351 vs. 302

[rocket 5979]

This article shows it as the pushrod style block

http://www.leftlanenews.com/2006/10/31/ford-revives-boss-302-for-2007/

You could be right, but I don't believe any article with any tech info before the vehicle itself comes out. All sorts of hype this way and that. Though it may be a step back in technology it would be kind of cool to have a "real" BOSS 302. A modular BOSS 302 would put out a crapton of power compared to the pushrod counterpart, but I likes the idea of a pushrod in a Mustang again, very novel.

My guess is that it will be some sort of modular that displaces 302 ci. Heck, all they got to do is take the new version Ford 5.0 Cammer engine drop it in there and call it a day. I guess we will have to wait and see.

 

[MoabB2]

The new BOSS engines aren't going in any new vehicles that I know of. I think they are just going to be in the Ford Racing Catelog.

They should have just called the Cammer engine a BOSS. The new BOSS engines are just a marketing tool.

 

[arcticrick]

I'm pretty sure the new boss engine is of the pushrod design from the picture in fordracingparts.com. but what type of transmission would bolt to this new monster? I'm a fan of Ford but what are they thinking of trying to sell the 5.0l cammer engine for $14,000 thats alot of coin and there are lots of other engines making the same power for a lot less, with very good reputations, finally ford has gotten smart bringing back the BOSS, doesn't everyone need one?

 

[410Fortune]

the 5.0L and 4.6L share the same 4r70w transmission in the Explorer I believe

 

[rocket 5979]

the 5.0L and 4.6L share the same 4r70w transmission in the Explorer I believe

Yes and no... The 5.0 V8 uses the AOD-E where as the 4.6 V8 uses the 4R70W tranny. Both trannies are almost identical except for the bellhousing bolt pattern being different to allow one to bolt to the rear of the pushrod engine and the other to be able to bolt to the back of the modular one.

 

[410Fortune]

almost true, the AOD-EW used behind the 5.0L in the explorer is dubbed a 4r70w, this is what I have in my BII, the AOD-E became the 4r70w noce it was 100% computer controlled and got the wide ratio gear set, no more AOD-E.

yes it is a AOD bellhousing bolt pattern, but its all 4r70w as far as ford is concerned, it even uses the same tailhousing, which is what allows us to convert to the manual shift F-150/expedition transfer case.

so the 4.6L and 5.0L do not have the same bellhousing patterns? are you sure?

 

[rocket 5979]

almost true, the AOD-EW used behind the 5.0L in the explorer is dubbed a 4r70w, this is what I have in my BII, the AOD-E became the 4r70w noce it was 100% computer controlled and got the wide ratio gear set, no more AOD-E.

yes it is a AOD bellhousing bolt pattern, but its all 4r70w as far as ford is concerned, it even uses the same tailhousing, which is what allows us to convert to the manual shift F-150/expedition transfer case.

so the 4.6L and 5.0L do not have the same bellhousing patterns? are you sure?

The AOD-E and AOD-EW are soooooo similar that I don't even count them as being different being that they bolt to the same engines, the only diff being the planetary gear ratios. That is why I don't refer to the 5.0 V8 Explorer trannies as AOD-EW.

Once the switch from AOD to AOD-E hit is when they switched to being manual linkages to computer controlled.

Trust me, though your Explorer manual may say that your Explorer tranny is a 4R70W it is not. It is still an AOD-E. The 4R's have a different bellhousing bolt pattern that is not compatible with the pushrod engines, and vice versa. There are some other particular differences internally like certain parts heat treated differently but I usually focus on what I just said most often. Just like I had previously mentioned, the only real big difference between the 4R70W's and the AOD-E's are the different bellhousings. The reason why I make mention of the different bellhousing bolt patterns and not bother with defining the difference between the AOD-E and the AOD-EW is because the bolt pattern governs what applications that particular tranny can be used for where as the different planetary gear ratio may affect certain things, in terms of preference, it surely does not govern a persons ability to use them in any particular vehicle or engine.

 

[Dan Whitaker]

O.K. since we are on the subject of 4R70W/AOD-E transmissions is the linkage for the shifter the same as on an AOD?

I would like to put in a floor shifter & know that B&M makes an adapter to use one of their shifters on the AOD trannys.

I realize I would have to come up with something for the electric shifted OD but I would not think it would be that hard. I might even be able to use the B&M T-handle used for a roll control, trans brake, or nitrous.

 

[rocket 5979]

O.K. since we are on the subject of 4R70W/AOD-E transmissions is the linkage for the shifter the same as on an AOD?

I would like to put in a floor shifter & know that B&M makes an adapter to use one of their shifters on the AOD trannys.

I realize I would have to come up with something for the electric shifted OD but I would not think it would be that hard. I might even be able to use the B&M T-handle used for a roll control, trans brake, or nitrous.

I don't know offhand if it will be a direct replacement, but if not, I am confident it can be made to work with some modification. The OD button should be as simple as just installing a momentary push button switch to toggle the OD on and off.

If I were you just get a floor shifter meant for use on an AOD-E tranny. Plenty of them around and it will be a more guarantee'd fit to your tranny and wiring needs.

 

[everythintech]

I would go with the 302 if it were me. Yes the 351 is more powerful stock but there are a lot more high performance parts for a 302. HP 302 parts are a dime a dozen and you can get them anywhere. I think you could make power cheaper and easier with a 302. Makes your life a little easier.

but doesnt a 351 with added parts make more hp then a 302? i kinda think so. If this swap was gonna happen, why stay stock? a supercharged 393 will produce way more power then a supercharged 331.

 

[Dan Whitaker]

I'll have to crawl under my '92 Cougar with the AOD and see how they compare.

 

[MoabB2]

So am I hearing this right? Explorers didn't have the 4R70W? 4R70W's are only on Modulars?

I think we have officially hi-jacked this thread. Nice work guys.

The AOD-E and AOD-EW are soooooo similar that I don't even count them as being different being that they bolt to the same engines, the only diff being the planetary gear ratios. That is why I don't refer to the 5.0 V8 Explorer trannies as AOD-EW.

Once the switch from AOD to AOD-E hit is when they switched to being manual linkages to computer controlled.

Trust me, though your Explorer manual may say that your Explorer tranny is a 4R70W it is not. It is still an AOD-E. The 4R's have a different bellhousing bolt pattern that is not compatible with the pushrod engines, and vice versa. There are some other particular differences internally like certain parts heat treated differently but I usually focus on what I just said most often. Just like I had previously mentioned, the only real big difference between the 4R70W's and the AOD-E's are the different bellhousings. The reason why I make mention of the different bellhousing bolt patterns and not bother with defining the difference between the AOD-E and the AOD-EW is because the bolt pattern governs what applications that particular tranny can be used for where as the different planetary gear ratio may affect certain things, in terms of preference, it surely does not govern a persons ability to use them in any particular vehicle or engine.

 

[Dan Whitaker]

I think we have officially hi-jacked this thread. Nice work guys.

Hell we hijacked it a long tme ago.
Spas won't mind. She's probably soaking in the fine info we have been posting

 

[rocket 5979]

So am I hearing this right? Explorers didn't have the 4R70W? 4R70W's are only on Modulars?

Technically yes that is right. But like I said before, the differences between the two trannies can be counted on one hand. Similar enough where people confuse them on a daily basis but different enough to matter.

 

[410Fortune]

? Rocket I just dont get it Ford calls the transmission in 5.0L Explorer's the 4r70w but you dont?
I mean I understand that it changed again for the 4.6L and 5.4L but FORD calls it a 4r70w, which we all know is th esame as a AOD-EW so ????
My trans builder calls it a 4r70w it says 4r70w on it and Ford calls it a 4r70w but you dont?

Jefe the shift pattern is the same as an AODE any cable shifter with the same pattern (PRND21) should work 100%

 

[Turdle]

The Technician at Art Carr called mine a 4R70W when I ordered my torque converter and valve body kit

 

[410Fortune]

if it walks like a duck.....

 

['97 V8]

this is for spas's benefit , so when stack 4x4 says theyre twin stick t-case fits an AOD-E, it would fit our 4r70w(or whatever you wanna call it)?

 

[rocket 5979]

? Rocket I just dont get it Ford calls the transmission in 5.0L Explorer's the 4r70w but you dont?
I mean I understand that it changed again for the 4.6L and 5.4L but FORD calls it a 4r70w, which we all know is th esame as a AOD-EW so ????
My trans builder calls it a 4r70w it says 4r70w on it and Ford calls it a 4r70w but you dont?

Jefe the shift pattern is the same as an AODE any cable shifter with the same pattern (PRND21) should work 100%

Whatever you want to think bro. You can call it what you want but I know the differences. There are many companies that misuse their own terminology and it sticks. I told you the differences but you still debate it so whatever. You keep calling it whatever you want to call it and I will call it by its correct nomenclature.

 

[Dan Whitaker]

Why can't we have a discussion with out someone getting a case of the ass about it?