1999 Mounty 5.0 aka My Great Bad Idea

[97Sandbox]

I'm glad to see that you have it supported. When it comes loose, watch out.

Yes, it's strapped tight to the transmission jack.

Now is there a way to get something thicker than a putty knife in there between the block and transmission case?

I don't think there's room for a prybar, but I'm thinking of trying with a chisel.

I've never seen small block dowels hold on that tight.

This is what's worrying me. I've pulled two M5R2 transmissions which use the same dowels and never had an issue like this. The torque converter nuts was a miss, but could there be anything else specific to the auto trans ?

 

[allmyEXes]

If you have 2 access cover bolts, 4 converter nuts, 2 starter bolts and 6 bell housing bolts, I think that is all of them. I was wondering if you
could jam a short piece of 2x4 between the back top edge of the block against the cowl/floor to hold the engine while you jack up against
the tail end of the transmission?
Can you slide the converter back and forth? Like not stuck in the crankshaft?

 

[97Sandbox]

I was wondering if you could jam a short piece of 2x4 between the back top edge of the block against the cowl/floor to hold the engine while you jack up against
the tail end of the transmission?

I may be able to sneak a 2x4 in via the area behind the driver side header. It'll be pretty much blind though. You're thinking if the engine didn't tip, jacking the trans would essentially pry it off the block?

If you have 2 access cover bolts, 4 converter nuts, 2 starter bolts and 6 bell housing bolts, I think that is all of them. I was wondering if you
could jam a short piece of 2x4 between the back top edge of the block against the cowl/floor to hold the engine while you jack up against
the tail end of the transmission?
Can you slide the converter back and forth? Like not stuck in the crankshaft?

Should I be able to push the TC studs out of the flex plate with the trans still in place? I tried that last night and the studs were not pushing back. Maybe they've gotten hung up in the flex plate holes and that's what's giving me so much trouble.

 

[CDW6212R]

The TC you should be possible to move back and forth, though it'd be tough to get leverage to make it move. If the TC and all bolts seem to be free and out, it should take just the right force to pry the engine and trans apart.

 

[97Sandbox]

Can I wedge a prybar between the TC and flex plate if I sneak it through that grommet hole in the bottom of the trans bell housing? That seems like one way I might actually get some leverage.

 

[CDW6212R]

That probably won't help because the flexplate will flex so much. I'd bet it'll flex forward all the way to the block before the trans would move. I think it needs more force than you put through the flexplate.

That's tough, finding a prying spot to separate two big parts like the engine and trans. The front diff cover is a smaller example of that. you have to pond a screw driver into the seam of the cover to force it in between, giving the needed leverage to get it apart.

Keep looking at it from all angles, imagine where to stick a tool in to apply force or pry it apart.

 

[97Sandbox]

Sounds good. I'll try my chisel idea when I'm home later. If I can open a gap big enough for a prybar, I'm sure that'll do it. There's just nothing to pry against right now.

 

[97Sandbox]

Chisel worked to open enough of a gap to get the prybar in, the prybar eventually overcame the dowels. It really was just the dowels holding it in!

All this time I'd been blaming the rear main seal, looks like the oil pan gasket is the worse offender:

Would re-torquing the pan help any, or do I just live with the leak till the engine comes out? I'll replace the rear main while I'm in here regardless.

Thank you all for helping me through this!

 

[Turdle]

If it's loose yes, it won't hurt to tighten it back up.

Good job!

 

[allmyEXes]

If you weren't so far away, I'd take that 4R70W core off of your hands for a future Explorer 351W project.
I started to offer to come help you get it out of the truck the rest of the way but distance you know. You don't realize how spread
out the US is until you start checking where all of you different guys are at. @Josh P Josh is over in Phoenix 1650 from me, @410Fortune
Jamie is 2200, @97Sandbox your only ~900, that's a bit of a trip too, lol.

 

[97Sandbox]

Yes, that'd be quite a trek for an okayish 4R70. It did work fine, but has over 190k miles on it. I'm pretty sure the 4404 is toast and probably going in my scrap pile.

The trans/transfer case core will only get me $40 at my local salvage yard, so I'll probably list it on marketplace for $100 and hope someone offers at least $50 haha. After I take all the brackets, hardware, and harness that is.

 

[Josh P]

Seems like the country gets wider with each trip I take across it. @allmyEXes you got my attention with this 351 explorer project.

 

[410Fortune]

The only 4404 t case to keep would be a 96/97 with the vss in the back half. Super valuable to somebody who needs one to keep their 302’sploder going

190k on a 4r70w lol I know a few guys who would still run that sucker especially for $50! Hahaha

 

[97Sandbox]

"ran when pulled"

 

[allmyEXes]

"pulled when ran"

 

[Josh P]

"pulled when ran"

That's what
-She

 

[fast_dave]

@97Sandbox

Just sayin'

SERIOUSLY - That RMS (Rear Main Seal) looks really, really good and dry!

If it were mine, I wouldn't F with it and chance opening up Pandora's Box.

IMHO - when you have a good one, leave it alone.

From the excellent pic, the Oil Pan Gasket is your problem...

80% of the job will be your cleaning and surface prep.

Clean out all the oil pan bolt holes with round nylon brushes and carb cleaner before re-assembly.

Hi-Nap cotton material (rags & inside out tube socks), nitrile gloves and carb cleaner are your best friends -

Let us know what you decide & good luck

 

[97Sandbox]

I was under the impression these 5.0s needed to be lifted from above in order for the pan to come off and that's why I was going to just try re-torquing and calling it a day. I don't have a hoist. But if I can replace the gasket from below, I'd like to try because access is probably better now with the trans out than it would be any other time. Can any of you 5.0 guys confirm?

 

[Josh P]

@97Sandbox

Just sayin'

SERIOUSLY - That RMS (Rear Main Seal) looks really, really good and dry!

If it were mine, I wouldn't F with it and chance opening up Pandora's Box.

IMHO - when you have a good one, leave it alone.

From the excellent pic, the Oil Pan Gasket is your problem...

80% of the job will be your cleaning and surface prep.

Clean out all the oil pan bolt holes with round nylon brushes and card cleaner before re-assembly.

Hi-Nap cotton material (rags & inside out tube socks), nitrile gloves and carb cleaner are your best friends -

Let us know what you decide & good luck

If you have my luck, 2 weeks after it's on the road, the seal lets go.

 

[CDW6212R]

I would replace the front and rear seals if possible, age kills the rubber and the rear is no matter what very hard now.

The oil pan, with access to the rear bolts, you should be able to loosen all of them. So the bolts don't need to come out fully or do if you can get them back in without trouble.

Check the bolts first to learn how loose they may be. If they were somewhat loose, then the gasket seal may be fine and tightening the bolts might solve the leak. If the bolts were fairly tight, then the sealing surfaces are likely damaged, and tightening the bolts won't be a full answer.

The pan won't drop enough to easily change the entire seal assembly. I'd suggest for that, get the pan down some so you can clean the gasket surfaces well. Then slowly place enough of an RTV layer on the block and pan surfaces, even just along the edge where it's hard to reach. Then tightening the bolts ought to come close to sealing the whole pan. That's hit or miss, a little luck needed, like sealing the back edge of an intake manifold without removing it(the gasket blown out). It can be done, but with a lot of patience and careful cleaning, RTV etc.