Jon And Sheri's Vitamin D Wagon

[Turdle]

OK, for clarity

The Drag ink is rotating up when steering to left, rotates down when steering to the right. The rotation point is indeed the outer tie rod ends, however they seem designed to rotate in this manner. Side to side they seem tight. The steering "slop" is this drag link rotation before any side to side movement occurs. It is caused by the severe upward angle of the steering link's pull on the drag link I think.

This is why I asked about a drop pitman arm. I would also adjust the other angles accordingly. Iz said no to this so I must be missing something.



OK, updated fix it list

Figure out what to do about a roof---

Radius arm bushings--I got the other kit and will see what happens with that

Steering mods
fix angles, drag link and panhard bar mounts

Extend radius arms for cushier ride and to facilitate use of sliders. ( I am still looking for a great how to for this. Will trade powder coating for welding!!!

The lower coil mounts are not right. There is just a square plate in there-:thumbdwn:

also the rubber thingys at the top of the coils are rotted out looking. These need replaced.

The coils themselves seem too stiff. Softer coils and dual shocks are desired for the front to soak up nature's speed bumps a bit better.

I do not see any sort of bump stop device---hmmm


Repair instrument cluster--coolant temp and fuel level do not work.

Rear shock mounts. I need ideas, and am not against any that will result in less pounding to the spine. It appears what are in there now are actually front shocks, and the top spindle mount uses one of the stock holes as it's mount, with isolators on each side of the metal

Before you say un uh, yeah they did. :thumbdwn:






Extensive maintenance to the drive train. This will include clean up and powder coating where I can.

Locker to the front if it is not already. I like lunchbox lockers just fine.

Get the bumper paid for , coated and installed.

Fix power steering leak. It isn't dripping, but is a bit messy.

Lower radiator hose seems a bit short.

The air compressor still needs a new pressure switch

Wiring for above

There is another temp gauge in the truck. It was being used for a coolant gauge as the stock one is messed up as stated above. once the coolant temp gauge issue is solved I will use this temp gauge as a trans temp gauge. The pan already has a "bung" welded in as a drain plug. I intend to use this hole for the probe.

Rebuild the 4x4 shift motor

FINISH THE ROLL BARS. It will never be a pro cage but adding some structure is better than nothing.

Then on to creature comforts--

CB radio
Stereo --don't even have a head unit. I am not picky other than I like Sony for the CD playback quality. Just my personal experience, but for the price they put out very awesome S/N ratio-Dynamic range, and everyone hates em so they are cheap.

The ac seems to be holding pressure, but needs filled. Gosh I sure hope it is r134.

This is my mental note. feel free to advise.

 

[IZwack]

The Drag ink is rotating up when steering to left, rotates down when steering to the right. The rotation point is indeed the outer tie rod ends, however they seem designed to rotate in this manner. Side to side they seem tight. The steering "slop" is this drag link rotation before any side to side movement occurs. It is caused by the severe upward angle of the steering link's pull on the drag link I think.

Yeah you could put a drop pitman arm but again, this will increase the bump steer.

As suggested by JamesT, have you checked the TRE's? Because you mentioned that the whole draglink starts rotating before the knuckles even start turning - kind of sounds like loose TREs because there shouldnt be any delay or lag. As soon as the pitman arm makes any movement, the knuckles should react to the same movement (unless the draglink is bending).

 

[Turdle]

Yeah you could put a drop pitman arm but again, this will increase the bump steer.

As suggested by JamesT, have you checked the TRE's? Because you mentioned that the whole draglink starts rotating before the knuckles even start turning - kind of sounds like loose TREs because there shouldnt be any delay. As soon as the pitman arm makes any movement, the knuckles should react to the same movement (unless the draglink is bending).

The drag link is rotating front to back-as the steering link pulls it, it rotates a bit. The steering link is attached at the front of the drag link. Maybe it is this bushing which is worn and allowing the rotation??


The side to side movement of the tie rod ends is tight


As I understand it, the tie rod ends swivel all directions like a hiem joint, correct ?


Video of drag link rotation is coming---

 

[IZwack]

the tie rod ends swivel all directions like a hiem joint right?

Yep yep

 

[sparksafly'n]

Jon have we looked at mine to see the difference between them. Now you got me wandering if mines right??

 

[dkchrist]

I am looking at welders. Just waiting for the paychecks to start.

 

[Turdle]

Jon have we looked at mine to see the difference between them. Now you got me wandering if mines right??

Yours is fine , it is my benchmark. no worries on your end.

Here is the video.


http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/ff269/jtsmith1362/truck/?action=view&current=dadvideo.flv

 

[IZwack]

Well that video explains it all - sorry for the confusion earlier.

Yeah A drop pitman arm would help but I think it will still rotate. I think it would be a good idea to switch over to sparksafly'n's setup maybe in the near future (summer!)

EDIT - or another solution would be to turn the link connecting both knuckles so that the draglink's ball joint is on top. But then you'd need a bent drag link (to counter the extreme ball joint angle). But at that point, you might as well switch over to sparksafly'n's setup.

 

[Turdle]

Sometimes my explainin is shaky. The confusion is all on this end.

This issue has to be sorted soon. I can't even drive it fast enough to see what all the problems are. I still haven't had this thing over 40 mph, and then I felt I was flirting with death.

It seems to go left for a while, until you turn right, then it wants to go right for a bit--it will not hold straight ahead.

It seems like the geometry is moving all over the place.

 

[IZwack]

It seems to go left for a while, until you turn right, then it wants to go right for a bit--it will not hold straight ahead.

I'd check the ball joints - which includes the ball joints on the TREs and the ball joints that hold the knuckle onto the "C".

 

[Turdle]

^^ thanks . I will get weight off it and do this asap.

I kind of like Bronco2guy's idea of using 3/8" DOM tube for the links. I could take them to a machine shop for threading.

Where is the best place to look for these links? Ruff stuff ok?



Dannyboy mentioned drilling the knuckle for the link mounting. I guess I don't understand, is that just a longer bolt or is there a bushing of some sort in there for joint operation?

And the pitman arm question still has me perplexed. I thought if I can get all the links closer to " level" it would "decrease" bump steer. Seems like lowering the pitman arm end is the only way to do this-rather get it as level as possible. I could see where a longer pin on the knuckle end of the steering link would help, but that would decrease strength.
I do understand moving the steering link will decrease the angle, however it looks like Sparksaflyin's pitman arm is longer than mine
pics again for ease of reference

Sparksaflyin's

Ours

 

[crazyflights]

I had hard tiome finding anywhere local to get me DOM size i wanted, so here is online website.
http://www.onlinemetalstore.com/items/DrawnOverMandrel_DOM_Steel_Round_Tube.cfm

even after paying shipping its cheaper than what i could get at local places

drilling out the knuckles is exactly what he said, used 3/4 drill bit start on the largeer side of the taper and go all the way thru, then on links use 3/4 heims, then bolted to knuckle use 3/4 grade 8 hardware, this is way you need to do it, also if you put bottom bar on top of knuckles gets it off the ground couple more inches for extra clearance.

drop pitman arm -i have a spare

and redo you track bar mounts. You'll be happy you did.

 

[Turdle]

I had hard tiome finding anywhere local to get me DOM size i wanted, so here is online website.
http://www.onlinemetalstore.com/items/DrawnOverMandrel_DOM_Steel_Round_Tube.cfm

even after paying shipping its cheaper than what i could get at local places

drilling out the knuckles is exactly what he said, used 3/4 drill bit start on the largeer side of the taper and go all the way thru, then on links use 3/4 heims, then bolted to knuckle use 3/4 grade 8 hardware, this is way you need to do it, also if you put bottom bar on top of knuckles gets it off the ground couple more inches for extra clearance.

drop pitman arm -i have a spare

and redo you track bar mounts. You'll be happy you did.

Thanks. I will be contacting you shortly about the pitman arm.

And by "trac bar " I assume you are referring to the panhard bar.

raise the axle mount yes?

 

[IZwack]

raise the axle mount yes?

Yes, but not till it gets warmer - its freaking cold

 

[MrQ]

The ac seems to be holding pressure, but needs filled. Gosh I sure hope it is r134.

This is my mental note. feel free to advise.

91-93 I believe only ran R12 unless the guy before you converted to an R134 system. If you have to convert, the original A/C compressor can handle R134 as well as r12.

 

[Albino 94LTD]

Jon, is there any way to rotate the drag link ball joint to the back side? That might be a quick temporary improvement.

 

[Turdle]

I bought another new radius arm bushing kit, and it was different thant the one I used before. The center section in these were a bit shallower. It also had the plastic backer.

So in they went. Wow, that solved about 90% of the weird goofy steering, and eliminated a loud knocking sound. From the looks of it the arms could move about 1/2" in -out up down and all around with the prior new bushings. Now it is solid and quiet.

ok for the steering, call me cheap but I just cannot afford ballistic joints at this time. Is it ok if I use these, at least for a little while?

this for the drag link

http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=338{33}64

and these for the tie rod

http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/chromoly-thread-p-325.html




It would enable me to get the pieces all lined up, and if a joint fails I might be able to replace it with a better one later. I do not think Marks truck has ballistic joints either--BTW

 

[90ranajo]

Those are pretty much the same ones I'm using for my steering and track bar (although I opted for 7/8").

 

[IZwack]

Those joints should do just fine - RuffStuff has always been good to me.

 

[james t]

Those joints will not fail in steering applications unless you hit an IED or drop the truck out of an airplane. They do get loose over time, but ive never heard of one breaking. Mine are roughly 5 years old with lots of street/trail and a little loose, but not enough to make it road walk.