no start, no codes

[YZFRONE]

yeah screw this civic boy we all know the real cars are the scion TC's

 

[BobWiersema]

This could be a dumb question but, did you swap out the PCM's?

I have no idea if they are programed the same or not, I would think not.

From 97 to 01 a lot of things must have changed.

Bob.

 

[pauley]

iv had simular things happen to cars that have only been a year apart but one would think that a 01 ecu wouldent fit a 98 but hey you never know til you try

 

[vroomzoomboom]

i am also starting to think it may be something in the pcm as well, but i would have to think i wouldn't have any spark, or fuel whatsoever. but, i have been wrong so far! LOL.

yes, lots of things did change from 97 to 01. the biggest was the fuel system (if i am not wrong).

if the part numbers don't match on the pcm's they will not work. i took a chance on the weekend, went to a wreaking yard and pulled a few from some explorers that where there. non of the part # matched, so i didn't even bother plugging them in. i got them for nothing, so at least I'm not out any $

 

[BobWiersema]

i am also starting to think it may be something in the pcm as well, but i would have to think i wouldn't have any spark, or fuel whatsoever. but, i have been wrong so far! LOL.

yes, lots of things did change from 97 to 01. the biggest was the fuel system (if i am not wrong).

if the part numbers don't match on the pcm's they will not work. i took a chance on the weekend, went to a wreaking yard and pulled a few from some explorers that where there. non of the part # matched, so i didn't even bother plugging them in. i got them for nothing, so at least I'm not out any $

Do you have the PCM from the truck you took the engine out of?

 

[vroomzoomboom]

i have the entire truck sitting beside the 01 (parts truck is a 97 sport). i know where your going with this, so yea, i guess it cant hurt anything to try the pcm from it......i think.

 

[BobWiersema]

i have the entire truck sitting beside the 01 (parts truck is a 97 sport). i know where your going with this, so yea, i guess it cant hurt anything to try the pcm from it......i think.

Worst case you smoke the PCM. Take a look at the connector and the wiring colors from the 97 to the 01. If the connector is the same and the color codes are the same, I would think no problem.

For what its worth, these people may be able to help with compatibility questions.

http://www.fordecu.net/index.htm


Bob.

 

[vroomzoomboom]

welllllllllllllll, here's an interesting update. with the help of a buddy of mine that i mentioned earlier, as well as help from one of the mods on this site, ideas where tossed around from checking to see if the motor was hydro locking from fuel, seeing if injectors where pulsing, bad starter, to compression. i change starters. it cranks a little better, but still will not fire (figuring that the starter was causing too much draw, and possibly robbing the computer of any power to function, hey worth a try right?). then came checking if the injectors where pulsing or not. to do this, i had to remove the upper intake, no biggie. when i did that, another buddy called. he was home, and to come and get his compression tester. i scoot over there, grab it, and come back. i take the plug closest to the rad on the passengers side out, and screw the tester in, and crank the key for 10 seconds. i go to look at the gauge......... it reads nothing. ok, maybe it is draining the gauge down before i can see it. its possible, hell, at this point having lighting strike me in the ass while i am bent over tying my shoes is even possible. so i call up my dad to see if he has 5 mins to come to my house and turn the key while i read the gauge. he comes over, turns the key for me while i am looking at it and guess what?! NO COMPRESSION! zip, zero, nada! thinking ok, there is something wrong with the gauge. pull it out of the motor, and go old school by shoving my finger in the spark plug hole. nnnnoooooootttttthhhhhhiiiiiiinnnnnngggggg!
now how can a motor that was running perfectly fine, go to no compression. i didn't dig into the motor at all. the only thing that i did besides changed the harness, injectors, fuel rail, upper and lower intakes, was turn the motor while i was removing the flywheel nuts. that and, this motor sounds the same as the other one that i replaced when it is trying to turn over! WTF!!!

 

[pauley]

welllllllllllllll, here's an interesting update. with the help of a buddy of mine that i mentioned earlier, as well as help from one of the mods on this site, ideas where tossed around from checking to see if the motor was hydro locking from fuel, seeing if injectors where pulsing, bad starter, to compression. i change starters. it cranks a little better, but still will not fire (figuring that the starter was causing too much draw, and possibly robbing the computer of any power to function, hey worth a try right?). then came checking if the injectors where pulsing or not. to do this, i had to remove the upper intake, no biggie. when i did that, another buddy called. he was home, and to come and get his compression tester. i scoot over there, grab it, and come back. i take the plug closest to the rad on the passengers side out, and screw the tester in, and crank the key for 10 seconds. i go to look at the gauge......... it reads nothing. ok, maybe it is draining the gauge down before i can see it. its possible, hell, at this point having lighting strike me in the ass while i am bent over tying my shoes is even possible. so i call up my dad to see if he has 5 mins to come to my house and turn the key while i read the gauge. he comes over, turns the key for me while i am looking at it and guess what?! NO COMPRESSION! zip, zero, nada! thinking ok, there is something wrong with the gauge. pull it out of the motor, and go old school by shoving my finger in the spark plug hole. nnnnoooooootttttthhhhhhiiiiiiinnnnnngggggg!
now how can a motor that was running perfectly fine, go to no compression. i didn't dig into the motor at all. the only thing that i did besides changed the harness, injectors, fuel rail, upper and lower intakes, was turn the motor while i was removing the flywheel nuts. that and, this motor sounds the same as the other one that i replaced when it is trying to turn over! WTF!!!

It's been washed down with fuel so much it can't make compression it needs oil on the cylinder walls to make compression you need to figure out why it has so much damn fuel in the cylinders fix that and then put about three teaspoons full of oil in each hole and turn it over with the fuel disabled and then see if it will fire.

 

[vroomzoomboom]

when i did the compression test, i had knock the cut off switch to the fuel pump so the fuel pump would not come on (and when i turned the key on, i did not hear it cycle, and the fuel reset light was on in the gauge cluster), unplugged the coil pack, and unplugged the injectors. also, before all of that, i had changed the oil, so it had fresh oil.

 

[pauley]

when i did the compression test, i had knock the cut off switch to the fuel pump so the fuel pump would not come on (and when i turned the key on, i did not hear it cycle, and the fuel reset light was on in the gauge cluster), unplugged the coil pack, and unplugged the injectors. also, before all of that, i had changed the oil, so it had fresh oil.

It's good that you did all that but the Over soak of fuel happened before that And by the sounds of it it happened to the other engine too you have to diagnose the fuel issue you might even have a good engine from the other truck if there is a PCM issue or somthing it would have caused the other engine to have zero compression too.

 

[BobWiersema]

QUOTE EDIT........

welllllllllllllll,
the only thing that i did besides changed the harness, injectors, fuel rail, upper and lower intakes, was turn the motor while i was removing the flywheel nuts. that and, this motor sounds the same as the other one that i replaced when it is trying to turn over! WTF!!!

Did you turn a 97 v6 sohc backwards?
I think that's a bad thing.
Someone check me on this but, that could be the problem, if you lost alignment with the cam that would explain the lack of compression. I have no idea how to fix this. I am sure someone on this site could explain this better. I just can't think of anything else, the PMC has nothing to do with compression. Check a cylinder on both sides, if you have no compression, I would think cam chains.

I hope someone who has rebuilt one of these SOHC engines will post next.

Bob.

Edit. Also wondering, why did you pull the flywheel?

 

[2000StreetRod]

WOT for compression test

. . . i had to remove the upper intake, no biggie. when i did that, another buddy called. he was home, and to come and get his compression tester. i scoot over there, grab it, and come back. i take the plug closest to the rad on the passengers side out, and screw the tester in, and crank the key for 10 seconds. i go to look at the gauge......... it reads nothing. . .

Did you do the compression test with the intake manifold on or off? If on, did you remember to hold the throttle wide open?

 

[vroomzoomboom]

bob, i realy hope your wrong.......

i didn't pull the flywheel, just turned it, and yes, i do beleive i did turn it both ways when i was putting the nuts back on. my buddy also suggested what you had said about the cams.....but, this summer i also put a motor into a 00 sport (using a 00 motor mind you), and did the same things. that motor sat for 2 years in my shed, so all the oil drained from the tensioners, and it fired up without any problems. but later today i am doing a compression test across the board.

 

[vroomzoomboom]

Did you do the compression test with the intake manifold on or off? If on, did you remember to hold the throttle wide open?

the upper intake was off.

 

[pauley]

I know the PCM dosent have any thing to do with actual compression I'm suggesting a bad PCM held the injectors open which floded the piss out of bouth engines which can and will cause 0 compression however so will skipped timing chains iv just never seen one cause no compression iv seen bad timing cause bad compression but not zero compression. Then again that's just my .02

 

[CDW6212R]

How much fuel pressure dose it have excatly???

Start here, what is the pressure, just turn the key on?

Did you use the 01 fuel rail, and PCM, and key? That's important. The fuel pressure after 1998 is 55-62psi, at all times. That means engine off and key on, idling, WOT, all the time. There is a FPR in the fuel tank, between the pump and tubes. The two hoses for that can leak, mine did and I had only 50 psi at most running.

The PATS will tell you that something is wrong, by flashing the "THEFT" light after you turn the key on. You have to use matching keys, PCM, and the PATS module. It sounds like you have all the pieces, but the fuel pressure may be off. Regards,

 

[vroomzoomboom]

hey don! yes, i did use the rail, injectors, harness, upper and lower intakes, and the pcm and keys. from the 97, i used the cam and crank position sensors and thermostat housing. the theft light goes off after i turn the key as well, and doesn't flash at all. i was going to play around with it some more today, but it was raining, and i am garage-less.

 

[Jestarr]

Did you swap the pats modules also? The system changed in 99 to PATS II, and again in 2000 to E-PATS. May or may not make a difference in what the modules control.

 

[vroomzoomboom]

that has nothing to do with a motor swap, but thanks anyways.