Removing timing cover on 4.0 OHV

[RussAdams]

4th of July update:

I have all the parts back off again. There is no obvious blowout of this Mahle gasket:

The cast iron block does show some pitting. This is after I sanded it lightly with 1500 grit sandpaper and a sanding block:

The aluminum cover also shows signs of pitting. Again after I lightly sanded using 1500 grit and a block:

Any recommendations on where to go from here?

I was thinking I'd apply a small bead of Copper RTV and put it all together again. But do these pits look too big to seal?

Thanks in advance, and Happy Independence day to all!

 

[donalds]

I'd go rtv with a new gasket

 

[RussAdams]

I'd go rtv with a new gasket

Thanks Donalds!

I have a new FEL-PRO TCS 45867 Timing Cover Gasket Set.

And will use permatex copper rtv.

 

[410Fortune]

Why copper? This is a water jacket I would use etc made for coming in contact with coolant… I’m not saying the copper won’t work I’m just wondering why you want to use it here. Permatex copper is basically made for exhaust and turbos. They do make a special formula just for waterpump and thermostats…

Permatex® Water Pump & Thermostat RTV Silicone Gasket Maker, .5 OZ - Permatex®

www.permatex.com

I’ve always just used red for water or grey/black for everything on the engine

Don’t use the spray, it’s great for holding gaskets while you set them, but not thick enough to seal nicks and imperfections in the metal

The pitting you are showing is nothing to be worried about imo they are all like this (at this age) and some of them much worse

I use permatex ultra grey or
Black and do a light film on both sides of the gasket… I don’t like leaks. Make sure you press in a new front main seal and lube the gasket with Vaseline before installing the balancer

The corners where the timing cover meets the oil pan and engine
Block need the most attention, lost of cleaning, then a blob of permatex, then insert the gasket, then a little more permatex and then seat…

 

[Brian1]

I highly suggest using the Ford OEM gasket F0tz-6020-a It is not that expensive and is a much better gasket than the FelPro and Mahle. Ive done this job about 4 times now (on 3 different OHVs) and I learned my lesson the first time using the FelPro, it did not last.

The pitting and sealing surface doesn't look too bad, Ive definitely seen worse. Clean it up as good as you can and use the Ford Gasket with RTV only around the oil pan corner and bottom flange and let the Ford gasket do the rest.

 

[RussAdams]

Why copper? This is a water jacket I would use etc made for coming in contact with coolant… I’m not saying the copper won’t work I’m just wondering why you want to use it here. Permatex copper is basically made for exhaust and turbos. They do make a special formula just for waterpump and thermostats…

Permatex® Water Pump & Thermostat RTV Silicone Gasket Maker, .5 OZ - Permatex®

www.permatex.com

I’ve always just used red for water or grey/black for everything on the engine

Don’t use the spray, it’s great for holding gaskets while you set them, but not thick enough to seal nicks and imperfections in the metal

The pitting you are showing is nothing to be worried about imo they are all like this (at this age) and some of them much worse

I use permatex ultra grey or
Black and do a light film on both sides of the gasket… I don’t like leaks. Make sure you press in a new front main seal and lube the gasket with Vaseline before installing the balancer

The corners where the timing cover meets the oil pan and engine
Block need the most attention, lost of cleaning, then a blob of permatex, then insert the gasket, then a little more permatex and then seat…

I'm using copper based on recommendations here and at the Ranger Station. People's opinions are that the copper is the strongest and longest lasting.

I used the spray the first time, couple weeks back. It didn't last a day. Lesson learned.

Thanks about the comment on the pitting. I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Yesterday, July 5th, I used a two-ish mm bead of rtv all around the gasket and then a putty knife to get a nice even, thin, spread of rtv. Flipped the gasket over and repeated the process. Then set it on the cover and put in a couple of the top screws to hold it in place. Aligned the cover and gasket to the block and put in the bottom 5 bolts finger tight, then all the rest of the bolts again finger tight. Torqued the bottom 5 first, in two goes. Then used a star pattern to tighten the 11 upper bolts in three goes. I followed fastdaves torque recommendations.

Today I put the thermostat and casing back on. Then put the Crank pully back on. Interesting 'click' when I did the 90 degree second torque.

It's too hot to work more than a couple hours in the morning. I'm in Northern Virginia, and the truck is in my driveway outside the garage. So I can only put up with the hours when it's in the shade.

More tomorrow!

Russ

 

[RussAdams]

I highly suggest using the Ford OEM gasket F0tz-6020-a It is not that expensive and is a much better gasket than the FelPro and Mahle. Ive done this job about 4 times now (on 3 different OHVs) and I learned my lesson the first time using the FelPro, it did not last.

The pitting and sealing surface doesn't look too bad, Ive definitely seen worse. Clean it up as good as you can and use the Ford Gasket with RTV only around the oil pan corner and bottom flange and let the Ford gasket do the rest.

Thanks for the advice and sharing your experience Brian1!

I'm using the FelPro because it's a tad thicker than the Ford or Mahle. I used the Mahle the first time a couple weeks back. I sprayed copper permatex from a can on the Mahle. It didn't last a day. Upon taking it apart, the gasket itself looked fine. No signs of it failing. Interestingly it seems to have a metal center. Not sure if that's what kept it from sealing.

I spread copper rtv on both sides of the FelPro before assembling.

Keeping my fingers crossed!

Russ

 

[RussAdams]

I highly suggest using the Ford OEM gasket F0tz-6020-a

Searching for this gasket I found that it's actually part number "FOTZ-6020-A". That's F oh, not F zero. But I found it at several places.

It's only sold in packages of FOUR. Ummmm. Interesting.

Russ

EDIT: I finally found just one for sale. $3.00 plus shipping.

 

[RussAdams]

July 8 2024 update

Everything is back together. Started the engine, lo and behold there's still a big leak. Immediately turned the engine off and looked for the leak. It is NOT from the engine cover. I checked all around the cover with a uv light and nothing is coming from there.

Could this much coolant be coming from the driver's side lower coolant sensor?

 

[RussAdams]

July 17 2024 update:

I found my leak. It was from a blown intake manifold gasket.

Here's the hint photo. You can see the orange gasket seal on the left, and the uv activated green above it to the right.

I initially thought it might be the head gasket, but once I removed the intake I could see it was leaking from the intake gasket not the head gasket.

Closeup of the blown intake manifold gasket

Lucky that it was just a gasket and not the manifold itself or a warped head!

I pulled both heads and will replace head gaskets as well as all intake gaskets while I'm here. I bought an EngineTech gasket set.

The pushrods were pretty worn, so I'm going to replace them and lifters while I have the engine apart. I can see cross hash marks on the inside of the cylinder walls, so this engine has definitely been rebuilt at some point. The valves all look good too. The EngineTech gasket set included valve seals so "while it's apart"...

Thanks for everyone's support!

Russ

Unhappy to get the leak, but happy to see good signs of engine interior, top end at least.