Ditch the Double Cardan? Driveline E-Brake, Atlas II into Ranger Dilemma

[Tbars4]

...I'm getting ready to throw the Atlas in the Ranger but the output is for a standard u-joint and I have the Double Cardan on the Ranger..

..Since it is a std. cab the shaft is a little shorter but I wanted some opinions on whether or not to keep it..:scratch:

..The truck flex's a lot with the shorter wheelbase and I am concerned there may be some bindage if I ditch the Double Cardan..

..I do have an excellent driveline shop that works on race Rangers that are usually linked extra cabs with longer w.b. that will build me whatever I want for the output and shaft..

...Any and all suggestions and links on this is appreciated while I'm also shopping for hockey pucks....TIA

 

[turboexplorer]

My understanding is that most double cardan joints don't have a sharper operating range just a smoother operation within that range since its split between two joints not just 1. So if it was say 14* angle each joint in the double cardan would do 7*. Also in a standard u joint configuration shaft, the whole shaft speeds up and slows down several times a rotation because of the cardan joints and the geometry of how they have to work in an arc. A double cardan joint does that speed up and slow down within itself (if the shaft is set up right, pinion side u joint at near 0*) therefore little less vibration that way as well since that speed up and slow down acceleration is amplified the steeper the angle gets. Anyways that's the reason most use double cardan joints in steeper applications.

My vote is stay with a double cardan if you drive it on the street since overall driveability will be better and joint life is longer.

Anyways that may or may not be news to you but all that is the reason behind staying with a double cardan.

 

[rookieshooter]

An example of when to use a Dbl cardane. Let's say that your pinion shaft was pointing straight at the transfer. Or it would be like an imaginary line drawn straight thru the center of the pinion shaft up to the transfer case. And the transfer case is near parallel with the ground. In this application you would want a Dbl cardan.

An example when 2 single u-joints are used. Let's say that the pinion shaft is now pointing a few deg. up about 6deg and the transfer is also pointing down 6 deg., this would take a single joint at each end. Now in the real world it's hard sometimes to get those perfect angles. But give or take a few deg won't hurt anything. In fact it's really not to good on a single joint to have no amount degree change from the pinion. It's hard on the needle bearings. The bearings do not spin around the shaft (trunnion) like they should. There is a fancy word for this if you research it.

 

[Tbars4]

..Those are two pretty much text book answers...

..I just wanted to make sure I didn't miss out on any current options and limit myself...I ordered the new yoke (32 splined) and had to get a different size seal for it but they should both be on the Atlas Monday Morning..

..I am curious as there was RTV on the splines too and I don't see where any fluid is even in that area..


..Getting the Atlas in my Ranger should be by the end of the month I hope..I really would like to find some cheap knobs with the shifter info on them as mine are wore out and advanced adapters wants like $35 a piece..

 

[Happy Jack]

What series double cardan shaft were you going with?

I tried a stock 1210 double cardan in my BII and it did not flex enough and did bind. I was told the 1310 DC had the most flex in stock form and places modify the 1350 DC to have even more but if not done carefully the 1350 DC looses a lot of strength. I am running a 1310 series DC in my BII with a C-5/4 and T&M doubler with 6.5 inches of lift. It is working fine.

 

[Tbars4]

..Stock shaft and it's a 1310 AFAIK..

 

[Rick]

I ditched mine when I went to the Atlas II. I'm running 1350 U-joints on both ends now.

 

[Happy Jack]

The differential pinion will climb a bit when torque is applied. That and the rear axle moving up and down will flex the rear single u-joint enough. Common rule is to set the rear pinion angle a degree or so down from straight in line with the drive shaft. Just depends on how much you want to hammer it. Tom Woods has a lot of info on his web site if you search for Tom Woods drive shafts. That is where I bought mine.

I don't run a boot so that mud and crap won't get packed in it. Many shafts have a plastic coated splines. They will over time wear just like brake pads and rings and such. That is part of my yearly inspection to check the u-joints, bearings, ect.

 

[Rick]

..Getting the Atlas in my Ranger should be by the end of the month I hope..I really would like to find some cheap knobs with the shifter info on them as mine are wore out and advanced adapters wants like $35 a piece..

Mine are in the same shape. If you find a good deal let me know.

 

[Happy Jack]

I guess I should have added that I drive my BII on the street and highway.

 

[Stic-o]

I think you should keep what you have and donate the ATLAS to JP

Honestly I would use this opportunity to upgrade to the 1350 stuff, but then your making the front end stuff the week link. I think you can skip the double cardan. Are you planning to upgrade the front end stuff?

This would be a good opportunity to see the new brackets Zukman picked up to bolt in a 44 TTB front end

 

[Tbars4]

..I'm working on keeping the Dbl Cardan but it's become a PITA..

..I talked to Vic this a.m. over at Advanced Adapters trying to locate the correct yoke to match my current stock driveline set-up and I'm working with my local driveline shop trying to find a square flange yoke for the 32 spline output otherwise it was mentioned as having to be custom made..

..I have faith in the driveline shop and they said they may have located one but I haven't heard back from them yet..

 

[Tbars4]

..Good and bad news..

..They found the one flange around that I need for this, had it shipped in and it is going to cost me about 135 plus the seal (under 13) plus 20 to install it..That's a little over double what I was expecting to pay..

..I know if I can get the p/n's I could shop this around and wait but the good news is, I will have the part numbers and some pictures for those who run across this in the future..

 

[4x4junkie]

I think you'll be happy you went the extra mile for the double-cardan.

I have the stock single-cardan shaft on my longbed Ranger and though it's fine for the most part on the road, I can definitely feel a little vibration at times.
My BII OTOH has the DC and no vibes at all under any circumstances.

Also, I did have to put RTV on the output splines of mine too. Otherwise fluid can wick it's way through there and will spray all over the undercarriage off the flange (or yoke).

 

[Tbars4]

..Thanks for your input as it helped answer both questions for me..

 

[Happy Jack]

My rememberer is slow but a bit more that popped into my head. As far as the splines on the pinion and t-case yokes, my gear guy uses Teflon. The liquid kind and stirs it up well and puts it on the pinion yolk or flange heavy. The t-case ones I have used have a rubber o-ring. I used a rear 9" with a low pinion. I had trouble with my first ring and pinion set with regular gear oil. The pinion angle on my BII is really high. I switched to 140w90 on this set and it seems to be doing well. The pinion on the 8.8 is a bit higher and helps with this some. Might have just been a bad gear set or the light oil on the first set. No way to know for sure. If you end up with your rear pinion pointing up at a high angle to line up with the DS consider the heavier oil.

 

[Tbars4]

..I have been busy and only have time to do a quick post..

..I missed posting this but I do have the 1310 on the front and did have the 1350 set up on the rear..

..I did find and install the proper flange and seal on the rear for the Double Cardan so that is all good...

..While it is still out of the truck I should have already but will be installing a new seal on the front as I'm sure it's ok but a new seal would last a lot longer...

..When I get that seal in I'll update with part numbers for all of this..

 

[Tbars4]

...A little late but I'm now looking for a transfer case E-brake if anyone knows where to get one at a decent price...

..I know Advanced Adapters, PartsMike, and High Angle Driveline have them for about $375 plus tax but hopefully I can find a used set-up or come up with a build idea...:scratch:

 

[rookieshooter]

...A little late but I'm now looking for a transfer case E-brake if anyone knows where to get one at a decent price...

..I know Advanced Adapters, PartsMike, and High Angle Driveline have them for about $375 plus tax but hopefully I can find a used set-up or come up with a build idea...:scratch:

Same goes for me. Might just have to spring for one from the places you mentioned. I'll check on some roundy round race sites and see what they got also.

 

[Tbars4]

..After some more reading up on this, it seems the price I quoted is only part of the cost..

..The few companies that sell this brake kit also have (or leave you to purchase) their specific flange/yoke ($100 plus), brake cable bracket, bolts, etc..

..I'm going to have to contact Vic when I get a chance and verify if the Flange I have already works with their kit...If it does I'll probably use them rather than have to buy a different flange for the other kits..