Torsion key bolt swap

[VWbaja10]

I’ll address that issue i
f I ever come across it. But I’ll probably never touch them unless I need to. I was thinking about getting some a bit shorter so they don’t hang low and do 10.9 then.

 

[VWbaja10]

yep, i dont recall it ever being that bad where they closed it. oh well, there goes tomorrows plans

I’ve been up there when it flooded in 2015 and it stayed open and power line was washed away in spot

 

[Fix4Dirt]

I’ve been up there when it flooded in 2015 and it stayed open and power line was washed away in spot

yep, every time ive seen a part of the park flood, in non burn areas its always stayed open. must be abnormally bad up there.

 

[Blown]

I am sure the stock bolts were engineered. Those bolts you got are not of the strength that is required. I'm sure the stock bolts are grade 5 or better. That nicely rounded tip fits in a socket while a standard bolt will grind in the socket and load the bolt unevenly. Thought was given to strength and length. Those long bolts will side-load more and more the further they are driven in. The torsion key angle increases as you drive those bolts in. That's part of why you can only get so much lift with the stock keys and lift keys are re-indexed to allow more rotation of the torsion bars.

Bolt Depot - Bolt Grade Markings and Strength Chart

www.boltdepot.com

You don't need new bars, but I would see what is installed. There are different torsion bars. If I remember, the "B" are stiffest, but there are threads here on the topic. I think I got "F" bars, used bars, actually looking for a better ride I went for a softer set. It was some time ago and I forget details.

 

[VWbaja10]

I am sure the stock bolts were engineered. Those bolts you got are not of the strength that is required. I'm sure the stock bolts are grade 5 or better. That nicely rounded tip fits in a socket while a standard bolt will grind in the socket and load the bolt unevenly. Thought was given to strength and length. Those long bolts will side-load more and more the further they are driven in. The torsion key angle increases as you drive those bolts in. That's part of why you can only get so much lift with the stock keys and lift keys are re-indexed to allow more rotation of the torsion bars.

Bolt Depot - Bolt Grade Markings and Strength Chart

www.boltdepot.com

You don't need new bars, but I would see what is installed. There are different torsion bars. If I remember, the "B" are stiffest, but there are threads here on the topic. I think I got "F" bars, used bars, actually looking for a better ride I went for a softer set. It was some time ago and I forget details.

I know how things work, and I’ve done research on this also. I do have B bars, but they are sagged. If the stock bolt is grade 5 and I use 8.8, wouldn’t that be stronger or equivalent? As for the stock design yes some thought/engineering went into it but only in a stock aspect, not lifting or putting bigger tires on like we do.
Here is a pic of how the bolts I have sit in the torsion key looks like it fits/seats properly on lift keys. I cannot speak for stock keys how they are.

Thanks for your concern

 

[VWbaja10]

With the bolts being 100mm they are a bit long. I’ll be ordering new bolts that are a bit shorter,10.9 and be flange head like the oem.

 

[Blown]

Whoa, sorry, the bolts you chose are equivalent to grade 5 standard bolts made from heat treated medium carbon steel.

My bolt preference would be Class 10.9 which introduces alloys which gives more strength. I think there is somewhere close to 7,000lbs pressing down on those bolts. I'd round the ends to fit the keys which will keep the force as close to the center of the bolts as possible for strength.

A "lift key" should be indexed so as to not need a longer bolt to get the required lift.

 

[VWbaja10]

Whoa, sorry, the bolts you chose are equivalent to grade 5 standard bolts made from heat treated medium carbon steel.

My bolt preference would be Class 10.9 which introduces alloys which gives more strength. I think there is somewhere close to 7,000lbs pressing down on those bolts. I'd round the ends to fit the keys which will keep the force as close to the center of the bolts as possible for strength.

A "lift key" should be indexed so as to not need a longer bolt to get the required lift.

Yes the lift key would do that but if you read I stated my bars are sagged thus the longer bolt needed for regaining the initial lift.

 

[Fix4Dirt]

Yes the lift key would do that but if you read I stated my bars are sagged thus the longer bolt needed for regaining the initial lift.

same here, cranked the bar all the way, sagged back, so added lift keys. so far thieve needed a few adjustments too, but i still got more to go. someday may need longer bolts too who knows

 

[DintDobbs]

@VWbaja10 Thanks for the pics, this is the thread this forum needed for the last 20 years in order to explain why you need lift keys to re-index the bars, rather than cranking the bolts. Re-indexed keys keep all the angles in spec, while giving you a higher passive stance. Cranking the bars, and particularly cranking with longer bolts, changes the angles beyond design specifications.

Lift keys finally won the argument once and for all.

 

[Blown]

If lift keys don't allow enough height then some better used "B" springs would do it safer and better, not longer bolts. The further you crank-up bolts beyond the stock length, the more you angle you put between the key and bolt. That is side loading the bolt more and more the higher you go.

 

[VWbaja10]

If lift keys don't allow enough height then some better used "B" springs would do it safer and better, not longer bolts. The further you crank-up bolts beyond the stock length, the more you angle you put between the key and bolt. That is side loading the bolt more and more the higher you go.

There’s no way to truly test a set of used torsions from a junk yard. And new ones are not available. Longer bolts are what is being used until I coilover conversion or ttb swap.

 

[Fix4Dirt]

There’s no way to truly test a set of used torsions from a junk yard. And new ones are not available. Longer bolts are what is being used until I coilover conversion or ttb swap.

im 99% sure B bars are available. i can find 1 rated bars at least https://parts.ford.com/shop/en/us/suspension/chassis-parts/bar-torsion-7885505-1?pdp=y

 

[Blown]

I hope they work just fine for ya.

If a bolt folds, the truck drops and the wheel stuffed into the fender quits turning while it tears out your fender, oh well, no worries, and no good reason to do your lift as safe as you can. Caution, this is not an upgrade but a down grade to longer, weaker bolts which you are side-loading by turning them in too far and not rounding the ends to fit the key..........................

 

[VWbaja10]

im 99% sure B bars are available. i can find 1 rated bars at least https://parts.ford.com/shop/en/us/suspension/chassis-parts/bar-torsion-7885505-1?pdp=y

All my friends that have access to parts came back with discontinued bars for my 2000

 

[VWbaja10]

I hope they work just fine for ya.

If a bolt folds, the truck drops and the wheel stuffed into the fender quits turning while it tears out your fender, oh well, no worries, and no good reason to do your lift as safe as you can. Caution, this is not an upgrade but a down grade to longer, weaker bolts which you are side-loading by turning them in too far and not rounding the ends to fit the key..........................

I feel like you didn’t read anything I wrote and just want to speak. Because I mentioned I will get shorter bolts and be grade 10.9. If a bolt fails then it fails no big problem. I’d rather have a torsion bolt fail vs a balljoint failure that can do more damage all around.

 

[Turdle]

Seems like you aren't reading and just want to speak,


against experienced advice and recommend to others do the same.

 

[Fix4Dirt]

Sounds like you aren't reading and just want to speak,


against experienced advice and recommend to others do the same.

sounds like my memory! i rememebr only the things i want to

 

[Blown]

Dude, Your getting rude now. I don't post to post. I don't need your attention but those who would follow your "Upgrade" post. 3" is too much lift for stock axles and kills down travel.

A consensus builds over time and you are outside the parameters of what many here would consider safe. You dismiss the knowledge here and post an "upgrade" which is not an upgrade but questionable. Gets some better torsion bars or actually use a lift key with a stock bolt designed for this.

Did you upgrade shocks since it is lifted and running 33's? Running 33's, did you upgrade gears? Do you know how fast you are driving? Did you think about a brake upgrade? How much down travel do you have left? Don't expect the CV's to last.

I post here and take my time due to this not being an upgrade or fix but IMHO, a band-aid.

 

[Fix4Dirt]

All my friends that have access to parts came back with discontinued bars for my 2000

interesting it lets me order one...