1997 MM 5.0 c-n-p conv. *IT RUNS! 1st CL drive Problem with Overdrive*

[Josh P]

Next Friday is 100 years from now. I'm wanting to see it run.

 

[CDW6212R]

Have you got all of the engine bay parts that attach to the engine? I've discovered one of the largest vacuum lines that should be replaced on all of these engines, besides the typical tiny plastic ones. Look at the rubber vacuum hose which connects to the intake manifold, on that steel line visible at the front edge of the upper intake. That hose is relatively large, and with full intake vacuum, age will make them collapse. I just found that hose sucked flat on my recent problem Explorer. I had a lean condition which didn't show up other than an O2 sensor code, and a slowly growing miss, then stumble, then backfiring. I'm sure mine has been leaking for a long while, it hurt the front cats that I had replaced today. The rear cats look fine but I had them removed to be sure the issue wasn't those too.

I need to locate that canister purge solenoid hose, it's easy to find the solenoid, but I haven't yet found any reference to the hose. The long AL tube from the solenoid to the fuel tank is available still believe it or not. The vacuum hose/line I need has unique ends to plug onto the intake line and the purge valve. Hopefully someone has hunted that before and posts the part number etc.

 

[allmyEXes]

@CDW6212R If you can, click a pic of the line that you are referring to and post it here please. At the back of the intake there is a small line that had 2 vinyl lines coming out of it and one of them went to the EGR valve control solenoid and I have eliminated both the EGR valve and the
EGR CV solenoid. The other vinyl line went to the vacuum operated fuel pressure gauge. Now I have a single thick rubber line from that smaller
port going to the fuel regulator only. When I was about to install the intake, I removed the PCV hose from the intake vacuum port and plugged
it into the PCV hole at the back of the intake. It still needs plugged back onto the T-port that has a line coming forward, the one I think that you
are talking about, that hooks to a steel piece that a twin vinyl line (maybe? the truck is not in front of me) that one comes back across the engine
to head to a vacuum ball and the one running towards the battery goes to the vapor return valve thing under the battery.
I have misplaced a line that is about 10mm in diameter that goes from the valve that hooks to the aluminum tube running to the back of the
vehicle. Fortunately I can borrow that jumper line off of the 2002 Sport Trac. I'm also missing a line that plugs straight down on a port that is
at the front of the intake that my go to that valve too. 1/4" or 5/16" hose may can be used for the time being for that missing line to get it together.
If the 2 missing lines are in the red 1991 4 door Explorer that is full of extra Explorer parts and '54 F100 parts, I haven't yet seen them. I have
looked in there 3 or 4 times and they are not visible. They should have been inside the '97 MM along with the other parts. It is nearly cleaned out.
I got to get another cup of coffee and S, S, and shave and get the white '97 loaded and us get out of here to head south!

 

[CDW6212R]

That large vacuum line I believe I need might be an F57Z-9E498-B, which is obsolete of course. It's big(about 3/4" diameter) and does push down onto the steel line that sticks out the front of the intake, and turns up there. The line I need is all rubber except the two plastic ends which push onto the ports with a simple plastic lock. That part number calls it a connector, and it's about 28" long(they do metric crap numbers).

 

[allmyEXes]

Late Thursday we got back from our week long trip. A week earlier on Thursday morning we left north Alabama for the Gulf coast we are about 3 to 4 miles from the Tennessee line, so we had the full length of the state to drive and then a couple of more hours into the panhandle of Florida. When we got to the motel, it started raining. The motel looks to have been built in the late 1950's or early 1960's. Fresh paint inside an out. The pool was in good shape.

The guest WI-FI wouldn't work and the TV Wi-Fi kind of sucked too. By day 4 the toilet wouldn't flush. The virtual management said that a plumber was on the way. LOL. It turns out that the people in the next room Wi-Fi and toilet didn't flush either. Since we couldn't look at a map online, the next morning while it was raining, we went and found a map. It rained some more and the next day the rain stopped for a a bit, so we went down to the beach for just a few minutes. The sun peeped out then it started raining again.

Sunday, we went to a donut shop then when the rain stopped for 30 minutes, we went to the county pier. $3- each to walk on the pier and $6-
each if you are fishing. We stopped a guy to get a pic of his catch.

I'm not sure what kind of fish this was but people were catching a **** pot full or rather 5-gallon buckets full of these fish.
The sun was peeping out again.

It started raining again so we just went riding around. It was 400 miles down there, we road around ~400 and 400 back. 1204 total.
We took 2 pictures of 2018 Hurricane Michael storm damage.

A shifted house that hasn't moved in 6 years.

We came back up to Phenix City AL and Columbus GA area. We went buy the cemetery where Dad and his parents are buried.
Afterwards, we drove by his childhood home. It is a little fancier now. It used to be plain white, and the porch rail wasn't as fancy either.
It has AC now but not when he grew up.

After that, we went over to Auburn AL. Auburn University is there. "War Eagle!", Go Tigers! At Walmart where some of you have a Subway or
Burger King, Auburn Wal-mart has an Auburn store.

We stayed at the state park that opened in 1939 I think. In the 1930's CCC, Civilian Conservation Corps built these cabins and probably the other parts of the State park. Our State of Alabama is blessed with 21 state parks that encompass well over 48,000 acres of land and water. This cabin may be about 85 years old. They have been continuously upkept and updated. It had working Wi-Fi and Dish Network TV, AC full kitchen and 3/4 bath.

It was too warm to use the fireplace. I used the grill both nights that was out by the picnic table. The other end had a fire pit.

The first night we had hamburgers and hotdogs. The second night I made "paradise shrimp out of a pound of 16-20s, a pound of bacon and
some crab stuffing. I could only eat half of the shrimp and some beef rib meat. I had to finish cooking them in the 1980's stove because guess what,
It started raining again, this time from hurricane Francine now tropical storm. Florida was just a stationary front that wouldn't move on.

The day before we left, we walked over to the falls. We couldn't get to close because of wet leaves and my wife had on some of those
"cheap" Chinese shoes that make you feel like you are barefoot. We came back home the next day which was last Thursday. Gasoline
went down some while we were gone. The cheapest that we paid was $2.65 a gallon.
Too many leaves to make out the lake. It is on the left, then the falls to the right.

 

[allmyEXes]

Since last Friday, I have been working on getting everything done on the 5.0 in the MM. I worked on it some Saturday and Sunday too.
Late yesterday I decided to pressurize the fuel system. I should have done this right after the injectors and fuel rails were installed but I kind of
overlooked that. It turns out that #2 injector was leaking. I had to pull the upper plenum back off. It is harder to remove than install because
the spacer and gaskets are loose and that one back bolt wants to drag the loose parts with the plenum.
The engine upper plenum is off again.

You can see the damaged O-ring. I checked 1, 3, and 4 while the fuel rail was loose.

Just the O-ring. Fortunately, I had one spare one.

Upper plenum back on and all of the engine stuff is hooked up.

Look at the space where the wasted spark coils used to be.

A few days ago, I messaged with @410Fortune Jamie to find out how to remove this vapor return line off of the 2002 Sport Trac. I had to
borrow it for the MM. Earlier in the week when I thought that I was down to about 6 items to go, I made a list. It was 15 things then the
next day I added 3 more. Now I'm down to 3.

I'm very close to being able to start it. I need to finish the ABS delete. I don't want to have a brain lapse and sit down in the seat to start
it and incidentally/accidentally mash the brake pedal and have fluid going all over the place. Also, the AFR gauge wiring needs finished.
Someone has told me that my cheap AFR gauge/sensor is not a real wideband. I'm looking at AEM wideband AFR gauge and Bosch LS 4.9 O2 sensor. Spend more money...
Don't forget to install the bolts in the intermediate steering shaft.
Link to AEM wideband AFR gauge/sensor kit

 

[allmyEXes]

Yesterday I finished up the ABS bypass. I had trouble with my Vevor hydraulic flare tool. It doesn't have 4.75 mm pieces in its kit, so I went to AutoZone and got the loner tool kit foy metric size lines. 4.75 mm is .03 smaller than 3/16" line. I don't know if that was the main issue or not but my 3/16" die would not hold on to the metal line without it slipping in the tool. It is back together and holding with no leaks however I'm not happy with the results. I couldn't quite get a good bubble on the back line and the Vevor tool didn't have quite enough working room under the hood with everything back in place. Today I'm going to stand on the brake peddle and have brother look under the hood to make sure that there are not any leaks.

Over a week ago, I pressure tested the fuel system and had one O-ring on an injector that needed to be replaced. I got that all back together and have been over and under the engine several times to make sure that I haven't overlooked anything that has/had been missed. With the PCM relay unplugged, I turned the engine over a few times to attempt to build oil pressure. It has been well over two and a half years since the 5.0 had last ran. The huge FL-299 filter didn't have oil in it and the copper oil line to the analog gauge was empty too, so I elected to pull the camshaft position sensor out of the block to get tools in there to turn the oil pump. We first got the engine back to TDC and made sure that the CamPS alignment tool would drop onto it. I had a couple of ideas about how to pump the V-8 up and on my shelves in the back of the shop was an old 1986 5.0 Mustang distributor that had previously had the gear remove to use with a stock mid '80s 5.0 camshaft. A perfect tool. The shaft would be being held stable and where the rotor button goes has a 1/4" shaft sticking out of the top of it. I used my 3/8" cordless drill in reverse and pumped up the engine. This is probably something that should have been done weeks ago when the fuel pressure test should have been done but I kept reminding myself that the oil gauge was not attached on the gauge end yet, so don't get ahead of myself and have a loose oil line spraying into the interior of the '97 MM. The engine pumped up rather quick and with 5W30 oil with the engine cold, 75 degrees F, the oil pressure is 44 pounds. Not bad for a 250K engine.

I'm unable to get the starter to engage from the key switch. I need to test the three sections of wiring that have the starter solenoid trigger wire running through them. Finally, with the PCM relay back in place and the inertia switch reattached, I can hear the fuel pump prime for a second like normal. However, with the key switch in the run position and energizing the solenoid, It turns over but will not poof, bang or otherwise. I also plugged in a noid light to the #1 fuel injector circuit and I'n not getting power to the injectors. The PCM condition is unknown. It is a 1999 Crown Vic P71 cop car piece that had been located through an online service, car-part.com, for $50- + shipping, shipped directly from a salvage yard. It is entirely possible that it is a bad unit however the ARA3 bin file that I copied from it is intact and can be written to another 1999 CV PCM. The bin file is worth what I paid for the PCM even if the PCM is bad. I do have a known working PCM from the Crown Vic that work several years ago when I first started the old 4.6 to hear it knocking. Later this morning, I will be writing the ARA3 bin file that has the PATS feature switched off from the factory to this other PCM. That might be the problem. If it is not, the first place that I will be looking at on the 104 pin connector wiring is anything having to do with the PCM power points. There were at least two changes between the '97 MM and the '99 CV PCMs. I may have disconnected a power wire for the '97 MM that the '99 CV didn't use but not put power to it another way. I hope to find an extra power wire that I may have insulated and folded back an extra power wire to get wrapped up in the main harness. There were a lot of wiring changes between the two vehicles. I really did expect at least a poof but I'm clearly not getting power to the injectors. I haven't rigged up a dummy spark plug to one of the coils to see if I'm getting spark. That logically may be the next step however I already have the first PCM disconnected and out of its pocket and will just go ahead and follow through with the PCM swap. Later this morning, I will know more after I can lay hands on it.
Hurricane Helene is affecting our weather again. We just got over Francine. It seems a bit unusual to see tropical storms spinning up in the gulf as opposed to starting out in the Atlantic Ocean then making their way here. Often, I mention the weather. We don't have a "climate-controlled facility". We have a shop controlled by the climate!.

 

[allmyEXes]

It just occurred to me that the used electronic piece of the 2-wire camshaft position sensor is of unknown condition too. I have 2 or 3 more of those that I can swap out and try early on while I'm trying to track down the no start issue.

 

[410Fortune]

Did you ground the blue with orange wire at the starter relay? This is the wire the pats would ground so the ignition switch can run the starter solenoid

 

[allmyEXes]

IIRC, 1997 is pre PATS so I don't think that there is a PATS module, But that's a good thought.

 

[410Fortune]

Okay! Forgot it was 97
Yes pre pats

Check for battery power and ground at starter relay then check the signal from the ignition switch (12v+) when it is turned to “start”

If no then the problem is upstream
If yes then issue is downstream at starter side of things
The older 5.0 had a big ass ground wire that goes from battery to frame. Make sure that sucker is hooked up. It is on the bracket that holds the wire loom for the starter/ battery cables drivers frame rail just below /
Behind ac compressor
You have 97 manual/ diagrams?

You know I jump around a lot and we have many projects lol

 

[allmyEXes]

Yea, too many projects going on it is easy to get mixed up. I have the engine configured as a '99 Explorer except it still has return fuel. So did the '99 CV. I'm about to try a restart with a different cam pos sensor. I think it is the sensor from Tim. The current PCM is back in place.
As far as the starter circuit goes, the first place that I'm going to check is where I change the trans range switch connector and see if I can spot the wires going through the connector. Also probe starter wire in that connector all the way to the solenoid point, see if I have continuity.
Yep, I have the two books, '97 MM and '99 CV.

 

[allmyEXes]

It has started. Bad cam ps. After changing the cam ps, the Injector noid light was lighting up. Also, inline spark tester tool lighting up. After fuel pressure it started and ran. Filling up radiator now and just tightened the two lower fuel line connections.
Working towards an audio recording.

 

[410Fortune]

Woooooohoooooo running is step one!!!
Not on fire is step two
Three no major leaks
You know the rest

 

[allmyEXes]

Tachometer wont work. Still have AFR gauge power and ground to attach. Starting circuit and tach need fixed.
Also, replacement RH exhaust manifold donut gasket is the wrong size after breaking the metal one. I've never moved the throttle. Sound file below.

 

[allmyEXes]

The no turn engine over at the key was a switch issue, it wasn't plugged in all of the way.
The problem with the tachometer is the 1999 Crown Vic doesn't have one. The old 1997 Mountaineer PCM pin #48 tan/yellow is for the tach. The Crown Vic PCM doesn't have a wire going to that pin and the pin-out chart says not used. Also no tachometer on the Crown Vic instruments. Later I will look and see if I left the tach wire in the 97 MM position. Surely there is an alternate way to make the tachometer work.
There was a donut gasket, a blue Felpro piece but it is not sealing. It measures 2" ID and 2 9/16" OD. I have a 2" manifold and a 2.25 pipe.
I need something like this gasket pictured below the link. It doesn't have good measurements, and I would like to see a variety of sizes.
stepped donut gasket It would be nice to know all of the measurements etc.

 

[410Fortune]

Ask at the local parts store to see their exhaust gaskets usually they have a board in the back with all of them hanging there

I use various Chevy exhaust donut rings to solve manifold to downpipe leaks on the ball flanges

Dakota digital makes a tach driver

 

[allmyEXes]

@410Fortune The rh Mustang II exhaust manifold does not have a ball type flange connection. The donut gasket sits up in the flange of the manifold and the flange of the pipe sits on the bottom side of the donut gasket. I should have used a later model exhaust manifold with a ball flange. The budget for this project is spent. I have to make what I have work properly.
I'm not seeing an inexpensive tach driver or tach adapter. I wonder where the tach signal comes from within the PCM and why that pin wasn't active in the Crown Vic PCM even though there was not a tach on the dash? It has 8 coil drivers internally in the '99 Crown Vic PCM.
What is the part number on the Dakota Digital piece that you are referring to? I'll just have to go without a tach for a while. I'm glad to see that it is not working because of something that I didn't do correctly.

"It always takes longer and always cost more"

 

[410Fortune]

Dakota digital 100bt can generate a tachometer signal
From 3-4’different ignition pickup choices
They also make a specific tachometer interface module
I see autometer makes one as well
These should be able to drive the stock tach
I can’t believe the crown Vic pcm has no tach output! Silly!

I would be looking at the crown Vic pcm more closely I bet the obd2 port
Knows engine rpm which means you can use a digital speedo/ tach / gauges setup

 

[allmyEXes]

Of course, internet information is hard to come by when one goes below the "scratched surface". Last night somewhere in one of the half a dozen windows that I had open, I read that the tach signal is at the OBD2 port. It might be at the J3 port as well.
If a PCM brainiac or code guy into this EEC-V stuff reads this and has any input, it would be greatly appreciated. I'm thinking that it may be something as simple as adding a jumper wire to pin #48 or in the bin file code, write a patch to make the tach pin active. On the other hand, there could be a missing little chip or circuit in the Crown Vic PCM missing therefore making this not possible.
I did also read that 2003 Mercury Marauder PCMs have an active pin #48. Marauder PCMs are hard to come by.