Alignment Problems

[PCTechman]

On a 1991 Explorer 5spd man. trans. 3.73 gears TTB front end. The rear has 2" lift leaf springs, no problems there. I installed a set of 2" lift progressive type coils and a Tuff Country (#20813) Axle Pivot Bracket lowering kit for lifted vehicles up to 2" lift for the front. The vehicle already has previously installed -3.5 to +3.5 degree camber alignment bushings (similar to Moog #8984) My alignment tech has the camber set all the way out and can only get a max reading of -3 degrees. There's no more adjustment. Can someone tell me what I did wrong here?

Thanks for any help on this,
PCTechman

 

[WhitEngineering]

Maybe I'm not entirely understanding this.. but why do you want your camber past -3*, seems that would be angled in pretty hard. Spec is -0.3 to 0.8. I have a 2" lift without pivot drop brackets. It came into spec (0.2) with only a 1* bushing on the drivers side and a 1.5* on the pass. side. Is your Ex. 4x4 or 2x4? If I remember right, the same bushing doesn't give the same amount of adjustment on 4x4 and 2x4. Maybe the 3.5* is for 2x4??

 

[PCTechman]

I should have said the alignment tech couldn't get it lower than -3.0. (Tires closer at the top=negative camber, right? I am a newbie to this stuff) I believe now that you are telling me that you do not have pivot drop brackets, the mistake I made was putting in the pivot drop brackets in the first place and that has created the limit to camber adjustment. I attempted to fix an alignment problem I did not have. I thought I had to bring the pivot point down 2" to compensate for the 2" lift coils. I have a 4x4, but the bushings fit both 2x4 and 4x4. The bushings were the ones installed by the previous owner and the alignment was correct at that point, I put 80,000 even wear highway miles on a set of Michelin Cross Terrains. Would it resolve the problem if I put the stock pivot brackets back in? The alignment machine showed 0.24 on the screen at the shop where I had taken it, are you sure on the spec of 0.3-0.8?

Thanks for your help,
PCTechman

 

[WhitEngineering]

Correct, I don't have drop brackets. From what I read on the forum, you don't need drop brackets until you go over 2" lift. Like I said earlier, I have 2" lift using F150 spacers, and everything aligned to spec no problem at all. I'm certain on the camber spec of -0.3 to +0.8. I have the alignment sheet in front of me from when I did mine.

Like you said, I think you tried to fix somthing that wasn't really wrong. The 3.5* bushings were correct without drop brackets. Now that you have drop brackets, the 3.5* is too much. The same bushing sets camber and caster. The problem may be that if he brings the camber INTO spec, then the caster goes way OUT of spec?? Although caster spec I have here is +2.0 to +7.0 so there is alot of range there.

Anyways, I believe that if it was aligned properly before then everything was fine. Did the tech try a different bushing? A smaller degree might bring it into spec. and let you keep the drop brackets so you don't have to spend time taking them out.

 

[PCTechman]

Yes the tech put in a different bushing with less degree but it made more negative camber (-4.17). The previous owner had radius arm bushing problems with elongated holes in the chassis bracket but I replaced the stock setup with the real beefy James Duff radius arms and it was since that installation that I drove 80,000 correctly aligned, trouble free miles. I'm positive now, thanks to your input, that once I re-install the stock brackets, I will get the alignment correct. The tech referred me to 2 off road/custom suspension shops that specialize in custom lift/lowering, but all they could tell me is that the TTB was one of the most difficult front ends to lift/lower and they didn't like working on Ford products because of so many variances in the vehicle suspensions/mid year changes. With your hands-on experience, you actually gave me more info/insight into this then they did. There must have been some manufacturing variances in these vehicle suspensions from year to year; 1) in reading the description of the 2" drop pivot brackets, it states "Ideal for Fords (Ranger 1983-97/Explorer 1991-94 4wd) that have been lifted 1.5"-2.5" without changing stock axle pivot brackets and "have problems with alignment", so I'm guessing some Ex's will need them only if you have alignment problems "after the lift". My fault for not reading/understanding it correctly the first time and anticipating a problem I did not have! 2) After I installed the James Duff radius arms, several local offroaders told me that they are only for lifted vehicles, and my caster would be way off, yet it brought both the caster/camber within spec better than the stock arms.
Again, Much thanks for your help,
PCTechman