a solid axle. Run Ranger coils on the TTB and be able to swap to the EB coils when you do the SAS. However, like myself, there will be some that want to run the EB coils on the TTB and this kind of a problem is way too much of a liability. At least if something is accomplished there will be a better steering setup besides the Superlift SuperRunner.

 

[cmhaah06]

Wow...the EB coils from james duff are only 225 lbs/in? Hmmm? Couldn't you just use a slightly stiffer coil to prevent that \ /from happening? Say like around a 300-350 lbs/in coil? 225 sounds extremely soft for an explorer. I know 4x4junkie is running xj coils at 240lbs/in on his broncoII with some great results. I'd have to double check but I found some EB coils that were somewhere in the neighborhood of 340lbs/in. That would probably work, no? Hope these coil buckets work out I am going to buy a set as soon as they are available.

 

[ThatFabGuy]

The spring rate determines the lift height on the JD coils. 3.5" lift is 225 lbs/in 5.5" lift is around the 310 lbs/in range. To go with the stiffer coil would result in gaining another 2"-3" or so of lift. I definitely don't want to be that high.
I have swapped many emails with Junkie discussing the steering situation as he seems to know his stuff. He is running the 240 lbs/in XJ coils but has modified the superlift steering to work correctly.
If I were you, I'd hold off for a bit and instead of piecing a lift together from 5-6 different vendors buy one complete kit. It will save you money.

 

[91ROKKRAWLER]

whats your color codes? mine is mk/yn. wanting to know if yours are the same!

 

[Stolle]

if one was doing a SAS on a 2nd gen could they use the new top coil buckets and upper shock mounts pictured above instead of going out and finding some older ford ones and plasma cutting those off?

 

[ThatFabGuy]

if one was doing a SAS on a 2nd gen could they use the new top coil buckets and upper shock mounts pictured above instead of going out and finding some older ford ones and plasma cutting those off?

Yes. That was the point in making the buckets in the first place. For someone who buys a TTB lift and then later on decides to do a SAS. That way they don't have to go buy a bunch of new parts. Keep the buckets and buy the bolt-on SAS kit (in development) and slap 'er together!
The buckets were not meant to use the EB coils on the TTB, however I swapped them in anyway. Now I have a new steering system I am testing and will report back on it later.

whats your color codes? mine is mk/yn. wanting to know if yours are the same!

Yes. Same color codes--you wanna send me a hood and pass. fender???

 

[cmhaah06]

Thanks Fab. I have considered just buying a lift kit. I have not quite decided on which direction I am going to go (lift wise). I have pieced a lift together (about 5-6" lift) and it still comes out a few hundred cheaper than a skyjacker class II kit. I have been buying parts I know I am going to need, winch, locker and radius arms (I favored the James Duff arms). Just haven't 100% decided how I'm going to do the suspension yet. I know I want to stay TTB for now. I hope the new steering works out.

 

[91ROKKRAWLER]

Yes. Same color codes--you wanna send me a hood and pass. fender???

Not really... lol. wow i finally have a truck on here with the same colors as someone else. oh and thanks fab, you just got me 10 bucks cash. my family betted me that it was black and i disagreed. I know my explorer...

 

[jd4242]

i see you run the duff shocks,how do you like them?