p1309 HELP

[CheapThrillEX]

Okay back story first...

Purchased a 1998 Explorer 5.0L for my wife. Engine was bad. No compression on Cyl #1. Story I got was PO was towing a small trailer up a hill when it began to run rough so he hammered the throttle and it popped and then ran horrible. So I purchased truck, pulled engine apart and found the culprit.

Cyl#1 as suspected was damaged. You can see the chunks of piston missing. So I purchased a used good motor from a 2000 Explorer. Treated it as a long block and reused my intakes and all sensors etc.. other then the crank sensor and balancer as those numbers interchange with a 98 5.0L. Installed the motor and about 150 miles later I got a p1309 code. Then soon followed with two O2 sensor codes. I cleared the codes and was fine for another 150 miles. Light returns same codes. Then it started the early morning chirps. So I pulled the cam sensor and syncro out and sure enough spinning the snycro in my hand I can feel the rough spot and chirp. So I purchased a new syncro and sensor from Napa (dorman) which came with the tool. Turned the crank with finger over #1 till air pushed back and then brought it up to align the balancer and pointer at 0. Positioned alignment tool on syncro and dropped into hole with the arrow facing the direct forward on the tool. Put the cam sensor pack on the syncro. Reinstalled everything. Drove the truck for 10 miles to bring it up operating temp and everything, hooked a Modis Scan tool up to it and ran the KOER test and came back clean no codes or faults. Thinking things were on the up and up. Wife came and picked up the truck and calls 20 minutes later and the light is back on and I got the P1309 code again then later came the two o2 codes again.

Now I am getting slightly concerned with this Cam sensor issue being the condition of the OE motor I pulled out and the face I cannot seem to shake this code. I do not have the truck with me at work today but plan to run the HD40 test below when I get a chance. but looking for any advice, it doesn't seem as cut and dry to me that the pcm is just bad sense I already have the new syncro and sensor in the truck.

 

[Turdle]

Verify the sensor is even turning.
The dorman replacement will break the shear pin on the drive gear soon after replacing. A search will show this to be true.

x6stringerx has a great cam sensor post.

 

[CheapThrillEX]

I read that thread earlier when I searched before I posted. I have not pulled the cam sensor back off to verify the drive is spinning due to the problem with the Check engine being no different before/after it was replaced. but when I get a chance I will verify it. when I replaced the OE syncro I was hoping to getg both problems at the same time, the check engine light and the chirp, I only got the chirp fixed.

 

[X6StringerX]

HERE I AM!!!

I started reading your post and had already decided that I was going to refer you to my thread and then I scrolled down and saw that Jon beat me to it and then that you had already read it anyway, lol.

I would highly recommend that you order a new Motorcraft camshaft synchronizer. I deal almost exclusively with Steve of Tousley Ford. Aside from being a forum vendor, their prices are amazing. I can't remember if I mentioned it in my thread, but my local dealership wanted $150+ for the synchro and I ended up paying less than $80 shipped from Tousley. I'm not sure how many other posts you've read here on EF, but off the top of my head, I know Stic-O also had some issues with a Dorman unit for his 4.0. If you Google "Dorman camshaft synchronizer problems", your jaw will likely hit the floor. It is a manufacturing technique problem that plagues all of their synchronizers from what I can tell. The number of problems reported on the poorly manufactured Dorman units is absolutely astonishing. I'm amazed that a company would continue to produce such an inferior part when the problem is well documented on just about every automotive forum out there.

As for the o2 sensor issue, I really can't help you there. I'm an advanced novice at best when it comes to working on engines, lol. Give this thread a little more time and I'm sure some others will chime in with where to go from here. With that being said, I think we'll all be in agreeance about the Dorman unit though.

 

[96eb96]

Yeah, the Dorman sync unit is notoriously bad for other models too. I don't know how they stay in business with products like that.

 

[Turdle]

OK, since the main issue with the dorman replacement is a small pin, I called the product developer and informed them of the issue. They want to see all information we have, so could you guys please throw it all into this thread and I will link him in here.

Thanks!

 

[CheapThrillEX]

I just logged off IATN and am going to try unplugging my DPFE as I still have the aluminum housing sensor and read that it can throw off the cam sensor and set a 1309 code.

I understand the issue with the pin and the dorman syncro, but I do not beleive that to be my issue with my light. However known the less I will check it out and see into replacing it with an oe drive.

 

[CheapThrillEX]

I just got off the phone with my vendor and they have the syncro for $84 my cost.

 

[CheapThrillEX]

Alright stole the truck from the wife today....

Verified my syncro is still spinning so my pin didn't break. As well rolled the motor up to TDC on the compression and verified O on the timing mark, then even double checked it with the crankshaft position sensor on the number 5 tooth from the gap and they line up. Dropped my tool down onto the syncro and its fits like it should.

So I then probed Pin 85 and 103 at the ECM and I have voltage switch up/down while cranking as I beleive I should. So seems everything is pointing to the ECM. I did unplug the DPFE per IATN's tech suggestions to see if the code duplicates over the next few days. I cannot swag the cost of the ecm right now so I have a few days to see what happens.

 

[Turdle]

Just so you are aware
I think the pats system and ignition switch need replaced as a set with the pcm or a trip to the dealer is in order.

 

[CheapThrillEX]

Yes a reprogram is in order with replacement. One of my vendors is Fox Ford out of Grand Rapids, MI.

 

[CheapThrillEX]

My shop has an account with IATN (International Automotive Technicians Network).

A member posted a different method of verifying cam timing, while I did his method and it checked out to be in correct time, i thought I would share this other method for reference if somebody else searched this code and needed help.


Hi John, don't you love this business!!! I have some input for you hope it helps. 1. Set #1 to TDC on compression stroke. 2. Backprobe DB/O wire on CMP. Should be near or at 0 volts. 3. Check relationship of crank sensor (CKP)and tone ring. Rotate engine in normal direction of rotation by hand while watching DVOM. Should see batt voltage between 2nd and 3rd tooth of tone ring pass on crank. 4. If voltage does not properly change, set crank so 2.5 teeth have passed CKP from TDC. Loosen cam syncro and rotate it until you see voltage on DB/O wire to show batt voltage then tighten down. 5. Disconnect neg batt term for minium of 10 minutes then reconnect and road test for relearn. During road test, accelerate between 40MPH & 65MPH WITHOUT touching brake, three times. If code does not come back you are all good! Also the DPFE sensors have been updated from ford to a black plastic BUT, There are different ones depending on the calibration code (on LH door sticker) so you might want to double check that. Also, since the motor was replaced, make sure the harness' are not too close to the coils and/or alternator because they can cause interferance and, lets face it we all know how much of a pain it is to get EVERY harness back in its home 100% when you are dealing with a motor R&R. One last thing. Don't forget the basics!!!. If this was a junkyard motor why was it in the junkyard? Just make sure the timing chain is in good shape and not streched or misaligned. Good luck! P.s If you are 100% positive everything is aligned correctly, the relearn procedure may cure it all.

 

[CheapThrillEX]

I unplugged my DPFE yesterday and drove 25 miles home, then later drove 50 miles to a meeting, then 50 miles home from the meeting and have yet to reset the P1309 Code. Just the P1401 which is expected from the DPFE being unplugged.

 

[CheapThrillEX]

Well scanned the truck last night, and only code was the DPFE 1401 code. Looks like I am gonna go and buy a new dpfe later this week and install and see what happens.

 

[armyeng1]

Cam Shaft Sensor problem

My shop has an account with IATN (International Automotive Technicians Network).

A member posted a different method of verifying cam timing, while I did his method and it checked out to be in correct time, i thought I would share this other method for reference if somebody else searched this code and needed help.


Hi John, don't you love this business!!! I have some input for you hope it helps. 1. Set #1 to TDC on compression stroke. 2. Backprobe DB/O wire on CMP. Should be near or at 0 volts. 3. Check relationship of crank sensor (CKP)and tone ring. Rotate engine in normal direction of rotation by hand while watching DVOM. Should see batt voltage between 2nd and 3rd tooth of tone ring pass on crank. 4. If voltage does not properly change, set crank so 2.5 teeth have passed CKP from TDC. Loosen cam syncro and rotate it until you see voltage on DB/O wire to show batt voltage then tighten down. 5. Disconnect neg batt term for minium of 10 minutes then reconnect and road test for relearn. During road test, accelerate between 40MPH & 65MPH WITHOUT touching brake, three times. If code does not come back you are all good! Also the DPFE sensors have been updated from ford to a black plastic BUT, There are different ones depending on the calibration code (on LH door sticker) so you might want to double check that. Also, since the motor was replaced, make sure the harness' are not too close to the coils and/or alternator because they can cause interferance and, lets face it we all know how much of a pain it is to get EVERY harness back in its home 100% when you are dealing with a motor R&R. One last thing. Don't forget the basics!!!. If this was a junkyard motor why was it in the junkyard? Just make sure the timing chain is in good shape and not streched or misaligned. Good luck! P.s If you are 100% positive everything is aligned correctly, the relearn procedure may cure it all.

I just changed my cam sensor on my 1999 ford explorer sport 4.0ltr OHV, the light went out but then came on again, I was told that this v6 was junk and that even the slightest change in timing chain or or sprocket will cause this light to come on. what is the importance of this cam sensor anyways, what does it do, my engine worked with it unplugged for a long time.