Water pump failure leads to dead engine

[ExPlat]

The water pump just failed on my 2016 @ 44K miles. Timing chain & tensioner required replacement too. They also found that the valve cover was cracked so they replaced that. All covered under Ford ESP.
Yes, I’m really glad I bought that Ford ESP! There are only a few months left of it.

The extended, extended Ford ESP coverage on my 2016 Platinum (51k miles) ends next August. I've owned this car for over 8 years and had many, many warranty repairs, but this water pump problem hasn't popped up yet.
These vehicles have so many great features, it's the perfect size for our lifestyle and still looks upscale to me - but - to have this kind of mechanical failure (and others) looming ahead sort of takes the fun out of owning it. If there was a reasonable way to do preventative maintenance on this I'd do it, it's not very logical to tear a 50k mile motor apart though.
I have a big decision to make in the next 8 months. Nuts...

 

[texsn95]

92k, I just had to add a quart to my puke tank to get it back up to the cold line, so it's going somewhere. Sometime this summer I made a mark about an inch below the 'cold' line, and it had dropped down to the neck of the tank when I checked and added to it a few days ago. No indications of any external dripping, yet the oil looks fine, from the dipstick at least. Without reading back through this whole thread, if it is leaking into the motor, I wonder if there are any performance issues or indications that the coolant is indeed mixing with the oil, will it throw any codes or just all of a sudden seize up when a bearing spins? It's going in on Monday, not only for that but for the front-end clunking, so hopefully the ESP will cover some from control arms. The service advisor said they'd pressure test it, but said "I expect it to be fine, since you aren't having any performance issues". Me "well the coolant has got to be going somewhere, b/c 1 quart is alot". So we'll see.

 

[texsn95]

After adding the quart of coolant, I drew a grease mark on the tank, and a week later it was already down another inch from it. So it's got to be going somewhere, and I just dropped it off at the dealer. Oil didn't look milky and me and a bud did our own crackle test, but I think we had it too hot, so it was hard to tell if it was the oil cooking off or if it was the embedded water boiling out.

 

[Turdle]

After adding the quart of coolant, I drew a grease mark on the tank, and a week later it was already down another inch from it. So it's got to be going somewhere, and I just dropped it off at the dealer. Oil didn't look milky and me and a bud did our own crackle test, but I think we had it too hot, so it was hard to tell if it was the oil cooking off or if it was the embedded water boiling out.

I wonder if the intercooler pathway can leak steam, just throwing that thought in.
What does the underside of oil fill cap look like? Any sign of moisture there?

 

[texsn95]

Good news, it was diagnosed as needing a new water pump, motor mounts, and front LCAs. Need to figure out which and how many LCAs, hopefully it's all of them. Said they had to send off for WEPA approval, whatever that means. I guess it's a dollar amount threshold coupled with the other items. Other than the serpentine belt, what are some other items to get swapped out? Timing chain and guides? Will they only charge a parts cost since the labor is already baked into the water pump work?

I'm at 92k now, but noticed coolant dropping in the mid-upper 80s. Grab a grease pencil or sharpie and mark your puke tank coolant level when it's cold so you have a baseline, for those of you with this crappy design.

 

[peterk9]

Most members that have had the pump replaced also installed new a timing chain and guides. It would seem reasonable that you should only have to pay for those parts but I don't know how much labour would be involved in doing it. It might be best to get a written estimate first.
Good luck.

Peter

 

[texsn95]

Sure will, post 1178 says they replaced his chain and guides, so we'll see how it looks when they open it up.

 

[ExPlat]

Well, that was quick...
After noting in another thread here that the Explat was running nicely, I spotted coolant drops on the garage floor under the passenger side of the car engine. I'd marked the coolant puke tank at the proper level in the past and check it often, this time it was down about an inch. No milky oil, just a few coolant drops on the garage floor.
Yesterday when I returned home and checked the coolant level it was down to about 1" from the bottom of the coolant tank. No need to crawl under to inspect the water pump weep hole, I just made an appointment at my Dealer.

It's going to my Dealer to be diagnosed in two days.

 

[peterk9]

Well, that was quick...
After noting in another thread here that the Explat was running nicely, I spotted coolant drops on the garage floor under the passenger side of the car engine. I'd marked the coolant puke tank at the proper level in the past and check it often, this time it was down about an inch. No milky oil, just a few coolant drops on the garage floor.
Yesterday when I returned home and checked the coolant level it was down to about 1" from the bottom of the coolant tank. No need to crawl under to inspect the water pump weep hole, I just made an appointment at my Dealer.

It's going to my Dealer to be diagnosed in two days.

Have you checked the oil on the dipstick to see if it's been contaminated (milky looking)? I wouldn't drive it too much since once the coolant enters the engine, it could be a costly repair.

Peter

 

[Mike D S]

Well, that was quick...
After noting in another thread here that the Explat was running nicely, I spotted coolant drops on the garage floor under the passenger side of the car engine. I'd marked the coolant puke tank at the proper level in the past and check it often, this time it was down about an inch. No milky oil, just a few coolant drops on the garage floor.
Yesterday when I returned home and checked the coolant level it was down to about 1" from the bottom of the coolant tank. No need to crawl under to inspect the water pump weep hole, I just made an appointment at my Dealer.

It's going to my Dealer to be diagnosed in two days.

Not to doom and gloom from the get go, but be prepared for a fairly serious quote. In my case they wouldn't do the water pump without replacing the timing chain and associated parts. So while the water pump wasn't too bad and the labor was high but at least understandable adding the costs of the OEM timing set added about 40% to the quote. I ended up doing DIY but if I had to do it again I probably would have looked for a small local shop willing to do the job with the aftermarket parts I ended up using.

Now if you have some type of service plan or something then this may not be an issue for you.

 

[peterk9]

Not to doom and gloom from the get go, but be prepared for a fairly serious quote. In my case they wouldn't do the water pump without replacing the timing chain and associated parts. So while the water pump wasn't too bad and the labor was high but at least understandable adding the costs of the OEM timing set added about 40% to the quote. I ended up doing DIY but if I had to do it again I probably would have looked for a small local shop willing to do the job with the aftermarket parts I ended up using.

Now if you have some type of service plan or something then this may not be an issue for you.

It is a very good idea to do the timing chain and parts when you have the water pump exposed. I believe that most if not everyone has done that.

Peter

 

[EB4X]

I've heard of some local shops doing the whole job, parts and labor.. w/chain for around $1,200 total...granted quite possibly after market parts. Secondly, I don't own any of these internal water pump engines...but here's some good info (I feel) to pass on:

"The first gen duratec 3.5/3.7 WP had a single row of teeth with a different style timing chain driving the pump and those are the ones where the shaft bearing lets go and the coolant floods by the seal and into the oil pan. Late 2011 models and up they updated it to two rows of teeth and use a double roller chain. I've NEVER seen one of those fail catastrophically." << ON THIS THE BEARING CAN STILL FAIL letting coolant into engine...just much rarer due to mentioned design upgrade.

AND THIS V V V

 

[boominXplorer]

^^^ Yes, the later model does not fail as quickly as the earlier one. The earlier one likes to intermix but most of those are in edges, fusions ect. 2011 was the change year so I don't think many if any explorers have the early setup. If you run one leaking long enough, it will absolutely obliterate itself no matter the version.

I do the water pump and chain replacement with oem parts for around $1350 for any n/a 3.5 3.7 explorer in my shop. Most the time I end up adding in spark plugs, belt and tensioner which brings it a hair over the $1500 mark.

 

[Mike D S]

I agree, the timing gear should be replaced and thats what I did when I changed my WP. The issue I had was the dealer quoted me something like an extra $1200 for the Ford timing parts and the name brand local shop was about the same at around $1000. I was able to get the Cloyes kit for a few hundred. So going to a local shop who'll put in reasonable cost parts will get you into a more reasonable repair cost.

 

[ExPlat]

Have you checked the oil on the dipstick to see if it's been contaminated (milky looking)? I wouldn't drive it too much since once the coolant enters the engine, it could be a costly repair.

Ya, sure I did, no apparent coolant in the oil. I'll drive it the 8 miles to the Dealer, fingers crossed.

As far as the cost to repair, I have 6 months left on my extended Ford PremiumCare ESP Warranty with $100 deductible. I'll report back in a few days what repairs are needed. This Dealer has an Engine Shop that repairs Shelby, Roush and Tuscany supercars so I feel they might be a good place to go for repairs.

 

[EB4X]

As far as the cost to repair, I have 6 months left on my extended Ford PremiumCare ESP Warranty with $100 deductible.

/\ SCORE ! ! /\

 

[cober]

dude I got additional gauge for warning if temperature goes higher than normal and it saved me when my water pump started leaking last summer and I advise it for everyone but not whining

 

[ocracokeBound]

The extended, extended Ford ESP coverage on my 2016 Platinum (51k miles) ends next August. I've owned this car for over 8 years and had many, many warranty repairs, but this water pump problem hasn't popped up yet.
These vehicles have so many great features, it's the perfect size for our lifestyle and still looks upscale to me - but - to have this kind of mechanical failure (and others) looming ahead sort of takes the fun out of owning it. If there was a reasonable way to do preventative maintenance on this I'd do it, it's not very logical to tear a 50k mile motor apart though.
I have a big decision to make in the next 8 months. Nuts...

You only have 51k I think the chances of the happening at that milage is quite low. Keep in mind that the pump is being driven by the timing chain, so there is not the pressure on the bearing that you would have with a belt driven pump. I waited until 175k on my 2013, have put another 50k miles

 

[ExPlat]

You only have 51k I think the chances of the happening at that milage is quite low. Keep in mind that the pump is being driven by the timing chain, so there is not the pressure on the bearing that you would have with a belt driven pump. I waited until 175k on my 2013, have put another 50k miles

Yes, one might think that at 51k miles a water pump failure would be rare. However, within the last 6 months my Explorer is the 3rd to be reported on this Forum with under 55k miles driven on them. See Post 1,165 @ 54k and Post 1,178 @ 44k miles, then mine @51k miles, There was a 4th reported but that one was 92k miles.
That is just what is reported here, how many others fail out in the wild no one knows, but rare/low chance of it happening? Maybe not.

 

[Mike D S]

If I were to offer up a theory, there are the reported failures which trash the engine which presumably might be shaft seal leaks. But the weep hole leaks are gasket failures for non-moving parts. Might be more related to heat cycles and gasket deterioration than mileage. Not to say someone can't get to 175k miles taking 1 and 2 mile trips, but I could see a car with 51k miles built on 2 mile trips having as many start stop cycles as a vehicle with 175k mostly highway miles.

So maybe not as surprising even on low mileage vehicles if they are regular drivers.