5.0 timing cover removal struggle

[Mitchs07explorer]

Just get all of the big stuff that falls in, the oil pump pickup screen has holes that are about 1/16", and tiny fabric of gasket material probably wouldn't hurt the pump, but it could cover the screen if there was much of it. You're being careful so go slow and it shouldn't be any trouble.

BTW, WD40 is something you can buy in gallon containers, and parts stores also carry some kinds of spray cans for it, or anything you might want to put into it. The Marvel Mystery oil is a great thing for using inside an engine, spraying prior to starting an old stored engine etc. I don't have that myself handy, but that is easy to get if something else wasn't handy.

The only big pieces that fell were 2 pieces of gasket then several little bits of engine grime. I'm thinking I might try my shopvac with a narrow attachment it might be the perfect size. I'll check out that marvel mystery oil too thanks for the heads up on that.

 

[CDW6212R]

Oh, with a shop vac, you can also use a small hose to get little stuff. For my blower motor box, pine needles, I used a 3/8" hose I have for fuel siphoning etc. I just cut a short piece and held it by hand in the vacuum hose, plenty of suction to get anything.

 

[Mitchs07explorer]

Oh, with a shop vac, you can also use a small hose to get little stuff. For my blower motor box, pine needles, I used a 3/8" hose I have for fuel siphoning etc. I just cut a short piece and held it by hand in the vacuum hose, plenty of suction to get anything.

Great idea! I have a piece of garden hose I can use.

 

[Mitchs07explorer]

Oh, with a shop vac, you can also use a small hose to get little stuff. For my blower motor box, pine needles, I used a 3/8" hose I have for fuel siphoning etc. I just cut a short piece and held it by hand in the vacuum hose, plenty of suction to get anything.

Hose idea worked perfectly and I got everything out

 

[CDW6212R]

Cool, tools you come up with yourself, make or break some projects.

 

[Mitchs07explorer]

The area is all cleaned up, new timing chain and and sprockets are installed. The oil pan gasket showed up today as well as the Ultra black RTV. I took a good look around the pan and the bolt locations, I'm less optimistic about replacing the gasket after really noticing how little maneuverability I'll have. I'm also unsure about the flexibility of pan gasket itself. im still going to clean off all the oil and grime on the underside and retighten everything first, I'll see how far that gets me.

 

[Mitchs07explorer]

I think I just made a part costing mistake... I finally found some free time to work on the explorer. I've opted to live with the oil leak for now and see if I can make a little flap/hood to go over the exhaust that will allow the leaking oil to avoid direct contact with the exhaust so there's no oil burning oil smell. So I cleaned the timing cover because it was completely covered in road grime and I started to scrape the remnants of the old gasket off and it just wouldn't come off. So here's where I believe I made my mistake, I took a steel wire brush for my drill and I clean the rest of the gasket off. The steel wires left brush marks/ very little grooves where I cleaned off the gasket, noticing I made things a little rougher I took some very fine sandpaper and a flat block and went around where the gaskets goes to smooth things out. The surface feels pretty smooth to the touch but I just don't know how strict the tolerances are for these gaskets and gasket surfaces. I don't want to put everything back together only to realize after the fact I've got leaks around the cover. I'll take a picture of the cover tomorrow if that will help determine if I've screwed it up or if it's okay. Anyone know how forgiving these gaskets surfaces and gaskets can be? I mean in some areas the original cast isn't that clean and there appears to be pits in the metal so that leads me to believe it'll be okay but if anyone more knowledgeable knows please chime in.

 

[fast_dave]

In this situation, this is your new friend ;-)

Although it can be used to replace a gasket, use it with your gasket.

Coat both sides of the gasket, slather it on.

Make sure all metal surfaces are wiped clean of oil with brake cleaner and clean high nap rags (like the inside of a tube sock) to get all the oil in the peaks and valleys .

New style packaging is on top, old style packaging on the bottom.

Both are the same product - none better - it will save your a**

 

[roscoe 0202]

I wouldn't slather it on too thick I've seen engines destroyed from that stuff getting into where it shouldn't be just a skim coat on gasket stick it to the engine block then skim coat on gasket
roscoe

 

[fast_dave]

I wouldn't slather it on too thick I've seen engines destroyed from that stuff getting into where it shouldn't be just a skim coat on gasket stick it to the engine block then skim coat on gasket
roscoe

Yeah - my interpretation of slather and someone eleses' may be totally different ;-)

 

[CDW6212R]

Ditto, any Ultra RTV will easily seal the timing cover and gasket. You only want enough that will squeeze out about an 1/8" bead along the edges, just like doing a diff/cover.

 

[Mitchs07explorer]

thanks again for everyone's input, everything went back together smoothly. I was able to clean up the harmonic balancer and reinstall that and properly torque the pulley bolt. I know all my surfaces were clean the only spot I was slightly concerned with was the RTV in the woodruff key slot, but I'm probably just being paranoid.

Next step is the waterpump, camshaft position sensor and synchronizer then I can start the engine. after that and see if there are any leaks, hopefully everything holds.

 

[blakshukvw]

Reviving this thread..Mitch how did the reassembly go for you? I’m looking at needing to reseal my timing cover due to coolant leaks from the water passages externally leaking. I don’t plan on lowering the pan, just removing the tc to pan bolts. Will I face an issue pushing the tc back over the dowels? My plan to reseal at the pan/tc union is to put rtv on the face of the block and through the corner and onto the pan gasket. Sound reasonable?

 

[CDW6212R]

I did mine last year due to leaking of the TC, from a prior WP repair that they failed to seal the TC properly.

You have to clean the oil pan surface and gaskets extremely well. Mine has the factory gasket, I loosened the oil pan bolts(about three along the each side), and couldn't get the pan to come down at all. My 98 has the aluminum pan, it's very stiff.

Take lots of care with the bolts, make sure they are all the proper length and with good threads. Clean everything very well, file the TC as needed to be sure it's flat around the coolant holes, so it seals fully. I used High Tack Spray for the gasket, with Ultra Black RTV along the oil pan and under the gasket areas. I used a screw driver to lift the gasket to force RTV under it well.

Don't waste time with pipe thread sealant etc, the bolts do not enter any coolant passages(that's BS). Do coat the entire bolt of those long ones going through the TC, the shanks are what seize to the aluminum TC, as it corrodes and builds up onto the bolts.

Plan the assembly carefully, have it all ready to go before starting, with nothing dirty hanging down in the engine bay to foul things up. Don't try to torque the bolts too tight, it can be done fine by hand, if you use your hand/wrist strength, not your arm. If everything is clean and fits together well, it shouldn't leak and last a long time.

 

[blakshukvw]

I did mine last year due to leaking of the TC, from a prior WP repair that they failed to seal the TC properly.

You have to clean the oil pan surface and gaskets extremely well. Mine has the factory gasket, I loosened the oil pan bolts(about three along the each side), and couldn't get the pan to come down at all. My 98 has the aluminum pan, it's very stiff.

Take lots of care with the bolts, make sure they are all the proper length and with good threads. Clean everything very well, file the TC as needed to be sure it's flat around the coolant holes, so it seals fully. I used High Tack Spray for the gasket, with Ultra Black RTV along the oil pan and under the gasket areas. I used a screw driver to lift the gasket to force RTV under it well.

Don't waste time with pipe thread sealant etc, the bolts do not enter any coolant passages(that's BS). Do coat the entire bolt of those long ones going through the TC, the shanks are what seize to the aluminum TC, as it corrodes and builds up onto the bolts.

Plan the assembly carefully, have it all ready to go before starting, with nothing dirty hanging down in the engine bay to foul things up. Don't try to torque the bolts too tight, it can be done fine by hand, if you use your hand/wrist strength, not your arm. If everything is clean and fits together well, it shouldn't leak and last a long time.

Good to see you’re still on here.
My pan gasket is og too. I’ll clean under it best I can. So you’re saying to squeeze some rtv under the front of the pan gasket as well as on top? That makes sense. Did you run rtv in the corner of the pan gasket up the tc just a tad to seal that union?
I replaced the water pump last year and the bolts had sealant on them. I cleaned them up and used new thread sealer and anti seize on the shanks. I’ve always read that the tc bolts went through water jackets. mine came out just fine so I don’t expect any issues there. Everything else you said makes perfect sense to me.

 

[CDW6212R]

The good original pan gaskets are a metal side piece that is coated with rubber. The steel is great, but the rubber coating will be damaged slightly by the removal process of the timing cover. If new RTV isn't applied completely to where the old rubber material breaks free of the steel, that is likely to leak. So I gently pried up the metal enough to apply RTV under it, I used a small thin screwdriver to carefully spread the RTV under the steel ends. It should just barely displace the RTV at the corner of the block, which tells you it has enough under it. Use brake cleaner to clean everything well before beginning the RTV etc.

I coated all of the bolt threads with anti-seize, plus the shanks of all the long ones that go through the wide part of the TC. The top short ones aren't a problem.

 

[410Fortune]

When you re install the timing cover first chase the threads on all the bolts especially the 5/16 ones that go into the water jacket

You just use thread sealant or tons of anti seize on the 4 bolts that go into the water jacket

If you try to do the oil pan gasket in the truck consider cutting the new gasket at the front timing cover
Makes it about 100000000 times easier to actually install new oil pan gasket with the pan only dropped an inch or two

 

[410Fortune]

I have also made a metal shield for two or three trucks that deflect the leaking oil from the rear main seal so it does not drip directly into the converter….’works awesome

 

[fast_dave]

@blakshukvw

I offer up the following advice that was the result of hours of research on various FORD engine rebuild forums when I had to re-do my TC Gasket a 2nd time, only a few years after the 1st install.

OK - If the 5.0 TC design is similar to the 4.0 OHV TC design, I suggest the following sequential order of re-assembly.

1st - Hand install ALL TC Bolts - BUT do NOT torque any of them down.

Then, begin the torque down process by torqueing down all of the bolts that interconnect the BOTTOM of the TC to the front of the Oil Pan 1st.
.
After all of the "bottom bolts" are torqued down, then torque down the bolts on the face of the timing cover, in an alternating pattern that distributes the torque evenly. over the face to the TC.

This technique will pull down the TC Gasket right from the get go so that after assembly/multiple heat cycles the gasket doesn't slip down and thus crack or tear.

Hope I'm clear and HTH!

 

[blakshukvw]

What’s this talk about rtv in the woodruff key slot?